A plan for Jacob

Discussion in 'C Programming' started by Everyman, Sep 23, 2007.

  1. Everyman

    Everyman Guest

    I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.

    Just imagine the view a new poster gets of the group: he asks a
    question, receives several answers of varying degrees of helpfulness,
    and then somewhere along the line Jacob interjects an asinine comment
    and the thread degenerates into a sprawling and acrimonious war of
    words: people pointing out (for the nth time) why Jacob is wrong, while
    he steadfastly refuses to admit any error in anything he says and at the
    same time turns up the emotional heat with acerbic personal attacks on
    the regulars here.

    Look down a list of recent topics: thread after thread has been hijacked
    by Jacob to promote one of his eccentric pet ideas about how C should be
    "improved" by removing the essential traits that make it C; or
    propaganda for his compiler; or a refusal to distinguish between C and
    extensions in lcc-win32; or just plain unprovoked verbal aggression
    against one of his bugbears (chief amongst them Richard Heathfield, even
    though he hasn't posted a response to Jacob for months now).

    The only roughly comparable situation in my experience was at sci.math a
    few years ago, when a delusional crank called James Harris took over
    lots of threads with claims to have an elementary proof of Fermat's Last
    Theorem. That was resolved amicably: all parties (including Harris)
    agreed that posts by and about Harris and his strange ideas would be
    tagged JSH in the subject line, so that they could easily be filtered
    out.

    Unfortunately, while it would be obvious to anyone with a brain the size
    of a cherry tomato that Harris's ramblings were nonsensical, in this
    group there's a real danger that if no one corrects Navia then
    non-experts might absorb even his more egregious errors. The more one
    reads Jacob's posts, the more one realizes how little he knows,
    understands or cares about the C language, but at first glance he does
    manage to project the image of someone speaking with authority,
    especially because of his wretched compiler project.

    The best solution I can currently think of is this: someone could create
    a webpage describing (completely rationally, with no emotive language)
    why Jacob's unique view of C is not to be trusted, and explaining how
    new readers can killfile him in popular newsreaders. Then an automated
    bot could post a followup to each of Jacob's posts with a link to this
    URL. This would allow regular posters to safely killfile Jacob: and if
    no one is reading his insults then no one will feel compelled to respond
    to them: and all in all the signal-noise ratio of the group will jump.

    Do other people think this might be a workable solution? Or is there a
    better idea?
    Everyman, Sep 23, 2007
    #1
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  2. Everyman

    Ian Collins Guest

    Everyman wrote:
    > I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    > situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    >

    Humbug.
    >
    > Do other people think this might be a workable solution? Or is there a
    > better idea?
    >

    Use your killfile.

    --
    Ian Collins.
    Ian Collins, Sep 23, 2007
    #2
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  3. Everyman

    Doug Guest

    Everyman wrote:

    <snip>

    It's very unfortunate what's happened to clc over the last few months,
    going back a couple of years now.

    I'm afraid I don't see it as the 'Jacob situation', though. It takes
    two to tango, and from where I'm standing the insults heading toward
    Jacob are far worse than those heading away.

    I agree that Jacob makes mistakes, and I agree that he gets
    defensive. But I've seen very little that would justify the behaviour
    toward him I see in this group. Although his defensiveness is
    something *he* should work on, I think the way criticisms are
    delivered here leaves a lot to be desired - and seem at times
    deliberately designed to provoke him.

    So I would say 'no' - writing such a page would say more about you
    than Jacob. If you did write such a page, I'd probably read it during
    a compile, but only for amusement value - which is the same reason I'm
    here, there's little real technical discussion in this group these
    days.

    Doug
    Doug, Sep 23, 2007
    #3
  4. Everyman

    Guest

    On Sep 23, 9:20 pm, Everyman <> wrote:

    >
    > Do other people think this might be a workable solution?


    No, it is unnecessary at best. I believe in forming an opinion on a
    person, like in real life, based on my experiences with that person,
    and not through second-hand gossip and opinions from people who may
    have an agenda. You need to trust that most people are capable of
    forming their own opinions of others. And if they don't like them,
    the intelligent person will ignore them. If you really want to make
    the world a better place, give money to a charity.

    Regards,
    B.
    , Sep 23, 2007
    #4
  5. Everyman

    Richard Guest

    Doug <> writes:

    > Everyman wrote:
    >
    > <snip>
    >
    > It's very unfortunate what's happened to clc over the last few months,
    > going back a couple of years now.
    >
    > I'm afraid I don't see it as the 'Jacob situation', though. It takes
    > two to tango, and from where I'm standing the insults heading toward
    > Jacob are far worse than those heading away.
    >
    > I agree that Jacob makes mistakes, and I agree that he gets
    > defensive. But I've seen very little that would justify the behaviour
    > toward him I see in this group. Although his defensiveness is
    > something *he* should work on, I think the way criticisms are
    > delivered here leaves a lot to be desired - and seem at times
    > deliberately designed to provoke him.


