Android

Discussion in 'Java' started by Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 17, 2011.

  1. Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting past
    layout.

    --
    Dirk

    http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 17, 2011
    #1
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  2. Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

    Arne Vajhøj Guest

    On 16-01-2011 22:24, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    > Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    > I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting past
    > layout.


    See:
    http://developer.android.com/resources/community-groups.html

    But an Android programming question (assuming SDK not NDK) would
    be on topic as well.

    Arne
     
    Arne Vajhøj, Jan 17, 2011
    #2
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  3. On 17/01/2011 13:49, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    > On 16-01-2011 22:24, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >> Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    >> I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting past
    >> layout.

    >
    > See:
    > http://developer.android.com/resources/community-groups.html
    >
    > But an Android programming question (assuming SDK not NDK) would
    > be on topic as well.
    >
    > Arne
    >


    It's just stupid stuff really.
    Like I wanted to use Absolute Layout but find its deprecated.
    So I want to be able to drag and drop button on *some* layout, but can't
    find out how to do it.

    Or, what's the equivalent of a list box? I want a list of items to
    scroll through and a couple of buttons for up, down, ok etc? But can't
    find a list box (ListView???) that will drag onto whatever Layout etc

    I am trying to port some simple existing Java s/w to Android

    --
    Dirk

    http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 17, 2011
    #3
  4. On 17/01/2011 17:21, Steve Sobol wrote:
    > In article<>,
    > says...
    >>
    >> On 17/01/2011 13:49, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    >>> On 16-01-2011 22:24, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >>>> Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    >>>> I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting past
    >>>> layout.
    >>>
    >>> See:
    >>> http://developer.android.com/resources/community-groups.html
    >>>
    >>> But an Android programming question (assuming SDK not NDK) would
    >>> be on topic as well.
    >>>
    >>> Arne
    >>>

    >>
    >> It's just stupid stuff really.
    >> Like I wanted to use Absolute Layout but find its deprecated.

    >
    > Yeah, the use of that type of layout is not encouraged in Java desktop
    > software either.
    >
    >> So I want to be able to drag and drop button on *some* layout, but can't
    >> find out how to do it.

    >
    > I'm finding that the most flexible layout, for many purposes, is a
    > RelativeLayout. You don't generally want to use absolute layouts when
    > you are not targeting a specific device. ("OK, am I on a 4.3" smartphone
    > or a 7" or 10" tablet?" If you use an absolute layout you may have to
    > make some adjustments for each device.)
    >
    >
    >> Or, what's the equivalent of a list box? I want a list of items to
    >> scroll through and a couple of buttons for up, down, ok etc? But can't
    >> find a list box (ListView???) that will drag onto whatever Layout etc

    >
    > ListView is what you want, IIRC.


    Yes - but the Eclipse drag and drop seems unworkable.
    Clearly I'm doing something wrong, but its not obvious what.
    A lot of the examples I see start of with how the XML should be edited.
    That's a bit like designing websites using Notepad.

    --
    Dirk

    http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 17, 2011
    #4
  5. On 17/01/2011 19:27, Steve Sobol wrote:
    > In article<>,
    > says...
    >
    >
    >> Yes - but the Eclipse drag and drop seems unworkable.
    >> Clearly I'm doing something wrong, but its not obvious what.

    >
    > Follow up to this post. Switch to XML view, copy and paste the raw XML
    > into your followup and I'll take a look at it.
    >
    > I do acknowledge that the Android GUI editor is rather weird sometimes.
    >
    >> A lot of the examples I see start of with how the XML should be edited.
    >> That's a bit like designing websites using Notepad.

    >
    > Which, sometimes, I do. :) (Notepad++ on Windows, emacs on Linux)
    >
    > But yeah, for GUI's, drag and drop is definitely preferable.
    >
    >

    Eclipse with the Android SDK is a primitive nightmare compared to
    Netbeans and Java SDK

    --
    Dirk

    http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 19, 2011
    #5
  6. On 17/01/2011 13:49, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    > On 16-01-2011 22:24, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >> Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    >> I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting past
    >> layout.

    >
    > See:
    > http://developer.android.com/resources/community-groups.html
    >
    > But an Android programming question (assuming SDK not NDK) would
    > be on topic as well.
    >
    > Arne
    >


    What's with the use of underscore, and banning capitals?
    Is there a rationale for it, or just enforced nostalgia?

    Dirk
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 21, 2011
    #6
  7. Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

    Lew Guest

    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    > What's with the use of underscore, and banning capitals?
    > Is there a rationale for it, or just enforced nostalgia?


    How would that be nostalgic?

    Now, requiring underscores and upper case could be seen as nostalgic, but
    lower-case?

    --
    Lew
    Ceci n'est pas une pipe.
     
