Color Code

Discussion in 'ASP General' started by Vinod, Mar 2, 2005.

  1. Vinod

    Vinod Guest

    Hi,

    I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between the color
    codes.

    I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    The first text field will have background color
    The second will have text color.

    I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors should
    be entered in text.
    and vice versa.

    any solutions will be great help.

    regards
    vinod
    Vinod, Mar 2, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    : I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between the color
    : codes.
    :
    : I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    : The first text field will have background color
    : The second will have text color.
    :
    : I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    should
    : be entered in text.
    : and vice versa.
    :
    : any solutions will be great help.

    You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the current
    background color is but this is not an ASP issue.

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 2, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Vinod

    Adrienne Guest

    Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    writing in news::

    > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    > news:%...
    >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between the
    >: color codes.
    >:
    >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    >: The first text field will have background color
    >: The second will have text color.
    >:
    >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    >: should be entered in text.
    >: and vice versa.
    >:
    >: any solutions will be great help.
    >
    > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the current
    > background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    >


    I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone puts #
    000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    Color codes: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>



    --
    Adrienne Boswell
    http://www.cavalcade-of-coding.info
    Please respond to the group so others can share
    Adrienne, Mar 2, 2005
    #3
  4. Vinod

    roger Guest

    "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > Hi,
    >
    > I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between the color
    > codes.
    >
    > I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    > The first text field will have background color
    > The second will have text color.
    >
    > I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors

    should
    > be entered in text.
    > and vice versa.


    The brightness of a colour*** to human eyes is made up of

    29.9% red, 58.7% green and 11.4% blue

    so, for web colours,

    (3 * red) + (6 * green) + blue will give you an approximate brightness
    between 0 and 2550

    Choose a threshold (e.g. 1200)

    then background colours < 1200 are dark and need a light foreground,
    and background colours >= 1200 are light and need a dark foreground.


    *** One of the few advantages of being an English programmer in a US
    dominated
    world, is that I can always use 'colour' as an identifier - without any fear
    that it is a
    reserved word.

    --
    roger
    roger, Mar 2, 2005
    #4
  5. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Adrienne" wrote in message
    news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    : writing in news::
    :
    : > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    : > news:%...
    : >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between the
    : >: color codes.
    : >:
    : >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    : >: The first text field will have background color
    : >: The second will have text color.
    : >:
    : >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    : >: should be entered in text.
    : >: and vice versa.
    : >:
    : >: any solutions will be great help.
    : >
    : > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the current
    : > background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    : >
    :
    : I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone puts #
    : 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    : Color codes: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>

    I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the background
    color is so he can contrast the foreground color with it. AND, it's a
    client-side issue, not an ASP one.

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 2, 2005
    #5
  6. Vinod

    Adrienne Guest

    Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    writing in news:#:

    > "Adrienne" wrote in message
    > news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    >: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    >: writing in news::
    >:
    >: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    >: > news:%...
    >: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between
    >: >: the color codes.
    >: >:
    >: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    >: >: The first text field will have background color
    >: >: The second will have text color.
    >: >:
    >: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only light
    >: >: colors should be entered in text.
    >: >: and vice versa.
    >: >:
    >: >: any solutions will be great help.
    >: >
    >: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the current
    >: > background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    >: >
    >:
    >: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone puts
    >: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    >: Color codes:
    >: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    >
    > I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    > background color is so he can contrast the foreground color with it.
    > AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    >


    Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.

    <% dim background
    dim foreground
    dim nocontrast


    background = request.form("background")
    foreground = request.form("foreground")

    'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast enough
    if nocontrast = true then
    response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    end if
    %>
    <form method="post" action="">
    <label for="background">Background: </label>
    <select name="background" id="background">
    <option value="000000" style="background-color:#000; color:#fff">#000000
    </option>
    <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0; color:#fff">#c0c0c0
    </option>
    </select>
    <label for="foreground">Foreground: </label>
    <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    <option value="000000" style="background-color:#000; color:#fff">#000000
    </option>
    <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0; color:#fff">#c0c0c0
    </option>
    </select>

    <input type="submit" value="Submit">
    </form>

    Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.
    --
    Adrienne Boswell
    http://www.cavalcade-of-coding.info
    Please respond to the group so others can share
    Adrienne, Mar 2, 2005
    #6
  7. Vinod

    Adrienne Guest

    Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Adrienne
    <> writing in
    news:Xns960D604BE61Farbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158:

    > Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    > writing in news:#:
    >
    >> "Adrienne" wrote in message
    >> news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    >>: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    >>: writing in news::
    >>:
    >>: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    >>: > news:%...
    >>: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between
    >>: >: the color codes.
    >>: >:
    >>: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    >>: >: The first text field will have background color
    >>: >: The second will have text color.
    >>: >:
    >>: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only light
    >>: >: colors should be entered in text.
    >>: >: and vice versa.
    >>: >:
    >>: >: any solutions will be great help.
    >>: >
    >>: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the
    >>: > current background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    >>: >
    >>:
    >>: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone puts
    >>: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    >>: Color codes:
    >>: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    >>
    >> I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    >> background color is so he can contrast the foreground color with it.
    >> AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    >>

    >
    > Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.
    >
    ><% dim background
    > dim foreground
    > dim nocontrast
    >
    >
    > background = request.form("background")
    > foreground = request.form("foreground")
    >
    > 'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast enough
    > if nocontrast = true then
    > response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    > end if
    > %>
    ><form method="post" action="">
    ><label for="background">Background: </label>
    ><select name="background" id="background">
    ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000; color:#fff">#000000
    ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select> <label
    > for="foreground">Foreground:
    ></label> <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000; color:#fff">#000000
    ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select>
    >
    ><input type="submit" value="Submit"> </form>
    >
    > Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.


    The OP emailed me:

    >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building a
    >website where the users can choose there
    >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    >bright
    >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    >should be
    >light color so that the combination looks good,


    I guess not everyone reads signatures.

    --
    Adrienne Boswell
    http://www.cavalcade-of-coding.info
    Please respond to the group so others can share
    Adrienne, Mar 2, 2005
    #7
  8. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Adrienne" wrote in message
    news:Xns960D65E1DC677arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Adrienne
    : <> writing in
    : news:Xns960D604BE61Farbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158:
    :
    : > Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    : > writing in news:#:
    : >
    : >> "Adrienne" wrote in message
    : >> news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : >>: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    : >>: writing in news::
    : >>:
    : >>: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    : >>: > news:%...
    : >>: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between
    : >>: >: the color codes.
    : >>: >:
    : >>: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there.
    : >>: >: The first text field will have background color
    : >>: >: The second will have text color.
    : >>: >:
    : >>: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only light
    : >>: >: colors should be entered in text.
    : >>: >: and vice versa.
    : >>: >:
    : >>: >: any solutions will be great help.
    : >>: >
    : >>: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the
    : >>: > current background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    : >>: >
    : >>:
    : >>: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone puts
    : >>: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    : >>: Color codes:
    : >>: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    : >>
    : >> I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    : >> background color is so he can contrast the foreground color with it.
    : >> AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    : >>
    : >
    : > Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.
    : >
    : ><% dim background
    : > dim foreground
    : > dim nocontrast
    : >
    : >
    : > background = request.form("background")
    : > foreground = request.form("foreground")
    : >
    : > 'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast enough
    : > if nocontrast = true then
    : > response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    : > end if
    : > %>
    : ><form method="post" action="">
    : ><label for="background">Background: </label>
    : ><select name="background" id="background">
    : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000; color:#fff">#000000
    : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select> <label
    : > for="foreground">Foreground:
    : ></label> <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000; color:#fff">#000000
    : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select>
    : >
    : ><input type="submit" value="Submit"> </form>
    : >
    : > Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.
    :
    : The OP emailed me:
    :
    : >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building a
    : >website where the users can choose there
    : >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    : >bright
    : >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    : >should be
    : >light color so that the combination looks good,
    :
    : I guess not everyone reads signatures.

    Not to mention he said, "the users can choose..." Can't do that from the
    server-side. The user selects a color and he wants to provide a contrasting
    color for the foreground. The server doesn't need to see color is the point
    I was trying to make nor can it determine what color the user chose unless
    it is posted. However, with his email to you, it appears he doesn't want
    any server-side. The user will be doing it on their end. How will they
    read his message to them that the colors do not contrast? Perhaps he will
    use black/white, which he could just do anyway and eliminate the issue.

    If the user is selecting color contrast that is best for them, they can do
    that with their browser and override his settings. If they have trouble
    seeing, they're most likely doing it already or they are using something
    else to help them, like text-speech.

