Can you recommend any C programming books?

Discussion in 'C Programming' started by omar khan, Oct 31, 2005.

  1. omar khan

    omar khan Guest

    Any books that helped you progress in C programming?

    Where do you begin with C programming?

    Can you recommend any websites?

    How many months or years did it take you to become knowledge to write
    software?
    omar khan, Oct 31, 2005
    #1
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  2. omar khan

    ajm Guest

    read the reference manual (Haribson / Steele) and take a look at the
    CFAQ when you run into problems. many think you should be reading K&R
    too.

    start programming early, C is a contact sport and it doesn't help to
    get buried in books.

    how long it is going to take depends entirely on you ;)
    ajm, Oct 31, 2005
    #2
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  3. omar khan

    omar khan Guest

    "ajm" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > read the reference manual (Haribson / Steele) and take a look at the
    > CFAQ when you run into problems. many think you should be reading K&R
    > too.
    >
    > start programming early, C is a contact sport and it doesn't help to
    > get buried in books.
    >
    > how long it is going to take depends entirely on you ;)
    >


    K&R yes, I have that eBook. : -).

    It is rather confusing to begin with, however the only way to get better at
    programming is to practice, practice, practice coding and writing as many
    programs.

    It will probably take me a year to get to the level to write the software,
    at the advanced stage maybe 2. Remember I have have got many ideas to
    startup, but programming skills need to improve. ;-)
    omar khan, Oct 31, 2005
    #3
  4. omar khan a écrit :
    > K&R yes, I have that eBook. : -).


    It's an felony to have such a copy. The K&R is a paper book and it is on
    sale. Copies are illegal. Here is a free e-book:

    http://publications.gbdirect.co.uk/c_book/

    --
    C is a sharp tool
    Emmanuel Delahaye, Oct 31, 2005
    #4
  5. omar khan

    Jordan Abel Guest

    On 2005-10-31, Emmanuel Delahaye <> wrote:
    > omar khan a écrit :
    >> K&R yes, I have that eBook. : -).

    >
    > It's an felony to have such a copy. The K&R is a paper book and it is on
    > sale. Copies are illegal. Here is a free e-book:


    Copyright violation of that magnitude is not generally a felony.
    Also, if he also had a paper copy [though he did not indicate such]
    there may be some jurisdictions in which it is not illegal to also
    have an electronic copy no matter what the source. Under traditional
    copyright law, receiving an illegal copy of a work may not itself be
    copyright violation at all.

    But, seriously - it's not that expensive - just buy it. it's less
    than US$40 new and well worth it.

    >
    > http://publications.gbdirect.co.uk/c_book/
    >
    Jordan Abel, Oct 31, 2005
    #5
  6. omar khan

    Greg Comeau Guest

    In article <bOl9f.27620$>,
    omar khan <> wrote:
    >Any books that helped you progress in C programming?
    >
    >Where do you begin with C programming?
    >
    >Can you recommend any websites?


    http://www.comeaucomputing.com/booklist

    >How many months or years did it take you to become knowledge to write
    >software?


    I started programming in high school I think in 1978, and
    I'm still learning. It takes many people a _good_ 6 months
    to shake out the sillies and a good year to be in "beginner mode".
    --
    Greg Comeau / Celebrating 20 years of Comeauity!
    Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
    World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
    Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware's Libraries... Have you tried it?
    Greg Comeau, Oct 31, 2005
    #6
  7. omar khan

    Skarmander Guest

    Emmanuel Delahaye wrote:
    > omar khan a écrit :
    >
    >> K&R yes, I have that eBook. : -).

    >
    >
    > It's an felony to have such a copy.

    <snip>

    No, it's not. It's not even a felony to make and distribute them.
    Without delving into the legalese too much, "felony" is a word reserved
    for grave criminal offenses (for suitable values of "grave"). Copyright
    violation is not one of them in any legal system I know of.

    Even so it's typically illegal to make and distribute copies without
    permission, but not to simply own them. This is disregarding the
    morality of the thing, of course, which I'll mercifully leave untouched.

    Pardon the off-topic pedantry, but misconceptions about copyright are
    too common and relevant these days to ignore.

    S.
    Skarmander, Oct 31, 2005
    #7
  8. In article <43665625$0$11073$4all.nl>,
    Skarmander <> wrote:
    >Without delving into the legalese too much, "felony" is a word reserved
    >for grave criminal offenses (for suitable values of "grave"). Copyright
    >violation is not one of them in any legal system I know of.


    The US Digital Millenium Copyright Act introduced a new offence
    of "criminal copyright violation" in instances where the value of
    the copied work exceeded a certain value (and the limit is low enough
    to include most name-brand commercial items whilst excluding
    most personal writings and home businesses.)