    I would agree. The nasty elitism that exists in this NG is second to
    none. And there are 3 or 4 posters directly responsible for that. Keith
    Thompson tends to remain level headed and true to the language whereas
    there are a few others who constantly resort to petty sniping and
    jibes. If all someone can reply is something "Read the f**king FAQ" then
    they shouldn't be here in the first place.

    >
    > So I would say 'no' - writing such a page would say more about you
    > than Jacob. If you did write such a page, I'd probably read it during
    > a compile, but only for amusement value - which is the same reason I'm
    > here, there's little real technical discussion in this group these
    > days.


    Come now, that's not true.

    >
    > Doug
    Richard, Sep 23, 2007
    #5
  6. Everyman

    pete Guest

    [ot]Re: A plan for Jacob

    Everyman wrote:
    >
    > I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    > situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    >
    > Just imagine the view a new poster gets of the group: he


    .... sees that Jacob has an anonymous stalker.

    --
    pete
    pete, Sep 23, 2007
    #6
  7. In article <>,
    Richard's H's sockpuppet <> wrote:
    >I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    >situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.


    blather deleted
    Kenny McCormack, Sep 23, 2007
    #7
  8. Everyman <> writes:
    > I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    > situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.

    [...]

    Fight fire with gasoline, eh?

    --
    Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
    San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
    "We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
    Keith Thompson, Sep 23, 2007
    #8
  9. In article <>,
    Everyman <> wrote:
    >I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    >situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.


    I do.

    -- Richard
    --
    "Consideration shall be given to the need for as many as 32 characters
    in some alphabets" - X3.4, 1963.
    Richard Tobin, Sep 23, 2007
    #9
  10. Everyman

    Eric Sosman Guest

    Everyman wrote:
    > I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    > situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    > [...]


    Agreed. When cowardly twits feel free to launch anonymous
    attacks, we have a crisis. And you, you pusillanimous piece of
    pseudonymous pigeon poop, are it.

    --
    Eric Sosman
    lid
    Eric Sosman, Sep 23, 2007
    #10
  11. Everyman

    John Smith Guest

    Everyman wrote:

    <snip twaddle>

    > Do other people think this might be a workable solution? Or is there a
    > better idea?
    >


    LEAVE JACOB ALONE!!

    BTW, James S. Harris is still around, still solving hard
    problems, and just as entertaining as ever.

    JS
    John Smith, Sep 23, 2007
    #11
  12. In article <>,
    Eric Sosman <> wrote:
    >Everyman wrote:
    >> I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    >> situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    >> [...]

    >
    > Agreed. When cowardly twits feel free to launch anonymous
    >attacks, we have a crisis. And you, you pusillanimous piece of
    >pseudonymous pigeon poop, are it.


    While I certainly don't disagree with your sentiments, isn't it obvious
    to one and all that "Everyman" is a Richard H. sockpuppet?
    Kenny McCormack, Sep 23, 2007
    #12
  13. On Sep 23, 9:36 pm, (Kenny McCormack)
    wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Eric Sosman <> wrote:
    >
    > >Everyman wrote:
    > >> I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    > >> situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    > >> [...]

    >
    > > Agreed. When cowardly twits feel free to launch anonymous
    > >attacks, we have a crisis. And you, you pusillanimous piece of
    > >pseudonymous pigeon poop, are it.

    >
    > While I certainly don't disagree with your sentiments, isn't it obvious
    > to one and all that "Everyman" is a Richard H. sockpuppet?


    No; it's obvious that he's a troll trying to stir up more off-topic
    nonsense and trouble here. My immediate assumption was that he is you,
    Kenny.
    J. J. Farrell, Sep 23, 2007
    #13
  14. "Kenny McCormack" <> wrote in message
    > In article <>,
    > Eric Sosman <> wrote:
    >>Everyman wrote:
    >>> I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    >>> situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    >>> [...]

    >>
    >> Agreed. When cowardly twits feel free to launch anonymous
    >>attacks, we have a crisis. And you, you pusillanimous piece of
    >>pseudonymous pigeon poop, are it.

    >
    > While I certainly don't disagree with your sentiments, isn't it obvious
    > to one and all that "Everyman" is a Richard H. sockpuppet?
    >

    I doubt it. Not Heathfield's style.

    --
    Free games and programming goodies.
    http://www.personal.leeds.ac.uk/~bgy1mm
    Malcolm McLean, Sep 23, 2007
    #14
  15. Kenny McCormack wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Eric Sosman <> wrote:
    >> Everyman wrote:
    >>> I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    >>> situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    >>> [...]