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 2, 2005
    #8
  9. "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "Adrienne" wrote in message
    > news:Xns960D65E1DC677arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    > : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Adrienne
    > : <> writing in
    > : news:Xns960D604BE61Farbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158:
    > :
    > : > Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    > : > writing in news:#:
    > : >
    > : >> "Adrienne" wrote in message
    > : >> news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    > : >>: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"

    <nobody@nowhere>
    > : >>: writing in news::
    > : >>:
    > : >>: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    > : >>: > news:%...
    > : >>: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish between
    > : >>: >: the color codes.
    > : >>: >:
    > : >>: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes

    there.
    > : >>: >: The first text field will have background color
    > : >>: >: The second will have text color.
    > : >>: >:
    > : >>: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only light
    > : >>: >: colors should be entered in text.
    > : >>: >: and vice versa.
    > : >>: >:
    > : >>: >: any solutions will be great help.
    > : >>: >
    > : >>: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the
    > : >>: > current background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    > : >>: >
    > : >>:
    > : >>: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone

    puts
    > : >>: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    > : >>: Color codes:
    > : >>: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    > : >>
    > : >> I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    > : >> background color is so he can contrast the foreground color with it.
    > : >> AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    > : >>
    > : >
    > : > Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.
    > : >
    > : ><% dim background
    > : > dim foreground
    > : > dim nocontrast
    > : >
    > : >
    > : > background = request.form("background")
    > : > foreground = request.form("foreground")
    > : >
    > : > 'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast enough
    > : > if nocontrast = true then
    > : > response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    > : > end if
    > : > %>
    > : ><form method="post" action="">
    > : ><label for="background">Background: </label>
    > : ><select name="background" id="background">
    > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;

    color:#fff">#000000
    > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select> <label
    > : > for="foreground">Foreground:
    > : ></label> <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;

    color:#fff">#000000
    > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select>
    > : >
    > : ><input type="submit" value="Submit"> </form>
    > : >
    > : > Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.
    > :
    > : The OP emailed me:
    > :
    > : >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building

    a
    > : >website where the users can choose there
    > : >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    > : >bright
    > : >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    > : >should be
    > : >light color so that the combination looks good,
    > :
    > : I guess not everyone reads signatures.
    >
    > Not to mention he said, "the users can choose..." Can't do that from the
    > server-side. The user selects a color and he wants to provide a

    contrasting
    > color for the foreground. The server doesn't need to see color is the

    point
    > I was trying to make nor can it determine what color the user chose unless
    > it is posted. However, with his email to you, it appears he doesn't want
    > any server-side. The user will be doing it on their end. How will they
    > read his message to them that the colors do not contrast? Perhaps he will
    > use black/white, which he could just do anyway and eliminate the issue.
    >
    > If the user is selecting color contrast that is best for them, they can do
    > that with their browser and override his settings. If they have trouble
    > seeing, they're most likely doing it already or they are using something
    > else to help them, like text-speech.
    >
    > --
    > Roland Hall
    > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    > Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    > WSH 5.6 Documentation -

    http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    >
    >

    I think you're still misinterpreting the OP's original intent. As I
    understand it, he has a form with two (2) text fields where the end user can
    enter color codes (e.g. #FFFFFF, #000000, etc..). One for background, one
    for foreground. On the server-side, when these color codes are submitted,
    the difference between their brightness levels is calculated. If the
    difference is above a specified threshold, then the color code values are
    stored (perhaps in a database), if not the user is redirected to a page that
    indicates there is insufficient contrast between the foreground and
    background colors specified. I don't think there's any client-side going on
    in this scenario. I imagine this is for some skinning/personalization
    functionality on the website.
    Chris Hohmann, Mar 2, 2005
    #9
  10. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Chris Hohmann" <> wrote in message
    news:u$...
    :
    : "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    : news:...
    : > "Adrienne" wrote in message
    : > news:Xns960D65E1DC677arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : > : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Adrienne
    : > : <> writing in
    : > : news:Xns960D604BE61Farbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158:
    : > :
    : > : > Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    <nobody@nowhere>
    : > : > writing in news:#:
    : > : >
    : > : >> "Adrienne" wrote in message
    : > : >> news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : > : >>: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    : <nobody@nowhere>
    : > : >>: writing in news::
    : > : >>:
    : > : >>: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    : > : >>: > news:%...
    : > : >>: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish
    between
    : > : >>: >: the color codes.
    : > : >>: >:
    : > : >>: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes
    : there.
    : > : >>: >: The first text field will have background color
    : > : >>: >: The second will have text color.
    : > : >>: >:
    : > : >>: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only light
    : > : >>: >: colors should be entered in text.
    : > : >>: >: and vice versa.
    : > : >>: >:
    : > : >>: >: any solutions will be great help.
    : > : >>: >
    : > : >>: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the
    : > : >>: > current background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    : > : >>: >
    : > : >>:
    : > : >>: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone
    : puts
    : > : >>: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    : > : >>: Color codes:
    : > : >>: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    : > : >>
    : > : >> I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    : > : >> background color is so he can contrast the foreground color with
    it.
    : > : >> AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    : > : >>
    : > : >
    : > : > Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.
    : > : >
    : > : ><% dim background
    : > : > dim foreground
    : > : > dim nocontrast
    : > : >
    : > : >
    : > : > background = request.form("background")
    : > : > foreground = request.form("foreground")
    : > : >
    : > : > 'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast
    enough
    : > : > if nocontrast = true then
    : > : > response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    : > : > end if
    : > : > %>
    : > : ><form method="post" action="">
    : > : ><label for="background">Background: </label>
    : > : ><select name="background" id="background">
    : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    : color:#fff">#000000
    : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select> <label
    : > : > for="foreground">Foreground:
    : > : ></label> <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    : color:#fff">#000000
    : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select>
    : > : >
    : > : ><input type="submit" value="Submit"> </form>
    : > : >
    : > : > Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.
    : > :
    : > : The OP emailed me:
    : > :
    : > : >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am
    building
    : a
    : > : >website where the users can choose there
    : > : >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    : > : >bright
    : > : >color say he has selected the background color then the next
    selection
    : > : >should be
    : > : >light color so that the combination looks good,
    : > :
    : > : I guess not everyone reads signatures.
    : >
    : > Not to mention he said, "the users can choose..." Can't do that from
    the
    : > server-side. The user selects a color and he wants to provide a
    : contrasting
    : > color for the foreground. The server doesn't need to see color is the
    : point
    : > I was trying to make nor can it determine what color the user chose
    unless
    : > it is posted. However, with his email to you, it appears he doesn't
    want
    : > any server-side. The user will be doing it on their end. How will they
    : > read his message to them that the colors do not contrast? Perhaps he
    will
    : > use black/white, which he could just do anyway and eliminate the issue.
    : >
    : > If the user is selecting color contrast that is best for them, they can
    do
    : > that with their browser and override his settings. If they have trouble
    : > seeing, they're most likely doing it already or they are using something
    : > else to help them, like text-speech.
    : >
    : > --
    : > Roland Hall
    : > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
    but
    : > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of
    merchantability
    : > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    : > Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    : > WSH 5.6 Documentation -
    : http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    : > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    : >
    : >
    : I think you're still misinterpreting the OP's original intent. As I
    : understand it, he has a form with two (2) text fields where the end user
    can
    : enter color codes (e.g. #FFFFFF, #000000, etc..). One for background, one
    : for foreground. On the server-side, when these color codes are submitted,
    : the difference between their brightness levels is calculated. If the
    : difference is above a specified threshold, then the color code values are
    : stored (perhaps in a database), if not the user is redirected to a page
    that
    : indicates there is insufficient contrast between the foreground and
    : background colors specified. I don't think there's any client-side going
    on
    : in this scenario. I imagine this is for some skinning/personalization
    : functionality on the website.

    I'm willing to concede I'm missing it but I don't see how you get that out
    of this statement:

    "I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    should be entered in text. and vice versa."

    "I want to validate if background is dark." Following your conclusion, the
    value has already been selected.

    "THEN only light colors should be entered in text." The user is entering
    the text, or selecting from a list, but can only enter/select colors that
    are in contrast with the background they have already chosen. To me, this
    means the options have changed based on the first input and the webmaster
    wants to be in control of those options, not the user.

    "and vice versa." This means, to me, if background first, foreground
    options are based upon that color. If foreground color is selected, then
    background options are based upon that color.

    His email to Adrienne, parallels what I just wrote.

    >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building a
    >website where the users can choose there
    >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    >bright
    >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    >should be
    >light color so that the combination looks good,


    This could be a simple list or numerous rectangles/squares on a page of the
    color they selected with all of the available options for the contrasting
    color for the text. The user could then select the one they want and THIS
    could then be added to a database.

    I think I've actually seen this somewhere before and it was done all
    client-side. It could be done server-side but I think it would be a waste
    to do so. We may have to agree to disagree on this one because I just can't
    see his comments as anything else.