    Canada does not use the word 'felony', so technically nothing here is
    a felony under Canadian law. Copyright violation falls under
    the Copyright Act, not under Canada Criminal Code, but the Copyright Act
    provides for up to 5 years in prison per copyright violation offence.
    When I searched the Considated Statutes And Regulations, I was unable
    to find any information about what classes of offences in Canada result in
    "a criminal record".
    --
    Okay, buzzwords only. Two syllables, tops. -- Laurie Anderson
    Walter Roberson, Oct 31, 2005
    #8
  9. omar khan

    omar khan Guest

    "Greg Comeau" <> wrote in message
    news:dk5941$p0s$...
    > In article <bOl9f.27620$>,
    > omar khan <> wrote:
    > >Any books that helped you progress in C programming?
    > >
    > >Where do you begin with C programming?
    > >
    > >Can you recommend any websites?

    >
    > http://www.comeaucomputing.com/booklist
    >
    > >How many months or years did it take you to become knowledge to write
    > >software?

    >
    > I started programming in high school I think in 1978, and
    > I'm still learning. It takes many people a _good_ 6 months
    > to shake out the sillies and a good year to be in "beginner mode".
    > --
    > Greg Comeau / Celebrating 20 years of Comeauity!
    > Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
    > World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
    > Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware's Libraries... Have you tried it?


    Thats almost four decades of experience?!?!, surely by now you would be able
    to write many thousands or millions of lines of code alone or as part of a
    team of programmers?
    omar khan, Oct 31, 2005
    #9
  10. omar khan

    Coos Haak Guest

    Op Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:03:28 GMT schreef omar khan:

    > "Greg Comeau" <> wrote in message
    > news:dk5941$p0s$...
    >> In article <bOl9f.27620$>,
    >> omar khan <> wrote:
    >>>Any books that helped you progress in C programming?
    >>>
    >>>Where do you begin with C programming?
    >>>
    >>>Can you recommend any websites?

    >>
    >> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/booklist
    >>
    >>>How many months or years did it take you to become knowledge to write
    >>>software?

    >>
    >> I started programming in high school I think in 1978, and
    >> I'm still learning. It takes many people a _good_ 6 months
    >> to shake out the sillies and a good year to be in "beginner mode".
    >> --
    >> Greg Comeau / Celebrating 20 years of Comeauity!
    >> Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
    >> World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
    >> Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware's Libraries... Have you tried it?

    >
    > Thats almost four decades of experience?!?!, surely by now you would be able
    > to write many thousands or millions of lines of code alone or as part of a
    > team of programmers?


    What planet do you live on? 246 days a year is nice! How many holidays do
    you folks have?
    --
    Coos
    Coos Haak, Oct 31, 2005
    #10
  11. omar khan

    Skarmander Guest

    Walter Roberson wrote:
    > In article <43665625$0$11073$4all.nl>,
    > Skarmander <> wrote:
    >
    >>Without delving into the legalese too much, "felony" is a word reserved
    >>for grave criminal offenses (for suitable values of "grave"). Copyright
    >>violation is not one of them in any legal system I know of.

    >
    >
    > The US Digital Millenium Copyright Act introduced a new offence
    > of "criminal copyright violation" in instances where the value of
    > the copied work exceeded a certain value (and the limit is low enough
    > to include most name-brand commercial items whilst excluding
    > most personal writings and home businesses.)
    >
    > Canada does not use the word 'felony', so technically nothing here is
    > a felony under Canadian law. Copyright violation falls under
    > the Copyright Act, not under Canada Criminal Code, but the Copyright Act
    > provides for up to 5 years in prison per copyright violation offence.
    > When I searched the Considated Statutes And Regulations, I was unable
    > to find any information about what classes of offences in Canada result in
    > "a criminal record".


    Yes, the DMCA did introduce a new class of offence beyond the common
    breach of civil law and heightened the penalties on a few others. In
    some cases and jurisdictions this might push a violation into the range
    of "felony" (those that use "felony" for any crime that is punishable by
    more than a year in prison, for example).

    In any case, it's unlikely that merely owning an illicit copy of a book
    classifies as a serious crime in any jurisdiction, or indeed as a crime
    at all in most, let alone as a felony in those systems that make the
    distinction.

    S.
    Skarmander, Oct 31, 2005
    #11
  12. In article <Q%s9f.22955$>,
    omar khan <> wrote:

    >"Greg Comeau" <> wrote in message
    >news:dk5941$p0s$...
    >> I started programming in high school I think in 1978, and
    >> I'm still learning.


    >Thats almost four decades of experience?!?!,


    Three decades, not four.

    >surely by now you would be able
    >to write many thousands or millions of lines of code alone or as part of a
    >team of programmers?