    >> Agreed. When cowardly twits feel free to launch anonymous
    >> attacks, we have a crisis. And you, you pusillanimous piece of
    >> pseudonymous pigeon poop, are it.

    >
    > While I certainly don't disagree with your sentiments, isn't it obvious
    > to one and all that "Everyman" is a Richard H. sockpuppet?


    No. There is little to suggest that. Are you sure he's not Kenny McC.
    trying once again to stir the pot with his anti-social trolling?
    Martin Ambuhl, Sep 23, 2007
    #15
  16. Martin Ambuhl wrote:
    > Kenny McCormack wrote:
    >> In article <>,
    >> Eric Sosman <> wrote:
    >>> Everyman wrote:
    >>>> I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    >>>> situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.
    >>>> [...]
    >>> Agreed. When cowardly twits feel free to launch anonymous
    >>> attacks, we have a crisis. And you, you pusillanimous piece of
    >>> pseudonymous pigeon poop, are it.

    >>
    >> While I certainly don't disagree with your sentiments, isn't it obvious
    >> to one and all that "Everyman" is a Richard H. sockpuppet?

    >
    > No. There is little to suggest that. Are you sure he's not Kenny McC.
    > trying once again to stir the pot with his anti-social trolling?
    >


    What is your C question ???

    --
    +----------------------------------------------------------------+
    | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net |
    +----------------------------------------------------------------+
    Charles Richmond, Sep 24, 2007
    #16
  17. In article <>,
    J. J. Farrell <> wrote:
    ....
    >No; it's obvious that he's a troll trying to stir up more off-topic
    >nonsense and trouble here. My immediate assumption was that he is you,
    >Kenny.


    That doesn't make any sense. I *like* Jacob's posts. I think they are
    intelligent, thoughtful, and worthwhile. Why would I post otherwise?

    And, on the other side, who else here besides RH has such a clear-cut
    hard-on (in the stalker sense) for Jacob?
    Kenny McCormack, Sep 24, 2007
    #17
  18. Everyman

    Doug Guest

    On 23 Sep, 13:05, Richard <> wrote:
    > Doug <> writes:


    <snip>

    > > So I would say 'no' - writing such a page would say more about you
    > > than Jacob. If you did write such a page, I'd probably read it during
    > > a compile, but only for amusement value - which is the same reason I'm
    > > here, there's little real technical discussion in this group these
    > > days.

    >
    > Come now, that's not true.


    Yeah, fair enough. The board seems to be ok at the moment, and i
    remember some good recent discussions about type punning and em...

    I'd just like clc to lay off the j-baiting. It causes more noise than
    it's worth, it doesn't achieve anything. I really think that some
    people do it just for a rise. Let's face it, some of us come back
    here to see what'll happen next.

    Anyways, the regulars here have been through a rough period in the
    past and want to keep things strictly on-topic. New posters, and some
    other regulars and non-regulars don't know this rule or don't follow
    it strictly.

    I think some slack should be cut in light of recent events. In the
    words of Jack Nicholson, just before he was melted by a Martian, "why
    can't we all just get along?"

    I do come here primarily for the technical info (although above I
    claim there's little here these days) and every now and then there is
    something worth reading.

    And I should point out that I rarely post technical answers because I
    know there are others here who can answer better than I, and they will
    get to you. Although I'll take a shot of there's nothing from the
    floor after a while. (A secondary consideration is that I don't want
    to get involved in an all-too-common flame war.)

    Bed,
    Doug
    Doug, Sep 24, 2007
    #18
  19. "J. J. Farrell" <> writes:
    > On Sep 23, 9:36 pm, (Kenny McCormack)
    > wrote:

    [SNIP]
    > No; it's obvious that he's a troll trying to stir up more off-topic
    > nonsense and trouble here. My immediate assumption was that he is you,
    > Kenny.


    Please don't feed the trolls. Responding to Kenny only encourages
    him.

    --
    Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
    San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
    "We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
    Keith Thompson, Sep 24, 2007
    #19
  20. Everyman

    Jack Klein Guest

    On Sun, 23 Sep 2007 13:20:52 +0200 (CEST), Everyman
    <> wrote in comp.lang.c:

    > I don't think it's too much of an exaggeration to say that the Jacob
    > situation is reaching crisis proportions for clc.


    I take it you weren't around a decade or so ago in the Scott Nudds
    days. You have no idea what a crisis in clc is.

    --
    Jack Klein
    Home: http://JK-Technology.Com
    FAQs for
    comp.lang.c http://c-faq.com/
    comp.lang.c++ http://www.parashift.com/c -faq-lite/
    alt.comp.lang.learn.c-c++
    http://www.club.cc.cmu.edu/~ajo/docs/FAQ-acllc.html
    Jack Klein, Sep 24, 2007
    #20
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