    One last thing, why would the user be directed to a page informing them
    their selections are inadequate for contrast? Who the Hell is looking at
    this anyway? Isn't it the user? If it's their skinning/personalization
    option, then why is the webmaster trying to decide for them? I think the OP
    just wants to help the user choose the colors that work best together by
    letting them know what the available color options are that would contrast
    the most for a better viewing experience. However, I think the OP, while
    offering these choices, should not only allow the user to choose a
    predetermined pair but also choose any colors they want. Some may like
    orange on red. Who am I to deny them that choice? Sounds like fish on
    Fridays to me. (O:=

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 3, 2005
    #10
  11. Vinod

    Vinod Guest

    "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > "Chris Hohmann" <> wrote in message
    > news:u$...
    > :
    > : "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    > : news:...
    > : > "Adrienne" wrote in message
    > : > news:Xns960D65E1DC677arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    > : > : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Adrienne
    > : > : <> writing in
    > : > : news:Xns960D604BE61Farbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158:
    > : > :
    > : > : > Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    > <nobody@nowhere>
    > : > : > writing in news:#:
    > : > : >
    > : > : >> "Adrienne" wrote in message
    > : > : >> news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    > : > : >>: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    > : <nobody@nowhere>
    > : > : >>: writing in news::
    > : > : >>:
    > : > : >>: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    > : > : >>: > news:%...
    > : > : >>: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish
    > between
    > : > : >>: >: the color codes.
    > : > : >>: >:
    > : > : >>: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes
    > : there.
    > : > : >>: >: The first text field will have background color
    > : > : >>: >: The second will have text color.
    > : > : >>: >:
    > : > : >>: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only

    light
    > : > : >>: >: colors should be entered in text.
    > : > : >>: >: and vice versa.
    > : > : >>: >:
    > : > : >>: >: any solutions will be great help.
    > : > : >>: >
    > : > : >>: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the
    > : > : >>: > current background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    > : > : >>: >
    > : > : >>:
    > : > : >>: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone
    > : puts
    > : > : >>: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    > : > : >>: Color codes:
    > : > : >>: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    > : > : >>
    > : > : >> I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    > : > : >> background color is so he can contrast the foreground color with
    > it.
    > : > : >> AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    > : > : >>
    > : > : >
    > : > : > Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.
    > : > : >
    > : > : ><% dim background
    > : > : > dim foreground
    > : > : > dim nocontrast
    > : > : >
    > : > : >
    > : > : > background = request.form("background")
    > : > : > foreground = request.form("foreground")
    > : > : >
    > : > : > 'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast
    > enough
    > : > : > if nocontrast = true then
    > : > : > response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    > : > : > end if
    > : > : > %>
    > : > : ><form method="post" action="">
    > : > : ><label for="background">Background: </label>
    > : > : ><select name="background" id="background">
    > : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    > : color:#fff">#000000
    > : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select> <label
    > : > : > for="foreground">Foreground:
    > : > : ></label> <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    > : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    > : color:#fff">#000000
    > : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select>
    > : > : >
    > : > : ><input type="submit" value="Submit"> </form>
    > : > : >
    > : > : > Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.
    > : > :
    > : > : The OP emailed me:
    > : > :
    > : > : >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am
    > building
    > : a
    > : > : >website where the users can choose there
    > : > : >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it

    is
    > : > : >bright
    > : > : >color say he has selected the background color then the next
    > selection
    > : > : >should be
    > : > : >light color so that the combination looks good,
    > : > :
    > : > : I guess not everyone reads signatures.
    > : >
    > : > Not to mention he said, "the users can choose..." Can't do that from
    > the
    > : > server-side. The user selects a color and he wants to provide a
    > : contrasting
    > : > color for the foreground. The server doesn't need to see color is the
    > : point
    > : > I was trying to make nor can it determine what color the user chose
    > unless
    > : > it is posted. However, with his email to you, it appears he doesn't
    > want
    > : > any server-side. The user will be doing it on their end. How will

    they
    > : > read his message to them that the colors do not contrast? Perhaps he
    > will
    > : > use black/white, which he could just do anyway and eliminate the

    issue.
    > : >
    > : > If the user is selecting color contrast that is best for them, they

    can
    > do
    > : > that with their browser and override his settings. If they have

    trouble
    > : > seeing, they're most likely doing it already or they are using

    something
    > : > else to help them, like text-speech.
    > : >
    > : > --
    > : > Roland Hall
    > : > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
    > but
    > : > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of
    > merchantability
    > : > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    > : > Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    > : > WSH 5.6 Documentation -
    > : http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    > : > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    > : >
    > : >
    > : I think you're still misinterpreting the OP's original intent. As I
    > : understand it, he has a form with two (2) text fields where the end user
    > can
    > : enter color codes (e.g. #FFFFFF, #000000, etc..). One for background,

    one
    > : for foreground. On the server-side, when these color codes are

    submitted,
    > : the difference between their brightness levels is calculated. If the
    > : difference is above a specified threshold, then the color code values

    are
    > : stored (perhaps in a database), if not the user is redirected to a page
    > that
    > : indicates there is insufficient contrast between the foreground and
    > : background colors specified. I don't think there's any client-side going
    > on
    > : in this scenario. I imagine this is for some skinning/personalization
    > : functionality on the website.
    >
    > I'm willing to concede I'm missing it but I don't see how you get that out
    > of this statement:
    >
    > "I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    > should be entered in text. and vice versa."
    >
    > "I want to validate if background is dark." Following your conclusion,

    the
    > value has already been selected.
    >
    > "THEN only light colors should be entered in text." The user is entering
    > the text, or selecting from a list, but can only enter/select colors that
    > are in contrast with the background they have already chosen. To me, this
    > means the options have changed based on the first input and the webmaster
    > wants to be in control of those options, not the user.
    >
    > "and vice versa." This means, to me, if background first, foreground
    > options are based upon that color. If foreground color is selected, then
    > background options are based upon that color.
    >
    > His email to Adrienne, parallels what I just wrote.
    >
    > >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building a
    > >website where the users can choose there
    > >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    > >bright
    > >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    > >should be
    > >light color so that the combination looks good,

    >
    > This could be a simple list or numerous rectangles/squares on a page of

    the
    > color they selected with all of the available options for the contrasting
    > color for the text. The user could then select the one they want and THIS


    > could then be added to a database.
    >
    > I think I've actually seen this somewhere before and it was done all
    > client-side. It could be done server-side but I think it would be a waste
    > to do so. We may have to agree to disagree on this one because I just

    can't
    > see his comments as anything else.
    >
    > One last thing, why would the user be directed to a page informing them
    > their selections are inadequate for contrast? Who the Hell is looking at
    > this anyway? Isn't it the user? If it's their skinning/personalization
    > option, then why is the webmaster trying to decide for them? I think the

    OP
    > just wants to help the user choose the colors that work best together by
    > letting them know what the available color options are that would contrast
    > the most for a better viewing experience. However, I think the OP, while
    > offering these choices, should not only allow the user to choose a
    > predetermined pair but also choose any colors they want. Some may like
    > orange on red. Who am I to deny them that choice? Sounds like fish on
    > Fridays to me. (O:=
    >
    > --
    > Roland Hall
    > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    > Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    > WSH 5.6 Documentation -

    http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    >
    >


    Hi Guys,

    I think some understood my requirement and some didnot.

    I will explain it in a simple way :-

    a) I got a web site.
    b) In the site i have a page where i can set the color settings.
    d) I should be able to set my background color,Body Color,Button color,Link
    color
    e) I am entering the hexadecimal code, which can be even selected froma
    color picker javascript.
    f) Now if i give my background color has light and also my link color as
    light i may not be even seeing certain links.

    I am providing these options to the users, so that they can customize there
    colors.
    Now suppose a user changes certain color combinations , he may not be able
    be see certain facilities like

    if you give Body Color : FFFFCC
    and Link Color :ffffff

    which i want to avoid .