    I must be 1-3 years older than Greg, and sure I can write a lot of
    code alone or as part of a team of programmers. That doesn't mean
    I'm not still learning about programming. The saying, "There's another
    born every minute" can just about apply to programming languages and
    programming techniques and programming in the context of specific devices.


    As a quick example: I've been working hard with the Cisco PIX Firewall
    ("Security Appliance") for four years, going carefully over its
    documentation, creating reference material, making a nuisance of myself
    to the manufacturer, and deliberately seeking out and answering
    literally thousands of questions so as to increase my understand of
    it. Many people would say that I am a "PIX expert". Even so, I find
    that at best I am able to answer 2 questions out of every 3, because
    there is so much to know. The number of potential configuration
    interactions on a device like the PIX is N factorial, where N is the
    number of features. If the PIX had as few as 10 features, that would
    be over 3 million potential feature interactions. If I had worked
    8 hours a day, 365 days a year, for four years, I would have had
    to have learned a new interaction every 12 seconds in order to know
    all of those interactions by now.
    --
    All is vanity. -- Ecclesiastes
    Walter Roberson, Oct 31, 2005
    #12
  13. Skarmander <> writes:
    [...]
    > In any case, it's unlikely that merely owning an illicit copy of a
    > book classifies as a serious crime in any jurisdiction, or indeed as a
    > crime at all in most, let alone as a felony in those systems that make
    > the distinction.


    Regardless of the legalities, possessing an illicit copy of K&R2 is
    extremely inconsiderate to Mr. Kernighan and Mr. Ritchie. The
    revenues from their book are part of their income; depriving them and
    their publisher of those revenues for the sake of your own convenience
    is rude.

    If they had chosen to make the contents of the book freely available,
    of course, it would be a completely different situation, but they
    haven't done so.

    --
    Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
    San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
    We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this.
    Keith Thompson, Oct 31, 2005
    #13
  14. omar khan

    Greg Comeau Guest

    In article <Q%s9f.22955$>,
    omar khan <> wrote:
    >"Greg Comeau" <> wrote in message
    >news:dk5941$p0s$...
    >> In article <bOl9f.27620$>,
    >> omar khan <> wrote:
    >> >Any books that helped you progress in C programming?
    >> >
    >> >Where do you begin with C programming?
    >> >
    >> >Can you recommend any websites?

    >>
    >> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/booklist
    >>
    >> >How many months or years did it take you to become knowledge to write
    >> >software?

    >>
    >> I started programming in high school I think in 1978, and
    >> I'm still learning. It takes many people a _good_ 6 months
    >> to shake out the sillies and a good year to be in "beginner mode".
    >> Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware's Libraries... Have you tried it?

    >
    >Thats almost four decades of experience?!?!


    Not in earth year it is not. Or if so, they I'm glad to hear
    I'm much younger looking that I actually am (which is good
    because I've been recently thinking the opposite).

    >surely by now you would be able
    >to write many thousands or millions of lines of code alone or as part of a
    >team of programmers?


    I'm sure I've written at least a million functional lines.
    But I don't know how that negates that there is still things to learn. ??
    --
    Greg Comeau / Celebrating 20 years of Comeauity!
    Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
    World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
    Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware's Libraries... Have you tried it?
    Greg Comeau, Oct 31, 2005
    #14
  15. On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:36:08 +0100, in comp.lang.c , Skarmander
    <> wrote:

    >Emmanuel Delahaye wrote:
    >> omar khan a écrit :
    >>
    >>> K&R yes, I have that eBook. : -).

    >>
    >> It's an felony to have such a copy.

    >
    >No, it's not. It's not even a felony to make and distribute them.


    You're assuming that Emmanuel refers to the US definition of felony.
    Given that he's french, this is not guaranteed.

    Also, doesn't the DMCA criminalise copyright violation?
    --
    Mark McIntyre
    CLC FAQ <http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/C-faq/top.html>
    CLC readme: <http://www.ungerhu.com/jxh/clc.welcome.txt>

    ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
    http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
    ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
    Mark McIntyre, Oct 31, 2005
    #15
  16. omar khan

    Skarmander Guest

    Mark McIntyre wrote:
    > On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:36:08 +0100, in comp.lang.c , Skarmander
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Emmanuel Delahaye wrote:
    >>
    >>>omar khan a écrit :
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>K&R yes, I have that eBook. : -).
    >>>
    >>>It's an felony to have such a copy.

    >>
    >>No, it's not. It's not even a felony to make and distribute them.

    >
    >
    > You're assuming that Emmanuel refers to the US definition of felony.
    > Given that he's french, this is not guaranteed.
    >
    > Also, doesn't the DMCA criminalise copyright violation?


    See elsewhere in this thread on the DMCA.

