browser list

[Jeff Thies]

Anyone have a list of modern browsers that are in circulation?

Any that aren't in the Moz, IE, Safarai, Opera?
family?

Any that don't support javascript DOM manipulation?

Jeff

 

[Whitecrest]

Anyone have a list of modern browsers that are in circulation?
Any that aren't in the Moz, IE, Safarai, Opera?
family?
Any that don't support javascript DOM manipulation?

I forget the thread, but Toby listed all the ones he has, and it was a
pretty extensive list.

 

[Dylan Parry]

Anyone have a list of modern browsers that are in circulation?

Try: http://www.download.com/sort/3150-2356-0-1-1.html?

They have just about every browser under the sun! 114 in total. Okay, so
most of them probably have 1 person sitting in dark room as their user
base, and a lot I imagine are MSIE in disguise, but it does give you an
idea just how many browsers there are

 

[Toby A Inkster]

I forget the thread, but Toby listed all the ones he has, and it was a
pretty extensive list.

Here's what I have, as a pipe-seperated table:

OS|Browser|Screen|Release Year|Rendering Engine|Key Browser?|Computer
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Amaya (GTK) 7.0|1280x1024x24|2002|Other||ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Cello 1.01a|1024x768x24|1994|Other||polonius
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Dillo 0.8.0pre|1280x1024x24|2003|Other||ophelia
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|ELinks 0.9.1|80x24x4|2003|Text||ophelia
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Epiphany 1.0.7|1280x1024x24|2003|Gecko||ophelia
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Galeon 1.3.12|1280x1024x24|2003|Gecko||ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|HotJava 3.0|1024x768x24|1999|Other||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 1|Internet Explorer 2.0|640x320x8|1995|Trident||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 1|Internet Explorer 3.02|640x320x8|1996|Trident||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 3|Internet Explorer 4.01|800x600x24|1997|Trident||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Internet Explorer 5.01|800x600x24|1998|Trident|key|polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Internet Explorer 5.5|800x600x24|2000|Trident|key|polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Internet Explorer 6.0|1024x768x24|2001|Trident|key|polonius
Linux (Mandrake 9.2)|Konqueror 3.1.4|1024x768x24|2003|KHTML|key|polonius
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Links 2.1pre13|80x24x4|2003|Text||ophelia
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Lynx 2.8.5|80x24x4|2004|Text|key|ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Mosaic 0.6 Beta|1024x768x24|1992|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Mosaic 1.0|1024x768x24|1993|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Mosaic 2.1.1|1024x768x24|1996|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Mosaic 3.0|1024x768x24|1997|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Mozilla 1.0.2|1024x768x24|2002|Gecko||polonius
Linux (Mandrake 9.2)|Mozilla 1.4|1024x768x24|2003|Gecko|key|polonius
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Mozilla 1.6|1280x1024x24|2004|Gecko||ophelia
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Mozilla Firebird 0.6.1|1280x1024x24|2003|Gecko||ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Mozilla Firefox 0.8|1024x768x24|2004|Gecko||polonius
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Nautilus 2.4.2|1280x1024x24|2003|GtkHTML||ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 1.1|1024x768x24|1995|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 2.02|1024x768x24|1996|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 3.04 Gold|1024x768x24|1996|Mosaic||polonius
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Netscape 4.8|1280x1024x24|1997|Mosaic||ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 4.8|1024x768x24|2002|Mosaic|key|polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 6.23|1024x768x24|2002|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 7.1|1024x768x24|2003|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|OffByOne 3.4.a|1024x768x24|2002|Other||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 2.12|1024x768x24|1997|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 3.62|1024x768x24|1999|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 5.12|1024x768x24|2000|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 6.06|1024x768x24|2001|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 7.03|1024x768x24|2003|Presto|key|polonius
Linux (Mandrake 9.2)|Opera 7.23|1024x768x24|2003|Presto||polonius
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|Opera 7.5|1280x1024x24|2004|Presto||ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|UdiWWW 1.2.000|1024x768x24|1996|Other||polonius
Linux (Mandrake 10.0)|w3m 0.4.2|80x24x4|2003|Text||ophelia
Windows NT 4 SP 6|WebTV Viewer 2.8|1024x768x24|2003|Other||polonius

Almost all of the above can be downloaded from http://browsers.evolt.org/

I also have Opera 7.51 for Linux and Dillo 0.7.3 at work. On top of what I
have, other browsers that I'd *like* to have in my arsenal are a few
Mac-only browsers (e.g. IE/mac, Safari, iCab) and a few paid browsers that
I've not gotten round to buying (e.g. HPR).

