Best Practice for page coding

[Justin.Voelker]

Hello Everyone:

I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website, www.Base2WebDesign.com has a simple
layout. The reason for my posting here is that when you visit a page
on the site for the first time, the whole site flashes to a blank
white background then loads the page. When returning to that page
later, it loads just fine. As you can see from the site, the black/
blue top bar, the links on the side, and the gray background do not
ever change. What would be the best practice for loading a page such
as this (since almost all of my development involves this same idea of
a very static look to a page, but different content in the "main
body." I currently use php and use includes to include the top and
bottoms of the pages since they are the same. Should not be doing
this? Is there an easier way to have those pieces of the page stay
exactly where they are without having to reload/request them from the
server each time? Thank you so much for your help!!!

 

[dorayme]

Hello Everyone:

I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website, www.Base2WebDesign.com has a simple
layout. The reason for my posting here is that when you visit a page
on the site for the first time, the whole site flashes to a blank
white background then loads the page.

If that is the reason, there is nothing to worry about. In fact,
it does not do this on any of my browsers on my broadband
connection.

What would be the best practice for loading a page such
as this (since almost all of my development involves this same idea of
a very static look to a page, but different content in the "main
body." I currently use php and use includes to include the top and
bottoms of the pages since they are the same. Should not be doing
this? Is there an easier way to have those pieces of the page stay
exactly where they are without having to reload/request them from the
server each time?

In respect to the php, this seems fine and is as good a practice
if not better, all things considered, than any other.

 

[andrew]

Hello Everyone:

I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website, www.Base2WebDesign.com has a simple
layout.

[...]

Hello Justin,

A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:

<!-- The source code and design of this website remain
property of the developer and any reproduction, modification,
distribution, transmission, republication or display of said items
without prior written consent of the developer is strictly prohibited
unless otherwise stated. -->

and I was a little curious about your thoughts in placing this in your
site? I guess I am asking about effectiveness, enforceability and even
adviseability of placing such declarations.

Andrew

 

[al jones]

Hello Everyone:

I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website, www.Base2WebDesign.com has a simple
layout.

[...]

Hello Justin,

A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:

<!-- The source code and design of this website remain
property of the developer and any reproduction, modification,
distribution, transmission, republication or display of said items
without prior written consent of the developer is strictly prohibited
unless otherwise stated. -->

and I was a little curious about your thoughts in placing this in your
site? I guess I am asking about effectiveness, enforceability and even
adviseability of placing such declarations.

Andrew

Off the cuff here, since it's not displayed and not in the proper format
per copyright specs -enforcibility would probably be zilch!

I was more amused by the fixed width which 'flutters' back and forth as one
page is long enough to force a vertical scroll bar while the others aren't
(on my display of course...)

 

[Justin Voelker]

Hello Everyone:

I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website,www.Base2WebDesign.comhas a simple
layout.

[...]

Hello Justin,

A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:

<!-- The source code and design of this website remain
property of the developer and any reproduction, modification,
distribution, transmission, republication or display of said items
without prior written consent of the developer is strictly prohibited
unless otherwise stated. -->

and I was a little curious about your thoughts in placing this in your
site? I guess I am asking about effectiveness, enforceability and even
adviseability of placing such declarations.

Andrew

The copyright piece was actually left in there from another website
that I developed for a customer. Will it stand up in court? No.
Will an issue ever get that far? Probably not. It was just a small
piece of mind sort of thing so they would hopefully look at it and say
"ok, I can't give away this code."

 

[Justin Voelker]

On 2 Apr 2007 08:46:02 -0700

Hello Everyone:
I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website,www.Base2WebDesign.comhas a simple
layout.

[...]

Hello Justin,

A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:

and I was a little curious about your thoughts in placing this in your
site? I guess I am asking about effectiveness, enforceability and even
adviseability of placing such declarations.

Andrew

Off the cuff here, since it's not displayed and not in the proper format
per copyright specs -enforcibility would probably be zilch!

I was more amused by the fixed width which 'flutters' back and forth as one
page is long enough to force a vertical scroll bar while the others aren't
(on my display of course...)

I develop using firefox and IE and I have implemented a "fix" that
displays the vertical scroll bar in firefox even if one is not
necessary to stop that exact shift. And it IE, the bar is always
there anyways. I would be interested to know what browser you were
using to determine why this solution was not working in that
particular browser. Also, if you have a fix for that sideways shift
that you have used that works on all browsers (more so than the fix I
have already used) I would appreciate your sharing it. Thanks!