    Thanks for all the reply

    Regards
    Vinod
    Vinod, Mar 3, 2005
    #11
  12. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Vinod" wrote in message news:%...
    :
    : "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    : news:%...
    : > "Chris Hohmann" <> wrote in message
    : > news:u$...
    : > :
    : > : "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    : > : news:...
    : > : > "Adrienne" wrote in message
    : > : > news:Xns960D65E1DC677arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : > : > : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Adrienne
    : > : > : <> writing in
    : > : > : news:Xns960D604BE61Farbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158:
    : > : > :
    : > : > : > Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    : > <nobody@nowhere>
    : > : > : > writing in news:#:
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : >> "Adrienne" wrote in message
    : > : > : >> news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : > : > : >>: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    : > : <nobody@nowhere>
    : > : > : >>: writing in news::
    : > : > : >>:
    : > : > : >>: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    : > : > : >>: > news:%...
    : > : > : >>: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish
    : > between
    : > : > : >>: >: the color codes.
    : > : > : >>: >:
    : > : > : >>: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes
    : > : there.
    : > : > : >>: >: The first text field will have background color
    : > : > : >>: >: The second will have text color.
    : > : > : >>: >:
    : > : > : >>: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only
    : light
    : > : > : >>: >: colors should be entered in text.
    : > : > : >>: >: and vice versa.
    : > : > : >>: >:
    : > : > : >>: >: any solutions will be great help.
    : > : > : >>: >
    : > : > : >>: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the
    : > : > : >>: > current background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    : > : > : >>: >
    : > : > : >>:
    : > : > : >>: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if
    someone
    : > : puts
    : > : > : >>: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    : > : > : >>: Color codes:
    : > : > : >>: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    : > : > : >>
    : > : > : >> I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    : > : > : >> background color is so he can contrast the foreground color
    with
    : > it.
    : > : > : >> AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    : > : > : >>
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : > Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : ><% dim background
    : > : > : > dim foreground
    : > : > : > dim nocontrast
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : > background = request.form("background")
    : > : > : > foreground = request.form("foreground")
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : > 'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast
    : > enough
    : > : > : > if nocontrast = true then
    : > : > : > response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    : > : > : > end if
    : > : > : > %>
    : > : > : ><form method="post" action="">
    : > : > : ><label for="background">Background: </label>
    : > : > : ><select name="background" id="background">
    : > : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    : > : color:#fff">#000000
    : > : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    : > : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select> <label
    : > : > : > for="foreground">Foreground:
    : > : > : ></label> <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    : > : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    : > : color:#fff">#000000
    : > : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    : > : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select>
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : ><input type="submit" value="Submit"> </form>
    : > : > : >
    : > : > : > Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.
    : > : > :
    : > : > : The OP emailed me:
    : > : > :
    : > : > : >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am
    : > building
    : > : a
    : > : > : >website where the users can choose there
    : > : > : >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it
    : is
    : > : > : >bright
    : > : > : >color say he has selected the background color then the next
    : > selection
    : > : > : >should be
    : > : > : >light color so that the combination looks good,
    : > : > :
    : > : > : I guess not everyone reads signatures.
    : > : >
    : > : > Not to mention he said, "the users can choose..." Can't do that
    from
    : > the
    : > : > server-side. The user selects a color and he wants to provide a
    : > : contrasting
    : > : > color for the foreground. The server doesn't need to see color is
    the
    : > : point
    : > : > I was trying to make nor can it determine what color the user chose
    : > unless
    : > : > it is posted. However, with his email to you, it appears he doesn't
    : > want
    : > : > any server-side. The user will be doing it on their end. How will
    : they
    : > : > read his message to them that the colors do not contrast? Perhaps
    he
    : > will
    : > : > use black/white, which he could just do anyway and eliminate the
    : issue.
    : > : >
    : > : > If the user is selecting color contrast that is best for them, they
    : can
    : > do
    : > : > that with their browser and override his settings. If they have
    : trouble
    : > : > seeing, they're most likely doing it already or they are using
    : something
    : > : > else to help them, like text-speech.
    : > : >
    : > : > --
    : > : > Roland Hall
    : > : > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be
    useful,
    : > but
    : > : > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of
    : > merchantability
    : > : > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    : > : > Technet Script Center -
    http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    : > : > WSH 5.6 Documentation -
    : > : http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    : > : > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    : > : >
    : > : >
    : > : I think you're still misinterpreting the OP's original intent. As I
    : > : understand it, he has a form with two (2) text fields where the end
    user
    : > can
    : > : enter color codes (e.g. #FFFFFF, #000000, etc..). One for background,
    : one
    : > : for foreground. On the server-side, when these color codes are
    : submitted,
    : > : the difference between their brightness levels is calculated. If the
    : > : difference is above a specified threshold, then the color code values
    : are
    : > : stored (perhaps in a database), if not the user is redirected to a
    page
    : > that
    : > : indicates there is insufficient contrast between the foreground and
    : > : background colors specified. I don't think there's any client-side
    going
    : > on
    : > : in this scenario. I imagine this is for some skinning/personalization
    : > : functionality on the website.
    : >
    : > I'm willing to concede I'm missing it but I don't see how you get that
    out
    : > of this statement:
    : >
    : > "I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    : > should be entered in text. and vice versa."
    : >
    : > "I want to validate if background is dark." Following your conclusion,
    : the
    : > value has already been selected.
    : >
    : > "THEN only light colors should be entered in text." The user is
    entering
    : > the text, or selecting from a list, but can only enter/select colors
    that
    : > are in contrast with the background they have already chosen. To me,
    this
    : > means the options have changed based on the first input and the
    webmaster
    : > wants to be in control of those options, not the user.
    : >
    : > "and vice versa." This means, to me, if background first, foreground
    : > options are based upon that color. If foreground color is selected,
    then
    : > background options are based upon that color.
    : >
    : > His email to Adrienne, parallels what I just wrote.
    : >
    : > >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building
    a
    : > >website where the users can choose there
    : > >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    : > >bright
    : > >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    : > >should be
    : > >light color so that the combination looks good,
    : >
    : > This could be a simple list or numerous rectangles/squares on a page of
    : the
    : > color they selected with all of the available options for the
    contrasting
    : > color for the text. The user could then select the one they want and
    THIS
    :
    : > could then be added to a database.
    : >
    : > I think I've actually seen this somewhere before and it was done all
    : > client-side. It could be done server-side but I think it would be a
    waste
    : > to do so. We may have to agree to disagree on this one because I just
    : can't
    : > see his comments as anything else.
    : >
    : > One last thing, why would the user be directed to a page informing them
    : > their selections are inadequate for contrast? Who the Hell is looking
    at
    : > this anyway? Isn't it the user? If it's their skinning/personalization
    : > option, then why is the webmaster trying to decide for them? I think
    the
    : OP
    : > just wants to help the user choose the colors that work best together by
    : > letting them know what the available color options are that would
    contrast
    : > the most for a better viewing experience. However, I think the OP,
    while
    : > offering these choices, should not only allow the user to choose a
    : > predetermined pair but also choose any colors they want. Some may like
    : > orange on red. Who am I to deny them that choice? Sounds like fish on
    : > Fridays to me. (O:=
    : >
    : > --
    : > Roland Hall
    : > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
    but
    : > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of
    merchantability
    : > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    : > Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    : > WSH 5.6 Documentation -
    : http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    : > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    : >
    : >
    :
    : Hi Guys,
    :
    : I think some understood my requirement and some didnot.
    :
    : I will explain it in a simple way :-
    :
    : a) I got a web site.
    : b) In the site i have a page where i can set the color settings.
    : d) I should be able to set my background color,Body Color,Button
    color,Link
    : color
    : e) I am entering the hexadecimal code, which can be even selected froma
    : color picker javascript.
    : f) Now if i give my background color has light and also my link color as
    : light i may not be even seeing certain links.
    :
    : I am providing these options to the users, so that they can customize
    there
    : colors.
    : Now suppose a user changes certain color combinations , he may not be able
    : be see certain facilities like
    :
    : if you give Body Color : FFFFCC
    : and Link Color :ffffff
    :
    : which i want to avoid .

    Will this help?

    http://www.markup.co.nz/palettizer/palettizer.htm
    http://www.juicystudio.com/services/colourcontrast.asp#brightformula
    http://www.nils.org.au/ais/web/resources/contrast_analyser/index.html
    http://www.snook.ca/technical/colour_contrast/colour.html
    http://www.worqx.com/palette/index.htm
    http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/tools/color-blend/
    http://www.mundidesign.com/webct/webct.html
    http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnwebgen/html/colorpick.asp
    http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnwebgen/html/safety.asp
    http://www.colorsystem.com/

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 3, 2005
    #12
  13. Responses inline.

    "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > "Chris Hohmann" <> wrote in message
    > news:u$...
    > :
    > : "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    > : news:...
    > : > "Adrienne" wrote in message
    > : > news:Xns960D65E1DC677arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    > : > : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Adrienne
    > : > : <> writing in
    > : > : news:Xns960D604BE61Farbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158:
    > : > :
    > : > : > Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    > <nobody@nowhere>
    > : > : > writing in news:#:
    > : > : >
    > : > : >> "Adrienne" wrote in message
    > : > : >> news:Xns960D177BB474arbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    > : > : >>: Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall"
    > : <nobody@nowhere>
    > : > : >>: writing in news::
    > : > : >>:
    > : > : >>: > "Vinod" <> wrote in message
    > : > : >>: > news:%...
    > : > : >>: >: I have got a peculiar requirement. I want to distinquish
    > between
    > : > : >>: >: the color codes.
    > : > : >>: >:
    > : > : >>: >: I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes
    > : there.
    > : > : >>: >: The first text field will have background color
    > : > : >>: >: The second will have text color.
    > : > : >>: >:
    > : > : >>: >: I want to validate if background color is dark then only

    light
    > : > : >>: >: colors should be entered in text.
    > : > : >>: >: and vice versa.
    > : > : >>: >:
    > : > : >>: >: any solutions will be great help.
    > : > : >>: >
    > : > : >>: > You can use the DOM on the client-side to determine what the
    > : > : >>: > current background color is but this is not an ASP issue.
    > : > : >>: >
    > : > : >>:
    > : > : >>: I don't think the OP wants that. I think he's saying if someone
    > : puts
    > : > : >>: # 000000 in one box, they can't put #666666 in the other box.
    > : > : >>: Color codes:
    > : > : >>: <http://webmonkey.wired.com/webmonkey/reference/color_codes/>
    > : > : >>
    > : > : >> I realize what he's asking for. He has to determine what the
    > : > : >> background color is so he can contrast the foreground color with
    > it.
    > : > : >> AND, it's a client-side issue, not an ASP one.
    > : > : >>
    > : > : >
    > : > : > Actually, we really don't know if it's client side or not.
    > : > : >
    > : > : ><% dim background
    > : > : > dim foreground
    > : > : > dim nocontrast
    > : > : >
    > : > : >
    > : > : > background = request.form("background")
    > : > : > foreground = request.form("foreground")
    > : > : >
    > : > : > 'some kind of function to determine whether the colors contrast
    > enough
    > : > : > if nocontrast = true then
    > : > : > response.write "There is not enough contrast"
    > : > : > end if
    > : > : > %>
    > : > : ><form method="post" action="">
    > : > : ><label for="background">Background: </label>
    > : > : ><select name="background" id="background">
    > : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    > : color:#fff">#000000
    > : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select> <label
    > : > : > for="foreground">Foreground:
    > : > : ></label> <select name="foreground" id="foregound">
    > : > : ><option value="000000" style="background-color:#000;
    > : color:#fff">#000000
    > : > : ></option> <option value="c0c0c0" style="background-color:#c0c0c0;
    > : > : > color:#fff">#c0c0c0 </option> </select>
    > : > : >
    > : > : ><input type="submit" value="Submit"> </form>
    > : > : >
    > : > : > Might be useful for someone trying to determine color blindness.
    > : > :
    > : > : The OP emailed me:
    > : > :
    > : > : >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am
    > building
    > : a
    > : > : >website where the users can choose there
    > : > : >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it