    "Felony" is not exclusively US, but in general English it means "pretty
    serious crime" (if you don't look too closely). It's just too strong a
    term here. I'm not trying to get a language flame going here, mind you.
    If you feel comfortable substituting "crime" and think I'm making too
    sensitive a distinction, then by all means ignore it.

    From what my limited skill in French can gather, "félonie" is certainly
    not what he meant, since that doesn't refer to modern crime at all, but
    to the original meaning of "feudal rebellion/treason". Even if there
    were some cross-cultural/linguistic mixup, I'd still point out that the
    word doesn't seem to mean quite what he wanted it to mean in English.

    S.
    Skarmander, Nov 1, 2005
    #16
  17. omar khan

    Mabden Guest

    "Walter Roberson" <-cnrc.gc.ca> wrote in message
    news:dk5o28$lj$...
    > As a quick example: I've been working hard with the Cisco PIX Firewall
    > ("Security Appliance") for four years, going carefully over its
    > documentation, creating reference material, making a nuisance of

    myself
    > to the manufacturer, and deliberately seeking out and answering
    > literally thousands of questions so as to increase my understand of
    > it. Many people would say that I am a "PIX expert". Even so, I find
    > that at best I am able to answer 2 questions out of every 3, because
    > there is so much to know. The number of potential configuration
    > interactions on a device like the PIX is N factorial, where N is the
    > number of features. If the PIX had as few as 10 features, that would
    > be over 3 million potential feature interactions. If I had worked
    > 8 hours a day, 365 days a year, for four years, I would have had
    > to have learned a new interaction every 12 seconds in order to know
    > all of those interactions by now.


    Slacker.

    --
    Mabden
    Mabden, Nov 1, 2005
    #17
  18. omar khan

    Jordan Abel Guest

    On 2005-10-31, Walter Roberson <-cnrc.gc.ca> wrote:
    > In article <43665625$0$11073$4all.nl>,
    > Skarmander <> wrote:
    >>Without delving into the legalese too much, "felony" is a word reserved
    >>for grave criminal offenses (for suitable values of "grave"). Copyright
    >>violation is not one of them in any legal system I know of.

    >
    > The US Digital Millenium Copyright Act introduced a new offence
    > of "criminal copyright violation" in instances where the value of
    > the copied work exceeded a certain value (and the limit is low enough
    > to include most name-brand commercial items whilst excluding
    > most personal writings and home businesses.)


    Actually...
    http://www.usdoj.gov/criminal/cybercrime/intell_prop_rts/SectIII.htm#A2b
    | In order to charge a felony violation of the criminal copyright
    | statute, the government must also prove that the infringing copies
    | have a total retail value of more than $2,500. In an era where,
    | for example, even the most basic computer programs often can cost
    | more than $100, this rarely proves difficult. However, the value
    | of the infringing goods becomes more of an issue in sentencing.
    | See "Sentencing Guidelines," infra, p. 37.
    Jordan Abel, Nov 1, 2005
    #18
  19. omar khan

    Jordan Abel Guest

    On 2005-10-31, Keith Thompson <> wrote:
    > Skarmander <> writes:
    > [...]
    >> In any case, it's unlikely that merely owning an illicit copy of a
    >> book classifies as a serious crime in any jurisdiction, or indeed as a
    >> crime at all in most, let alone as a felony in those systems that make
    >> the distinction.

    >
    > Regardless of the legalities, possessing an illicit copy of K&R2 is
    > extremely inconsiderate to Mr. Kernighan and Mr. Ritchie. The
    > revenues from their book are part of their income; depriving them and
    > their publisher of those revenues for the sake of your own convenience
    > is rude.
    >
    > If they had chosen to make the contents of the book freely available,
    > of course, it would be a completely different situation, but they
    > haven't done so.


    Yes, that's very much true. This was only brought up because this is a
    newsgroup full of nitpickers
    Jordan Abel, Nov 1, 2005
    #19
  20. In article <QfA9f.11491$>,
    Mabden <mabden@sbc_global.net> wrote:
    >"Walter Roberson" <-cnrc.gc.ca> wrote in message
    >news:dk5o28$lj$...
    >> If the PIX had as few as 10 features, that would
    >> be over 3 million potential feature interactions. If I had worked
    >> 8 hours a day, 365 days a year, for four years, I would have had
    >> to have learned a new interaction every 12 seconds in order to know
    >> all of those interactions by now.


    >Slacker.


    Oh, the other 16 x 365 is for my other work.
    --
    "It is important to remember that when it comes to law, computers
    never make copies, only human beings make copies. Computers are given
    commands, not permission. Only people can be given permission."
    -- Brad Templeton
    Walter Roberson, Nov 1, 2005
    #20
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