    Lew, Jan 21, 2011
    #7
  8. Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

    Arne Vajhøj Guest

    On 21-01-2011 06:26, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    > On 17/01/2011 13:49, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    >> On 16-01-2011 22:24, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >>> Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    >>> I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting past
    >>> layout.

    >>
    >> See:
    >> http://developer.android.com/resources/community-groups.html
    >>
    >> But an Android programming question (assuming SDK not NDK) would
    >> be on topic as well.


    > What's with the use of underscore, and banning capitals?


    Where do you see that?

    Arne
     
    Arne Vajhøj, Jan 21, 2011
    #8
  9. On 21/01/2011 15:24, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    > On 21-01-2011 06:26, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >> On 17/01/2011 13:49, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    >>> On 16-01-2011 22:24, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >>>> Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    >>>> I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting
    >>>> past
    >>>> layout.
    >>>
    >>> See:
    >>> http://developer.android.com/resources/community-groups.html
    >>>
    >>> But an Android programming question (assuming SDK not NDK) would
    >>> be on topic as well.

    >
    >> What's with the use of underscore, and banning capitals?

    >
    > Where do you see that?
    >
    > Arne


    Defining resources eg names of buttons, colors etc.

    Dirk
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 21, 2011
    #9
  10. Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

    markspace Guest

    On 1/21/2011 7:33 AM, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:

    > Defining resources eg names of buttons, colors etc.



    Some file systems on which Java is implemented may not be case sensitive
    (Windows) so you couldn't determine the difference between two resources
    thisone and thisOne -- the file system would not see a difference.

    Ditto with underscores, file systems may not support them, so they can't
    be used reliable.

    If you're talking about Android specifically, I'd say it's for the same
    reason: basically just the lowest common denominator. I'd guess not all
    Android implementations could be relied to support those features, so
    they had to cut them out.
     
    markspace, Jan 21, 2011
    #10
  11. On 21/01/2011 17:06, markspace wrote:
    > On 1/21/2011 7:33 AM, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >
    >> Defining resources eg names of buttons, colors etc.

    >
    >
    > Some file systems on which Java is implemented may not be case sensitive
    > (Windows) so you couldn't determine the difference between two resources
    > thisone and thisOne -- the file system would not see a difference.
    >
    > Ditto with underscores, file systems may not support them, so they can't
    > be used reliable.
    >
    > If you're talking about Android specifically, I'd say it's for the same
    > reason: basically just the lowest common denominator. I'd guess not all
    > Android implementations could be relied to support those features, so
    > they had to cut them out.
    >

    Well, I certainly had not come across that on Netbeans using Java SDK.
    In fact, the problem surfaced when I tried to port over some resources
    eg icon names to Eclipse/Android

    Its a real uphill struggle developing for Android, certainly compared
    with doing iPhone/iPad stuff. Google really needs to put some serious
    effort into the development tools.

    --
    Dirk

    http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 22, 2011
    #11
  12. Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

    The Frog Guest

    Have you tried App Inventor <sarcasm> ?

    Cheers

    The Frog
     
    The Frog, Jan 24, 2011
    #12
  13. On 24/01/2011 10:17, Mark wrote:
    > On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 18:45:23 +0000, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >> On 17/01/2011 17:21, Steve Sobol wrote:
    >>> In article<>,
    >>> says...
    >>>>
    >>>> On 17/01/2011 13:49, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    >>>>> On 16-01-2011 22:24, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax wrote:
    >>>>>> Can anyone point me to a group for supernoob android developers?
    >>>>>> I'm using eclipse SDK plugin, and having real problems even getting past
    >>>>>> layout.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> See:
    >>>>> http://developer.android.com/resources/community-groups.html
    >>>>>
    >>>>> But an Android programming question (assuming SDK not NDK) would
    >>>>> be on topic as well.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Arne
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> It's just stupid stuff really.
    >>>> Like I wanted to use Absolute Layout but find its deprecated.
    >>>
    >>> Yeah, the use of that type of layout is not encouraged in Java desktop
    >>> software either.
    >>>
    >>>> So I want to be able to drag and drop button on *some* layout, but can't
    >>>> find out how to do it.
    >>>
    >>> I'm finding that the most flexible layout, for many purposes, is a
    >>> RelativeLayout. You don't generally want to use absolute layouts when
    >>> you are not targeting a specific device. ("OK, am I on a 4.3" smartphone
    >>> or a 7" or 10" tablet?" If you use an absolute layout you may have to
    >>> make some adjustments for each device.)
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> Or, what's the equivalent of a list box? I want a list of items to
    >>>> scroll through and a couple of buttons for up, down, ok etc? But can't
    >>>> find a list box (ListView???) that will drag onto whatever Layout etc
    >>>
    >>> ListView is what you want, IIRC.