    is
    > : > : >bright
    > : > : >color say he has selected the background color then the next
    > selection
    > : > : >should be
    > : > : >light color so that the combination looks good,
    > : > :
    > : > : I guess not everyone reads signatures.
    > : >
    > : > Not to mention he said, "the users can choose..." Can't do that from
    > the
    > : > server-side. The user selects a color and he wants to provide a
    > : contrasting
    > : > color for the foreground. The server doesn't need to see color is the
    > : point
    > : > I was trying to make nor can it determine what color the user chose
    > unless
    > : > it is posted. However, with his email to you, it appears he doesn't
    > want
    > : > any server-side. The user will be doing it on their end. How will

    they
    > : > read his message to them that the colors do not contrast? Perhaps he
    > will
    > : > use black/white, which he could just do anyway and eliminate the

    issue.
    > : >
    > : > If the user is selecting color contrast that is best for them, they

    can
    > do
    > : > that with their browser and override his settings. If they have

    trouble
    > : > seeing, they're most likely doing it already or they are using

    something
    > : > else to help them, like text-speech.
    > : >
    > : > --
    > : > Roland Hall
    > : > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
    > but
    > : > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of
    > merchantability
    > : > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    > : > Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    > : > WSH 5.6 Documentation -
    > : http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    > : > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    > : >
    > : >
    > : I think you're still misinterpreting the OP's original intent. As I
    > : understand it, he has a form with two (2) text fields where the end user
    > can
    > : enter color codes (e.g. #FFFFFF, #000000, etc..). One for background,

    one
    > : for foreground. On the server-side, when these color codes are

    submitted,
    > : the difference between their brightness levels is calculated. If the
    > : difference is above a specified threshold, then the color code values

    are
    > : stored (perhaps in a database), if not the user is redirected to a page
    > that
    > : indicates there is insufficient contrast between the foreground and
    > : background colors specified. I don't think there's any client-side going
    > on
    > : in this scenario. I imagine this is for some skinning/personalization
    > : functionality on the website.
    >
    > I'm willing to concede I'm missing it but I don't see how you get that out
    > of this statement:
    >
    > "I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    > should be entered in text. and vice versa."


    I'm not basing my interpretation on the above statement, I'm basing it on
    this one:

    "I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there."


    > "I want to validate if background is dark." Following your conclusion,

    the
    > value has already been selected.


    No, following my conclusion both the background color code and the
    foreground color code are sent at the same time.


    > "THEN only light colors should be entered in text." The user is entering
    > the text, or selecting from a list, but can only enter/select colors that
    > are in contrast with the background they have already chosen. To me, this
    > means the options have changed based on the first input and the webmaster
    > wants to be in control of those options, not the user.


    I don't believe "THEN" in this context is chronilogical. I take it be closer
    to the logical equivalent of implication (IF P THEN Q).


    > "and vice versa." This means, to me, if background first, foreground
    > options are based upon that color. If foreground color is selected, then
    > background options are based upon that color.


    No, I think this means that given two color codes, B and F, you need to
    check whether B is not light enough compared to F and also whether B is not
    dark enough compared to F.


    > His email to Adrienne, parallels what I just wrote.


    No it doesn't. The first line from hthe quoted email indicates that Adrienne
    got it right, which is the scenario I described.


    > >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building a
    > >website where the users can choose there
    > >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    > >bright
    > >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    > >should be
    > >light color so that the combination looks good,

    >
    > This could be a simple list or numerous rectangles/squares on a page of

    the
    > color they selected with all of the available options for the contrasting
    > color for the text. The user could then select the one they want and THIS
    > could then be added to a database.


    That's one way to approach it, but I don't believe that's what's being
    described here.


    > I think I've actually seen this somewhere before and it was done all
    > client-side. It could be done server-side but I think it would be a waste
    > to do so. We may have to agree to disagree on this one because I just

    can't
    > see his comments as anything else.


    Some users have client-side scripting disabled.

    > One last thing, why would the user be directed to a page informing them
    > their selections are inadequate for contrast? Who the Hell is looking at
    > this anyway? Isn't it the user? If it's their skinning/personalization
    > option, then why is the webmaster trying to decide for them? I think the

    OP
    > just wants to help the user choose the colors that work best together by
    > letting them know what the available color options are that would contrast
    > the most for a better viewing experience. However, I think the OP, while
    > offering these choices, should not only allow the user to choose a
    > predetermined pair but also choose any colors they want. Some may like
    > orange on red. Who am I to deny them that choice? Sounds like fish on
    > Fridays to me. (O:=


    The site may contain important information. Issurring that the textual
    information is legible/visible by restricting the color pallette
    combinations is not unreasonable.
    Chris Hohmann, Mar 3, 2005
    #13
  14. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Adrienne" wrote in message
    news:Xns960E64726D39Darbpenyahoocom@207.115.63.158...
    : Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere>
    : writing in news:#:
    :
    : > One last thing, why would the user be directed to a page informing them
    : > their selections are inadequate for contrast? Who the Hell is looking
    : > at this anyway? Isn't it the user? If it's their
    : > skinning/personalization option, then why is the webmaster trying to
    : > decide for them? I think the OP just wants to help the user choose the
    : > colors that work best together by letting them know what the available
    : > color options are that would contrast the most for a better viewing
    : > experience. However, I think the OP, while offering these choices,
    : > should not only allow the user to choose a predetermined pair but also
    : > choose any colors they want. Some may like orange on red. Who am I to
    : > deny them that choice? Sounds like fish on Fridays to me.
    :
    : With an increasing awareness of accessibility issues, designers and
    : developers are becoming more aware of colors. What you might be able to
    : see, someone with low vision cannot.

    I would agree with that.

    : If one is offering a service where users can create web pages on the fly,
    : and they choose the background and foreground colors, then it would be
    : nice to remind the user that certain colors do not have enough contrast
    : for low vision visitors (not to mention tiny font sizes in pixels that
    : can't be resized).

    Nothing wrong with reminders. IMHO, I believe they should be pre, not post
    submit. However, removing the option is called Liberalism. There are no
    options because someone might be offended.

    : The good thing about doing the validation server side is that you do not
    : run into problems with users not having javascript available.

    Ah, yes. (using my best W.C.Fields voice) the ole' turning off of the
    client-scripting engine as a security measure rather than educating ones
    self. Perhaps next we will be removing images and then possibly not using
    the Internet because it really isn't safe to be here?! I believe
    server-side scripting should be performed but not in lieu of client-side
    scripting which can save me trips to the server but rather in addition to
    for those little buggers that have more time on their hands than sense to
    mess with my servers (see unmonitored children)

    : I would
    : probably do client side validation, but I would certainly have the server
    : side as backup.

    No comment (see redundant)

    : To see what low vision users see when they look at your site, run it
    : though ADesigner <http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/adesigner>, or
    : <http://www.vischeck.com/vischeck/> Visicheck (online tester). The
    : results might be "eye opening".

    Considering I just posted a whole slew of links that refer to the same
    subject, probably not, but do I fail to consider these people in my coding.
    Yes, but I am more of a developer than a designer so I'm not fond of a lot
    of different colors, especially ones that do not contrast well with the
    background although I have been known to use #efe on a white background
    quite a bit. I just took that out of my latest product. And, if images are
    used, they're simple and used more as a marker for a target, rather than
    being the target.

    I have astigmatism http://www.allaboutvision.com/conditions/astigmatism.htm
    in both eyes, worse in my left. Without glasses, I see two of everything.
    To me, it's just blurry because the two images are very close together. It
    effects the amount of light I take in so anything written in lights, like
    signs, monitors, television, etc. are hard to view without glasses. I find
    myself squinting even when I don't need to. Probably a uncontrollable need
    to focus. Glasses keep this from occurring. I actually have pretty good
    eyesight. There are just 1 too many pictures coming in. Actually that is
    an incorrect statement. 2 pictures are coming but they're not synchronized.

    This last one I posted, I read almost every one of them this morning.
    http://www.colorsystem.com/ It appears we are still adopting a best guess
    without a definite approach to colors. I think it was Plato's color system
    from his Timaios where he believed the eye does not receive light but rather
    it transmits a ray of vision towards an object. He might have been
    projecting something but it wasn't a vision. Perhaps that can be applied to
    the brain where an image is seen where none exists. But then, how do we
    really know everything we see really does exist?

    Out of all I read at this site, this was the statement that got most of my
    attention. "In a reality so rich with colours, there are in reality no
    colours." You'll have to excuse his typos, he's obviously in the UK. (O:=
    I had often wondered if what I see is what someone else sees. It goes on to
    state that the amount of light that enters our eyes affects the colors we
    see. The author states we perceive colors within our brain so they are a
    product of our self and we decorate our personal world with them. I find
    that fascinating. It is said that dogs see 2 -dimensional and are mostly
    color blind while we see 3-dimensional and see colors. This is based on the
    cells in the eye, the retina I think, where humans have cone shaped cells
    and dogs have something else. That adds weight to the argument what I see
    is not what you see. Perhaps Science has figured out what each of us sees
    is close enough to what the other sees but not exactly. I have never heard
    of anything that can modify the colors I see, meaning all colors, not a
    filter to omit a color, etc. Corrective eyeware is not for color but rather
    for light and malformations which effect focus at different distances.
    Ironically, these articles discuss methods and formulas to help someone use
    contrasting colors to aid those who cannot distinguish as well as most with
    the contrast in colors, or focus well with small print, by doing this on a
    computer, which is the device that actually makes it harder to see.