I also have the source code for Arena, which is Amaya's predecessor, and
for Tim Berners Lee's original WWW browser (which apparently won't compile
on any modern operating system)

 

[Mark Parnell]

Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 6.23|1024x768x24|2002|Mosaic||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Netscape 7.1|1024x768x24|2003|Mosaic||polonius

And there I was thinking NS6+ was Gecko...

Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 2.12|1024x768x24|1997|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 3.62|1024x768x24|1999|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 5.12|1024x768x24|2000|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 6.06|1024x768x24|2001|Opera||polonius
Windows NT 4 SP 6|Opera 7.03|1024x768x24|2003|Presto|key|polonius

Opera didn't start using Presto until v7? Or they just changed the name?

 

[Steve Pugh]

Opera didn't start using Presto until v7? Or they just changed the name?

Opera 7 is a whole new engine, called Presto.

Steve

 

[Mark Parnell]

Opera 7 is a whole new engine, called Presto.

That's what I was wondering. Thanks.

 

[Toby A Inkster]

And there I was thinking NS6+ was Gecko...

Silly me.

 

[Thomas Mlynarczyk]

One (possibly stupid) question: If my pages look perfect on a browser using
engine X, can I assume that it will look perfect on any browser using engine
X?

 

[Whitecrest]

One (possibly stupid) question: If my pages look perfect on a browser using
engine X, can I assume that it will look perfect on any browser using engine
X?

No, depending on my settings I can make it look different on the same
machine using the same browser.

Now if the question was can I assume it looks "pretty much" the same
on the overwhelming majority of the people that visit, then the
answer is yes.

 

[C A Upsdell]

No, depending on my settings I can make it look different on the same
machine using the same browser.

Now if the question was can I assume it looks "pretty much" the same
on the overwhelming majority of the people that visit, then the
answer is yes.

But only if coded to the standards. A page may look perfectly fine with
browser X if it depends on that browser's quirks, but may break badly on
another browser. A page that is coded to the standards is more likely to be
rendered as expected on other browsers.

Even so, this does not mean that you should not test with other browsers: a
good test suite is essential.

 

[Toby A Inkster]

One (possibly stupid) question: If my pages look perfect on a browser using
engine X, can I assume that it will look perfect on any browser using engine
X?

No, you can't assume that. You must take into account that different
browsers using the same rendering engine:

1. might use different *versions* of the rendering engine
(Netscape 6.0 uses a very early version of Gecko, so it's not
always going to behave the same as the latest Moz;

2. might make slight changes to the underlying code of the rendering
engine (Firefox has some subtle differences from the main branch
of Gecko); and

3. may rely on underlying operating system functions so will vary
from OS to OS (e.g. form controls on Safari and Konqueror. Fonts
in Opera 7.5 on Linux vs Windows)

 

[Thomas Mlynarczyk]

Also sprach Toby A Inkster:

different
browsers using the same rendering engine:

1. might use different *versions* of the rendering engine
(Netscape 6.0 uses a very early version of Gecko, so it's not
always going to behave the same as the latest Moz;

2. might make slight changes to the underlying code of the rendering
engine (Firefox has some subtle differences from the main branch
of Gecko); and

3. may rely on underlying operating system functions so will vary
from OS to OS (e.g. form controls on Safari and Konqueror. Fonts
in Opera 7.5 on Linux vs Windows)

Thanks Toby. So the same engine (on the same OS) merely makes it more likely
that the output will be the same.

 

[Thomas Mlynarczyk]

Also sprach C A Upsdell:

Even so, this does not mean that you should not test with other
browsers: a good test suite is essential.