    >>
    >> Yes - but the Eclipse drag and drop seems unworkable.
    >> Clearly I'm doing something wrong, but its not obvious what.
    >> A lot of the examples I see start of with how the XML should be edited.
    >> That's a bit like designing websites using Notepad.

    >
    > The tools are rather crude still, but I prefer to edit the XML
    > directly as it gives you more control and is more transparent. There
    > is a difficult learning curve to get started with Android but, for an
    > experienced programmer, you should be up and running soon.
    >
    > For general help stackoverflow is good and there's plenty of stuff on
    > the official google site. There are quite a few gaps in the
    > documentation, but hopefully this will improve soon.


    I'm hacking the XML.
    Should have my first app, a replacement for an MS RC6 remote control,
    running in a day or so.

    --
    Dirk

    http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 24, 2011
    #13
  14. Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Jan 24, 2011
    #14
  15. Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

    The Frog Guest

    I was looking for similar bootstrapping into the Android dev world as
    Dirk is and stumbled across App Inventor. Its an interesting idea if
    it can be furthered from its already astonishing (to me anyway)
    beginnings. I am wondering if that is where all Googles development
    effort is being directed in terms of SDKs. It is great for kids and I
    have seen some rather surprising apps developed with it, but IMO it
    needs work still to be able to develop truly complex applications.

    I could not for example imagine creating a spreadsheet (from scratch)
    with App Inventor, but can think of a number of approaches one might
    take using Java. And I am sure there are many other examples. Still,
    it is an interesting toy.

    Cheers

    The Frog
     
    The Frog, Jan 25, 2011
    #15
  16. In message <ihcefd$7bc$-september.org>, markspace wrote:

    > Ditto with underscores, file systems may not support them, so they can't
    > be used reliable.


    Which present day filesystems don’t support underscores?
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 4, 2011
    #16
  17. On 03-02-2011 20:46, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > In message<ihcefd$7bc$-september.org>, markspace wrote:
    >> Ditto with underscores, file systems may not support them, so they can't
    >> be used reliable.

    >
    > Which present day filesystems don’t support underscores?


    MVS dataset ??

    Arne
     
    Arne Vajhøj, Feb 4, 2011
    #17
  18. In message <4d4c8dae$0$23758$>, Arne Vajhøj wrote:

    > On 03-02-2011 20:46, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >
    >> In message<ihcefd$7bc$-september.org>, markspace wrote:
    >>> Ditto with underscores, file systems may not support them, so they can't
    >>> be used reliable.

    >>
    >> Which present day filesystems don’t support underscores?

    >
    > MVS dataset ??


    Given that the original restriction seemed to be about the names of GUI
    resources, limitations of MVS hardly seem relevant to that, somehow.
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 4, 2011
    #18
  19. On 04-02-2011 18:49, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > In message<4d4c8dae$0$23758$>, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    >> On 03-02-2011 20:46, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>> In message<ihcefd$7bc$-september.org>, markspace wrote:
    >>>> Ditto with underscores, file systems may not support them, so they can't
    >>>> be used reliable.
    >>>
    >>> Which present day filesystems don’t support underscores?

    >>
    >> MVS dataset ??

    >
    > Given that the original restriction seemed to be about the names of GUI
    > resources, limitations of MVS hardly seem relevant to that, somehow.


    The original question was about Android. And I am sure that
    Android support on MVS is really lousy.

    But the original question was about why underscores were being
    used instead of capitalization, so I assumed the discussion
    has broadened a bit.

    Arne
     
    Arne Vajhøj, Feb 5, 2011
    #19
  20. On 05/02/2011 00:54, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    > On 04-02-2011 18:49, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >> In message<4d4c8dae$0$23758$>, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
    >>> On 03-02-2011 20:46, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>>> In message<ihcefd$7bc$-september.org>, markspace wrote:
    >>>>> Ditto with underscores, file systems may not support them, so they
    >>>>> can't
    >>>>> be used reliable.
    >>>>
    >>>> Which present day filesystems don’t support underscores?
    >>>
    >>> MVS dataset ??

    >>
    >> Given that the original restriction seemed to be about the names of GUI
    >> resources, limitations of MVS hardly seem relevant to that, somehow.

    >
    > The original question was about Android. And I am sure that
    > Android support on MVS is really lousy.
    >
    > But the original question was about why underscores were being
    > used instead of capitalization, so I assumed the discussion
    > has broadened a bit.
    >
    > Arne


    Broadened to "why enforced rules on naming resources in Android that do
    not exist in other Java environments"

    --
    Dirk

    http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology
     
    Dirk Bruere at NeoPax, Feb 5, 2011
    #20
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