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 3, 2005
    #14
  15. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Chris Hohmann" wrote in message
    news:%...
    : > "I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    : > should be entered in text. and vice versa."
    :
    : I'm not basing my interpretation on the above statement, I'm basing it on
    : this one:
    :
    : "I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there."

    and then he clarified. Is the sum of the parts greater than the sum of the
    whole?

    : > "I want to validate if background is dark." Following your conclusion,
    : the
    : > value has already been selected.
    :
    : No, following my conclusion both the background color code and the
    : foreground color code are sent at the same time.

    No I'm wrong or no you disagree or both? Isn't that counterproductive?
    That's like guessing. Why not give all options up front so the user chooses
    once, instead of multiple times?

    Pick a background and foreground color.
    Done.
    Nah, I didn't like that, try again.
    Done.
    Nope. Not gonna' get it. Choose again.
    Done.
    You're not really catching onto this are ya'? Try again.
    Done.
    Man, you suck. Can you even make out the text on this page? Choose again,
    and Indiana, choose wisely. While the true grail can give you eternal life,
    the false grail will take it from you.
    Done.
    Poof! Silly German, you're toast. hehe I warned ya'. NEXT!!!!!

    : > "THEN only light colors should be entered in text." The user is
    entering
    : > the text, or selecting from a list, but can only enter/select colors
    that
    : > are in contrast with the background they have already chosen. To me,
    this
    : > means the options have changed based on the first input and the
    webmaster
    : > wants to be in control of those options, not the user.
    :
    : I don't believe "THEN" in this context is chronilogical. I take it be
    closer
    : to the logical equivalent of implication (IF P THEN Q).

    Skinny dipping in Egypt? Ah, implication, like (IF P THEN SHAKE)

    : > "and vice versa." This means, to me, if background first, foreground
    : > options are based upon that color. If foreground color is selected,
    then
    : > background options are based upon that color.
    :
    : No, I think this means that given two color codes, B and F, you need to
    : check whether B is not light enough compared to F and also whether B is
    not
    : dark enough compared to F.

    But, I think he wants to get to this point, so only good options are
    available.

    : > His email to Adrienne, parallels what I just wrote.
    :
    : No it doesn't. The first line from hthe quoted email indicates that
    Adrienne
    : got it right, which is the scenario I described.

    IYO. Since when does an apple = an orange?

    : > >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am building
    a
    : > >website where the users can choose there
    : > >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    : > >bright
    : > >color say he has selected the background color then the next selection
    : > >should be
    : > >light color so that the combination looks good,

    Perhaps you're still only using parts.. "WHEN the user selects...THEN the
    next selection..." HELLO? Is this thing on? Two selections, one following
    the other.

    : > This could be a simple list or numerous rectangles/squares on a page of
    : the
    : > color they selected with all of the available options for the
    contrasting
    : > color for the text. The user could then select the one they want and
    THIS
    : > could then be added to a database.
    :
    : That's one way to approach it, but I don't believe that's what's being
    : described here.

    You're right. It's not being described that way. I think he's looking for
    a solution. He only has a final outcome realized and is asking for the path
    to get there. IMHO, if he wants the easiest solution for the user, since
    his goal is, IMHO, to make their life easier in setting their color
    setttings in their profiles for background, foreground, button colors and
    links, it would be offer options in either a list or a color wheel, pattern,
    atlas, etc.

    Background: black
    Foreground Options: white, yellow, cyan, etc.

    Foreground: Black
    Background Options: white, yellow, cyan, light[any color], etc.

    These could be SELECTs but a visual of all examples would make it eaiser for
    the user. The guess has thus been removed and no reason to make a decision
    more than once unless you just change your mind, like women.

    While this is what I'm referring to:
    http://wellstyled.com/tools/colorscheme2/index-en.html

    I think he can make a list of light colors and a list of dark colors. When
    the user selects one from one list for background, then links text, button
    colors should only be offered from the other list. That may be too simple.

    : > I think I've actually seen this somewhere before and it was done all
    : > client-side. It could be done server-side but I think it would be a
    waste
    : > to do so. We may have to agree to disagree on this one because I just
    : can't
    : > see his comments as anything else.
    :
    : Some users have client-side scripting disabled.

    Some users don't get much use out of the net. Some users don't use IE to
    browse. Most of these users still read all their mail in RTF or HTML
    embedded format. In the immortal words of Ricky Ricardo, "I dunt."

    I, on the other hand, don't depend on my browser to be my only level of
    security. I manage my security where nothing runs without my ok and move
    sites I trust, into different zones. Granted I am slightly above the
    average user level. While educating the user may take time, it takes longer
    to educate them with stupidity and/or paranoia.

    : > One last thing, why would the user be directed to a page informing them
    : > their selections are inadequate for contrast? Who the Hell is looking
    at
    : > this anyway? Isn't it the user? If it's their skinning/personalization
    : > option, then why is the webmaster trying to decide for them? I think
    the
    : OP
    : > just wants to help the user choose the colors that work best together by
    : > letting them know what the available color options are that would
    contrast
    : > the most for a better viewing experience. However, I think the OP,
    while
    : > offering these choices, should not only allow the user to choose a
    : > predetermined pair but also choose any colors they want. Some may like
    : > orange on red. Who am I to deny them that choice? Sounds like fish on
    : > Fridays to me. (O:=
    :
    : The site may contain important information. Issurring that the textual
    : information is legible/visible by restricting the color pallette
    : combinations is not unreasonable.

    If the message were more important than the visual experience, then the
    options would not be made available or shouldn't be. If it were notes from
    a CIA operative, I'm sure it would be black and white... second thought, it
    might be black on black. (O:=

    We can still agree to disagree.

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 3, 2005
    #15
  16. responses inline

    "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "Chris Hohmann" wrote in message
    > news:%...
    > : > "I want to validate if background color is dark then only light colors
    > : > should be entered in text. and vice versa."
    > :
    > : I'm not basing my interpretation on the above statement, I'm basing it

    on
    > : this one:
    > :
    > : "I have got two text fields and i will enter the color codes there."
    >
    > and then he clarified. Is the sum of the parts greater than the sum of

    the
    > whole?


    No, the sum of the parts is not greater than the sum of the whole. To my
    understanding, his clarification (you word not mine) was simply a
    description of what the OP wanted to accomplish on the server-side once he
    hade recieved both color codes.

    > : > "I want to validate if background is dark." Following your

    conclusion,
    > : the
    > : > value has already been selected.
    > :
    > : No, following my conclusion both the background color code and the
    > : foreground color code are sent at the same time.
    >
    > No I'm wrong or no you disagree or both? Isn't that counterproductive?
    > That's like guessing. Why not give all options up front so the user

    chooses
    > once, instead of multiple times?


    Both, you're wrong and I disagree. No, server-side validation is not
    counterproductive. Client-side validation can/should be used for augment
    server-side validation, not the other way around.


    > Pick a background and foreground color.
    > Done.
    > Nah, I didn't like that, try again.
    > Done.
    > Nope. Not gonna' get it. Choose again.
    > Done.
    > You're not really catching onto this are ya'? Try again.
    > Done.
    > Man, you suck. Can you even make out the text on this page? Choose

    again,
    > and Indiana, choose wisely. While the true grail can give you eternal

    life,
    > the false grail will take it from you.
    > Done.
    > Poof! Silly German, you're toast. hehe I warned ya'. NEXT!!!!!


    I'm not sure what you're argument is here. Are you arguing against any
    restrictions on color pallette? Or are you arguing that it should only be
    done client-side? Or is your argument something else entirely?


    > : > "THEN only light colors should be entered in text." The user is
    > entering
    > : > the text, or selecting from a list, but can only enter/select colors
    > that
    > : > are in contrast with the background they have already chosen. To me,
    > this
    > : > means the options have changed based on the first input and the
    > webmaster
    > : > wants to be in control of those options, not the user.
    > :
    > : I don't believe "THEN" in this context is chronilogical. I take it be
    > closer
    > : to the logical equivalent of implication (IF P THEN Q).
    >
    > Skinny dipping in Egypt? Ah, implication, like (IF P THEN SHAKE)


    I have no idea what you're talking about here.


    > : > "and vice versa." This means, to me, if background first, foreground
    > : > options are based upon that color. If foreground color is selected,
    > then
    > : > background options are based upon that color.
    > :
    > : No, I think this means that given two color codes, B and F, you need to
    > : check whether B is not light enough compared to F and also whether B is
    > not
    > : dark enough compared to F.
    >
    > But, I think he wants to get to this point, so only good options are
    > available.
    >


    This is where our intepretations diverge. You think he's describing a two
    step process, I don't.


    > : > His email to Adrienne, parallels what I just wrote.
    > :
    > : No it doesn't. The first line from hthe quoted email indicates that
    > Adrienne
    > : got it right, which is the scenario I described.
    >
    > IYO. Since when does an apple = an orange?