How's that for a test suite (on Windows 98SE, 2000 and XP):

NN4.76
NN6
NN7
Moz1.1
Moz1.6
OP5
OP6
OP7beta1
OP7beta2
IE4
IE5.0
IE5.5
IE6.0
Amaya
Lynx

and iCapture for Screenshots from Safari. (Pages validate as HTML 4.01
Strict.)

Anything essential missing? (Except for non-Windows browsers, of course, but
here things get complicated...)

 

[C A Upsdell]

Also sprach C A Upsdell:


How's that for a test suite (on Windows 98SE, 2000 and XP):

NN4.76
NN6
NN7
Moz1.1
Moz1.6
OP5
OP6
OP7beta1
OP7beta2
IE4
IE5.0
IE5.5
IE6.0
Amaya
Lynx

and iCapture for Screenshots from Safari. (Pages validate as HTML 4.01
Strict.)

Anything essential missing? (Except for non-Windows browsers, of course, but
here things get complicated...)

If you're going to test with NN4, you should also use 4.08 (a lot of NN4
people use this), and you may want to consider testing with NN4.80 rather
than 4.79.

Opera 7.51 is available.

And of course there is the MSN-TV (WebTV) emulator for Windows.

See http://www.upsdell.com/BrowserNews/find.htm to find these.

 

[Steve Pugh]

How's that for a test suite (on Windows 98SE, 2000 and XP):

OP7beta1
OP7beta2

Testing in old betas is pointless, any user who continues to use beta
software after a full release is out has to expect to take the rough
with the smooth.

Testing in betas for versions that aren't yet released is tricky - are
you seeing a real problem or one that will be fixed in the full
release?

Opera is up 7.51, test in that.
If you want to test in more than one 7.x version I'd recommend 7.23.
If you really want to test to excess than add 7.11 and a 7.03.

Steve

 

[Whitecrest]

But only if coded to the standards. A page may look perfectly fine with
browser X if it depends on that browser's quirks, but may break badly on
another browser. A page that is coded to the standards is more likely to be
rendered as expected on other browsers.

Well again yes and no, I agree the more standards you follow the
better your chances of it performing the same way on multiple
browsers, but from another thread look at www.target.com. By no means
does that follow any standards, but it looks the same on the majority
of the worlds browsers.

Even so, this does not mean that you should not test with other browsers: a
good test suite is essential.

Unless the client needs additional testing we test on IE and Mozilla,
and more often than not, Opera. The overwhelming majority of the
world uses one of these. And should issues arise we fix them in that
same order.

 

[Toby A Inkster]

I agree the more standards you follow the better your chances of it
performing the same way on multiple browsers,

Who are you and what have you done with the real Whitecrest? ;-)

 

[Thomas Mlynarczyk]

Also sprach C A Upsdell:

If you're going to test with NN4, you should also use 4.08 (a lot of
NN4 people use this), and you may want to consider testing with
NN4.80 rather than 4.79.

Are the differences between those 3 version that important? If I write a
special style sheet for NN4, avoiding anything that is supposed to cause
problems with NN4 in general?

And of course there is the MSN-TV (WebTV) emulator for Windows.

Ah, yes, once I had that one installed and for some reason I didn't quite
like it. How important is testing on MSN-TV?

See http://www.upsdell.com/BrowserNews/find.htm to find these.

Thanks, I will have a look there.

 

[Thomas Mlynarczyk]

Also sprach Steve Pugh:

Testing in old betas is pointless, any user who continues to use beta
software after a full release is out has to expect to take the rough
with the smooth.

When I installed the betas, they were the latest things available Time
for an update, I guess. But then: if my page is valid, if it displays okay
on "all" the other browsers and in the OPbeta - can't I be quite sure it
will be okay in the "real" version too? I suppose if anything is to be
changed in the beta before it becomes the final release, then it should be
fixing bugs and if my page does not rely on bugs...?

Testing in betas for versions that aren't yet released is tricky - are
you seeing a real problem or one that will be fixed in the full
release?

No, so far I couldn't see any real problem.

Opera is up 7.51, test in that.
If you want to test in more than one 7.x version I'd recommend 7.23.
If you really want to test to excess than add 7.11 and a 7.03.

Do Opera users usually update to have the latest version? Shouldn't I rather
use the "most commonly used" version? Do I still need to worry about OP<5?