 

[Chaddy2222]

On 2 Apr 2007 08:46:02 -0700
"Justin.Voelker" <[email protected]> wrote:

Hello Everyone:

I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website,www.Base2WebDesign.comhas a simple
layout.

[...]

Hello Justin,

A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:

<!-- The source code and design of this website remain
property of the developer and any reproduction, modification,
distribution, transmission, republication or display of said items
without prior written consent of the developer is strictly prohibited
unless otherwise stated. -->

and I was a little curious about your thoughts in placing this in your
site? I guess I am asking about effectiveness, enforceability and even
adviseability of placing such declarations.

Andrew

Off the cuff here, since it's not displayed and not in the proper format
per copyright specs -enforcibility would probably be zilch!

I was more amused by the fixed width which 'flutters' back and forth as one
page is long enough to force a vertical scroll bar while the others aren't
(on my display of course...)

I develop using firefox and IE and I have implemented a "fix" that
displays the vertical scroll bar in firefox even if one is not
necessary to stop that exact shift. And it IE, the bar is always
there anyways. I would be interested to know what browser you were
using to determine why this solution was not working in that
particular browser. Also, if you have a fix for that sideways shift
that you have used that works on all browsers (more so than the fix I
have already used) I would appreciate your sharing it. Thanks!

He already gave you the answer to the problem. If you can't work out
why it is the case with the scroll bars, then you probably should not
be chargeing people for web design work.
To give you a hint, your site does not fit on smaller view ports. Oh
and you should also not be useing fixxed font-sizes as IE6 users can't
re-size them and more to the point, it will make your design break in
ways that you don't want. In fact the only thing you should specify in
a fixxed size is images and borders around parts of a page.

 

[Justin Voelker]

46:02 -0700
Hello Everyone:
I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website,www.Base2WebDesign.comhasa simple
layout.
[...]
Hello Justin,
A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:
<!-- The source code and design of this website remain
property of the developer and any reproduction, modification,
distribution, transmission, republication or display of said items
without prior written consent of the developer is strictly prohibited
unless otherwise stated. -->
and I was a little curious about your thoughts in placing this in your
site? I guess I am asking about effectiveness, enforceability and even
adviseability of placing such declarations.
Andrew
Off the cuff here, since it's not displayed and not in the proper format
per copyright specs -enforcibility would probably be zilch!
I was more amused by the fixed width which 'flutters' back and forth as one
page is long enough to force a vertical scroll bar while the others aren't
(on my display of course...)

I develop using firefox and IE and I have implemented a "fix" that
displays the vertical scroll bar in firefox even if one is not
necessary to stop that exact shift. And it IE, the bar is always
there anyways. I would be interested to know what browser you were
using to determine why this solution was not working in that
particular browser. Also, if you have a fix for that sideways shift
that you have used that works on all browsers (more so than the fix I
have already used) I would appreciate your sharing it. Thanks!

He already gave you the answer to the problem. If you can't work out
why it is the case with the scroll bars, then you probably should not
be chargeing people for web design work.
To give you a hint, your site does not fit on smaller view ports. Oh
and you should also not be useing fixxed font-sizes as IE6 users can't
re-size them and more to the point, it will make your design break in
ways that you don't want. In fact the only thing you should specify in
a fixxed size is images and borders around parts of a page.

I thank you for your comments Chaddy. As per your recommendation I
will change the fixed font sizes so they can be resized in IE6.
However, I will not change the fixed-width of the page. My page can
be viewed on an 800x600 monitor just fine and I am currently not
concerned with anything smaller. Is that the right choice? Maybe
not. Is it my choice to not design websites that fit every possible
screen resolution that someone might have on a 15 year old "view
port"? Absolutely.

 

[Chaddy2222]

46:02 -0700
"Justin.Voelker" <[email protected]> wrote:

Hello Everyone:

I have numerous website, each one with slightly better html coding
practices. What I am looking for is the "best practice" sort of page
design. My newest website,www.Base2WebDesign.comhasa simple
layout.

[...]

Hello Justin,

A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:

<!-- The source code and design of this website remain
property of the developer and any reproduction, modification,
distribution, transmission, republication or display of said items
without prior written consent of the developer is strictly prohibited
unless otherwise stated. -->

and I was a little curious about your thoughts in placing this in your
site? I guess I am asking about effectiveness, enforceability and even
adviseability of placing such declarations.

Off the cuff here, since it's not displayed and not in the proper format
per copyright specs -enforcibility would probably be zilch!