    An apple does not equal an orange. The first line of the quoted email says
    the following:

    "[Adrienne] you got the problem right."

    Adrienne's solution was a form with two (2) select controls, one for
    foreground color code and one for background color code. This is consistent
    with a scenario where both color codes are submitted at the same time. It is
    also in direct opposition to your two phase interpretation.


    > : > >you got the problem right. I will tell the scenario also i am

    building
    > a
    > : > >website where the users can choose there
    > : > >own color combinations.so when the user selects a color and if it is
    > : > >bright
    > : > >color say he has selected the background color then the next

    selection
    > : > >should be
    > : > >light color so that the combination looks good,
    >
    > Perhaps you're still only using parts.. "WHEN the user selects...THEN the
    > next selection..." HELLO? Is this thing on? Two selections, one

    following
    > the other.


    No, I'm using the whole thing. While the grammar is poor, I believe the OP
    meant "when the user selects... then the OTHER selection..." Hello. Yes,
    this thing is on. No, two selections, submitted simultaneously as indicated
    by the quoted email and Adrienne's posted form code.


    > : > This could be a simple list or numerous rectangles/squares on a page

    of
    > : the
    > : > color they selected with all of the available options for the
    > contrasting
    > : > color for the text. The user could then select the one they want and
    > THIS
    > : > could then be added to a database.
    > :
    > : That's one way to approach it, but I don't believe that's what's being
    > : described here.
    >
    > You're right. It's not being described that way. I think he's looking

    for
    > a solution. He only has a final outcome realized and is asking for the

    path
    > to get there. IMHO, if he wants the easiest solution for the user, since
    > his goal is, IMHO, to make their life easier in setting their color
    > setttings in their profiles for background, foreground, button colors and
    > links, it would be offer options in either a list or a color wheel,

    pattern,
    > atlas, etc.
    >
    > Background: black
    > Foreground Options: white, yellow, cyan, etc.
    >
    > Foreground: Black
    > Background Options: white, yellow, cyan, light[any color], etc.
    >
    > These could be SELECTs but a visual of all examples would make it eaiser

    for
    > the user. The guess has thus been removed and no reason to make a

    decision
    > more than once unless you just change your mind, like women.


    What you feel, IYHO, is the easiest solution for the user is beside the
    point. You're original assertion was that "it's a
    client-side issue, not an ASP one." This assestion was wrong. The OP was in
    fact looking for a way to validate background/foreground color codes on the
    server-side.


    > While this is what I'm referring to:
    > http://wellstyled.com/tools/colorscheme2/index-en.html
    >
    > I think he can make a list of light colors and a list of dark colors.

    When
    > the user selects one from one list for background, then links text, button
    > colors should only be offered from the other list. That may be too

    simple.

    It is too simple. But more importantly, it's besides the point.


    > : > I think I've actually seen this somewhere before and it was done all
    > : > client-side. It could be done server-side but I think it would be a
    > waste
    > : > to do so. We may have to agree to disagree on this one because I just
    > : can't
    > : > see his comments as anything else.
    > :
    > : Some users have client-side scripting disabled.
    >
    > Some users don't get much use out of the net. Some users don't use IE to
    > browse. Most of these users still read all their mail in RTF or HTML
    > embedded format. In the immortal words of Ricky Ricardo, "I dunt."


    Can you site the source for the above assertion? Despite your personal
    browser setting preferences, the OP may in fact need concern himslef with
    users who have javascript disabled.


    > I, on the other hand, don't depend on my browser to be my only level of
    > security. I manage my security where nothing runs without my ok and move
    > sites I trust, into different zones. Granted I am slightly above the
    > average user level. While educating the user may take time, it takes

    longer
    > to educate them with stupidity and/or paranoia.


    Congratulations. I'd be interested to learn what you feel is stupid and/or
    paranoid about disabling javascript.


    > : > One last thing, why would the user be directed to a page informing

    them
    > : > their selections are inadequate for contrast? Who the Hell is looking
    > at
    > : > this anyway? Isn't it the user? If it's their

    skinning/personalization
    > : > option, then why is the webmaster trying to decide for them? I think
    > the
    > : OP
    > : > just wants to help the user choose the colors that work best together

    by
    > : > letting them know what the available color options are that would
    > contrast
    > : > the most for a better viewing experience. However, I think the OP,
    > while
    > : > offering these choices, should not only allow the user to choose a
    > : > predetermined pair but also choose any colors they want. Some may

    like
    > : > orange on red. Who am I to deny them that choice? Sounds like fish

    on
    > : > Fridays to me. (O:=
    > :
    > : The site may contain important information. Issurring that the textual
    > : information is legible/visible by restricting the color pallette
    > : combinations is not unreasonable.
    >
    > If the message were more important than the visual experience, then the
    > options would not be made available or shouldn't be. If it were notes

    from
    > a CIA operative, I'm sure it would be black and white... second thought,

    it
    > might be black on black. (O:=


    A balance can be struck between legibility and personalization. One tool
    useful in insuring this balance is a discreet set of high contrast
    pallettes.


    > We can still agree to disagree.


    No, we can't.


    > --
    > Roland Hall
    > /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    > without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    > or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    > Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    > WSH 5.6 Documentation -

    http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    > MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    >
    >
    Chris Hohmann, Mar 3, 2005
    #16
  17. Vinod

    Roland Hall Guest

    "Chris Hohmann" wrote in message
    news:...
    : responses inline
    : No, the sum of the parts is not greater than the sum of the whole. To my
    : understanding, his clarification (you word not mine) was simply a
    : description of what the OP wanted to accomplish on the server-side once he
    : hade recieved both color codes.

    Funny, I thought the object was to help and educate, just just provide an
    answer. However, to each his own.

    : Both, you're wrong and I disagree. No, server-side validation is not
    : counterproductive. Client-side validation can/should be used for augment
    : server-side validation, not the other way around.

    Well, then the discussion is over. We're not debating the same subject.
    I'm stating what I think is best for the user, since the goal is to make it
    easy for the user. You're trying to provide an answer which will not make
    it easy for the user. If the user has to choose a color scheme more than
    once just to please the webmaster, then it's a waste of time to even offer
    it. Would you want to keep picking colors until you got it right?

    : I'm not sure what you're argument is here. Are you arguing against any
    : restrictions on color pallette? Or are you arguing that it should only be
    : done client-side? Or is your argument something else entirely?

    Something else entirely.

    : I have no idea what you're talking about here.

    That seems to be the topic of discussion.

    : This is where our intepretations diverge. You think he's describing a two
    : step process, I don't.

    I have spent years providing solutions for my customers. If I had given
    them what they asked for, based on their knowledge, none of them would have
    been happy. I believe it to be beneficial to inform them of the
    possibilities so their choices are not limited.

    : An apple does not equal an orange. The first line of the quoted email says
    : the following:
    :
    : "[Adrienne] you got the problem right."
    :
    : Adrienne's solution was a form with two (2) select controls, one for
    : foreground color code and one for background color code. This is
    consistent
    : with a scenario where both color codes are submitted at the same time. It
    is
    : also in direct opposition to your two phase interpretation.

    Chris... two select controls is two, not one. When you select one, the
    other list changes based on the choice of the first. If he only lists the
    same colors in both lists and wants to evaluate it after they make a
    selection to see if he will allow it, that's ridiculous. That is similar to
    saying, "If you choose 1-10 on the first list, you need to pick 11-20 on the
    second list. Then he gives them the choice of 1-20 on both lists and if the
    user picks on the second 1-10, he reports and error and asks them to do it
    again. However, if he only offers 11-20 once a color between 1-10 is
    selected on the first list, he has actually helped the user instead of
    wasting their time. I can't make it any clearer than that.

    : No, I'm using the whole thing. While the grammar is poor, I believe the OP
    : meant "when the user selects... then the OTHER selection..." Hello. Yes,
    : this thing is on. No, two selections, submitted simultaneously as
    indicated
    : by the quoted email and Adrienne's posted form code.

    I'm discussing options before the post and you're arguing the post is a
    single task.

    : What you feel, IYHO, is the easiest solution for the user is beside the
    : point. You're original assertion was that "it's a
    : client-side issue, not an ASP one." This assestion was wrong. The OP was
    in
    : fact looking for a way to validate background/foreground color codes on
    the
    : server-side.

    The OP stated type in, not select. Adrienne said select. The OP may not
    know javascript but as you say, if the user has it turned off, then that
    won't work. I don't disagree with that but then the user should pick a
    color and submit. Then a list will be offered with only the colors that
    will work well with that first color they chose. That makes sense.

    To choose two colors and then be told, choose again because the webmaster
    doesn't think that is a good combination, could leave the user selecting
    over an over. If the original goal is to help the user, how did the user
    benefit from that scenario?

    : It is too simple. But more importantly, it's besides the point.

    I know. The point is control the user without telling them the rules and
    then keep them guessing until they get it right. Got it.

    : Can you site the source for the above assertion? Despite your personal
    : browser setting preferences, the OP may in fact need concern himslef with
    : users who have javascript disabled.

    We can guess all day long or the OP can join in.

    : > I, on the other hand, don't depend on my browser to be my only level of
    : > security. I manage my security where nothing runs without my ok and
    move
    : > sites I trust, into different zones. Granted I am slightly above the
    : > average user level. While educating the user may take time, it takes
    : longer
    : > to educate them with stupidity and/or paranoia.
    :
    : Congratulations. I'd be interested to learn what you feel is stupid and/or
    : paranoid about disabling javascript.