I was more amused by the fixed width which 'flutters' back and forth as one
page is long enough to force a vertical scroll bar while the others aren't
(on my display of course...)
I develop using firefox and IE and I have implemented a "fix" that
displays the vertical scroll bar in firefox even if one is not
necessary to stop that exact shift. And it IE, the bar is always
there anyways. I would be interested to know what browser you were
using to determine why this solution was not working in that
particular browser. Also, if you have a fix for that sideways shift
that you have used that works on all browsers (more so than the fix I
have already used) I would appreciate your sharing it. Thanks!

He already gave you the answer to the problem. If you can't work out
why it is the case with the scroll bars, then you probably should not
be chargeing people for web design work.
To give you a hint, your site does not fit on smaller view ports. Oh
and you should also not be useing fixxed font-sizes as IE6 users can't
re-size them and more to the point, it will make your design break in
ways that you don't want. In fact the only thing you should specify in
a fixxed size is images and borders around parts of a page.

I thank you for your comments Chaddy. As per your recommendation I
will change the fixed font sizes so they can be resized in IE6.
However, I will not change the fixed-width of the page. My page can
be viewed on an 800x600 monitor just fine and I am currently not
concerned with anything smaller. Is that the right choice? Maybe
not. Is it my choice to not design websites that fit every possible
screen resolution that someone might have on a 15 year old "view
port"? Absolutely.

Fine.
You should probably remember then that Mobile devices don't always
have very good scrolling functions.
PDA's and mobile phones are becomeing more and more popular and so you
still need to think about how your site looks below 600PX, you should
at least make sure that all content is visible at such low
resolutions.

 

[Chris F.A. Johnson]

I thank you for your comments Chaddy. As per your recommendation I
will change the fixed font sizes so they can be resized in IE6.
However, I will not change the fixed-width of the page. My page can
be viewed on an 800x600 monitor just fine and I am currently not
concerned with anything smaller. Is that the right choice? Maybe
not. Is it my choice to not design websites that fit every possible
screen resolution that someone might have on a 15 year old "view
port"? Absolutely.

I design my pages so that they work in any size of window because
I'm lazy. It takes more work to create a fixed-width page than a
flexible one.

 

[Bergamot]

Is it my choice to not design websites that fit every possible
screen resolution that someone might have on a 15 year old "view
port"? Absolutely.

You are apparently assuming that everyone uses full-size browser
windows. That's an incorrect assumption.

My screen size is 1600x1200 but my browser window takes a little less
than half the width, and the full height. Thus I get horizontal
scrollbars on your site *plus* a vertical scrollbar even with a big
empty space at the bottom of the page. To me, that looks amateurish.

If you did a little research, you might discover you can have a flexible
design that adapts to browser settings like mine as well as those
running full screen on monitors 800px wide and up. Look up "max-width".
For a 2-column layout such as yours, max-width:45em could do quite well.

 

[Bergamot]

Berg, Thank you for your comments.

Justin, please post to the group. If you want a private consultation
with me, I'll have to bill you for it.

I have it coded to always show the
vertical bar (in Firefox) because I absolutely hate the page shift
that happens when you go from a page that needs one to a page that
doesn't.

I bet most users don't care. You could ask some if you really want to
know. Personally, I find the superfluous vertical scrollbar more
annoying. It makes me think there should be something farther down the
page so it looks broken when I don't find anything there.

If you know of a better way to stop that page shift,

You can always just ignore it.

Next, I love the idea of a max-width but
for some reason I recall that and min-width not working the same way
in Firefox and IE.

IE7 supports max-width, though it isn't perfect. There are JavaScript
methods to get it to work in earlier versions. I'm sure a few minutes
searching google you'll find out how.

Also on that topic, what do I do about the image
that contains my slogan at the top?

Why should you do anything special there? The banner is not one big
graphic, but 2 separate ones on a solid color background.

Also, what about the "contact us" form.

textarea {width:100%}

BTW, if you're really looking for best practices, you should stop with
all the divs and start using more semantic HTML. Using real heading
markup would be a good place to start, then list markup for the
navigation menu. See
http://css.maxdesign.com.au/listamatic/

 

[Toby A Inkster]

A little sideways of your question: I noticed a copyright
declaration in your source code:

And this appears to "strictlt prohibit" the viewing the website (as that
is a "display of" the "source code and design") without "prior written
consent of the developer".

--
Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
Contact Me ~ http://tobyinkster.co.uk/contact
Geek of ~ HTML/SQL/Perl/PHP/Python*/Apache/Linux

* = I'm getting there!