    You've misinterpreted everything else I've said so why should this be any
    different.

    Which part of this implies what you just said?

    : > I, on the other hand, don't depend on my browser to be my only level of
    : > security.

    I think it is stupid and paranoid to disable javascript and think by doing
    that, you're secure. I think it is stupid to think because you have a
    firewall, you're protected. I have this argument over and over again with
    those who are primarily developers. They think because they can program in
    a particular language, they know everything about network and network
    security. I wouldn't give most of them a C+ at the application level alone.
    Knowing how to defend attacks against your code does not protect your box,
    your router, your wire, your interconnectivity or your users.
    :
    : A balance can be struck between legibility and personalization. One tool
    : useful in insuring this balance is a discreet set of high contrast
    : pallettes.

    I can't believe you just suggested what I've been saying and not realize it.

    : > We can still agree to disagree.
    :
    : No, we can't.

    Well, that's where I'm leaving it. I'm tired of repeating myself as you're
    probably tired of reading it. If you feel the need to respond, go ahead but
    I'm done with this thread. I'm here to participate, learn and help where I
    can. If I am told I'm missing it and I'm wrong, then obviously I'm not
    helping.

    Thanks for the discussion.

    --
    Roland Hall
    /* This information is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
    without any warranty; without even the implied warranty of merchantability
    or fitness for a particular purpose. */
    Technet Script Center - http://www.microsoft.com/technet/scriptcenter/
    WSH 5.6 Documentation - http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/list/webdev.asp
    MSDN Library - http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp
    Roland Hall, Mar 4, 2005
    #17
  18. Responses inline.

    "Roland Hall" <nobody@nowhere> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "Chris Hohmann" wrote in message
    > news:...
    > : responses inline
    > : No, the sum of the parts is not greater than the sum of the whole. To my
    > : understanding, his clarification (you word not mine) was simply a
    > : description of what the OP wanted to accomplish on the server-side once

    he
    > : hade recieved both color codes.
    >
    > Funny, I thought the object was to help and educate, just just provide an
    > answer. However, to each his own.


    The object is to help and educate. That's difficult to do when you tell the
    OP that his question is a client-side issue. This is a newsgroup concerning
    itself with a server-side technology. You statement was tantamount to
    telling the OP that he didn't belong here and that he should seek his answer
    elsewhere.


    > : Both, you're wrong and I disagree. No, server-side validation is not
    > : counterproductive. Client-side validation can/should be used for augment
    > : server-side validation, not the other way around.
    >
    > Well, then the discussion is over. We're not debating the same subject.
    > I'm stating what I think is best for the user, since the goal is to make

    it
    > easy for the user. You're trying to provide an answer which will not make
    > it easy for the user. If the user has to choose a color scheme more than
    > once just to please the webmaster, then it's a waste of time to even offer
    > it. Would you want to keep picking colors until you got it right?


    The discussion was over quite some time ago. You're correct, we are no
    longer debating the same subject. You've deftly steered the debate to the
    merits of client-side validation, while I stubbornly refuse to budge from
    the original debate. Namely, that the OP's original question was and
    continues to be a server-side validation issue, contrary to your prior
    assertion that it was a client-side issue. I'd be happy to move on to a
    debate on the merits of client-side validation once the original issue has
    been settled. I imagine the debate would be brief as I have no problems with
    client-side validation, so long as it is an augmentation of server-side
    validation.


    > : I'm not sure what you're argument is here. Are you arguing against any
    > : restrictions on color pallette? Or are you arguing that it should only

    be
    > : done client-side? Or is your argument something else entirely?
    >
    > Something else entirely.


    Thanks for clarifying.


    > : I have no idea what you're talking about here.
    >
    > That seems to be the topic of discussion.


    No, witty banter aside, the topic of discussion was validating contrast
    levels of color codes.


    > : This is where our intepretations diverge. You think he's describing a

    two
    > : step process, I don't.
    >
    > I have spent years providing solutions for my customers. If I had given
    > them what they asked for, based on their knowledge, none of them would

    have
    > been happy. I believe it to be beneficial to inform them of the
    > possibilities so their choices are not limited.


    Good for you.


    > : An apple does not equal an orange. The first line of the quoted email

    says
    > : the following:
    > :
    > : "[Adrienne] you got the problem right."
    > :
    > : Adrienne's solution was a form with two (2) select controls, one for
    > : foreground color code and one for background color code. This is
    > consistent
    > : with a scenario where both color codes are submitted at the same time.

    It
    > is
    > : also in direct opposition to your two phase interpretation.
    >
    > Chris... two select controls is two, not one. When you select one, the
    > other list changes based on the choice of the first. If he only lists the
    > same colors in both lists and wants to evaluate it after they make a
    > selection to see if he will allow it, that's ridiculous. That is similar

    to
    > saying, "If you choose 1-10 on the first list, you need to pick 11-20 on

    the
    > second list. Then he gives them the choice of 1-20 on both lists and if

    the
    > user picks on the second 1-10, he reports and error and asks them to do it
    > again. However, if he only offers 11-20 once a color between 1-10 is
    > selected on the first list, he has actually helped the user instead of
    > wasting their time. I can't make it any clearer than that.


    Roland... you're correct, two select controls are two, not one. And once
    server-side validation is put in place to verify those two color codes have
    a sufficient contrast level, I'd be happy to entertain the idea of
    implementing client-side validation. But only as an augmentation to the
    existing server-side validation.


    > : No, I'm using the whole thing. While the grammar is poor, I believe the

    OP
    > : meant "when the user selects... then the OTHER selection..." Hello. Yes,
    > : this thing is on. No, two selections, submitted simultaneously as
    > indicated
    > : by the quoted email and Adrienne's posted form code.
    >
    > I'm discussing options before the post and you're arguing the post is a
    > single task.


    I'm arguing that the OP's original question is in fact a server-side issue
    which can and should be addressed there. Once the server-side validation is
    accomplished the OP is free to implement additional client-side validations
    as he sees fit. If fact, I would encourage that he do so and seek advise on
    the matter in an appropriate client-side forum.


    > : What you feel, IYHO, is the easiest solution for the user is beside the
    > : point. You're original assertion was that "it's a
    > : client-side issue, not an ASP one." This assestion was wrong. The OP was
    > in
    > : fact looking for a way to validate background/foreground color codes on
    > the
    > : server-side.
    >
    > The OP stated type in, not select. Adrienne said select. The OP may not
    > know javascript but as you say, if the user has it turned off, then that
    > won't work. I don't disagree with that but then the user should pick a
    > color and submit. Then a list will be offered with only the colors that
    > will work well with that first color they chose. That makes sense.


    Your two phase process may make sense, but it does not eliminate the need
    for server-side validation nor is it in line with how the problem was
    originally describe, i.e.. with two color code controls on the same form.


    > To choose two colors and then be told, choose again because the webmaster
    > doesn't think that is a good combination, could leave the user selecting
    > over an over. If the original goal is to help the user, how did the user
    > benefit from that scenario?


    The user benefited by being informed that his color selections would make
    text illegible. If the OP feels the user needs further assistance, he's free
    to implement whatever response to invalid color combinations he deems
    sufficient. It does not change the fact that, at a minimum, validation
    should occur at the server.

    > : It is too simple. But more importantly, it's besides the point.
    >
    > I know. The point is control the user without telling them the rules and
    > then keep them guessing until they get it right. Got it.


    No, that's not the point. No, you didn't get it.


    > : Can you site the source for the above assertion? Despite your personal
    > : browser setting preferences, the OP may in fact need concern himslef

    with
    > : users who have javascript disabled.
    >
    > We can guess all day long or the OP can join in.


    Yes, those are two viable options. But it does not answer the question.


    > : > I, on the other hand, don't depend on my browser to be my only level

    of
    > : > security. I manage my security where nothing runs without my ok and
    > move
    > : > sites I trust, into different zones. Granted I am slightly above the
    > : > average user level. While educating the user may take time, it takes
    > : longer
    > : > to educate them with stupidity and/or paranoia.
    > :
    > : Congratulations. I'd be interested to learn what you feel is stupid

    and/or
    > : paranoid about disabling javascript.
    >
    > You've misinterpreted everything else I've said so why should this be any
    > different.
    >
    > Which part of this implies what you just said?
    >
    > : > I, on the other hand, don't depend on my browser to be my only level

    of
    > : > security.


    That part doesn't. This part does...
    "While educating the user may take time, it takes longer to educate them
    with stupidity and/or paranoia."

    You also state it in the very next line below.


    > I think it is stupid and paranoid to disable javascript and think by doing
    > that, you're secure. I think it is stupid to think because you have a
    > firewall, you're protected. I have this argument over and over again with
    > those who are primarily developers. They think because they can program

    in
    > a particular language, they know everything about network and network
    > security. I wouldn't give most of them a C+ at the application level

    alone.
    > Knowing how to defend attacks against your code does not protect your box,
    > your router, your wire, your interconnectivity or your users.
    > :
    > : A balance can be struck between legibility and personalization. One tool
    > : useful in insuring this balance is a discreet set of high contrast
    > : pallettes.
    >
    > I can't believe you just suggested what I've been saying and not realize

    it.

    No need to believe it, it's not true. I'm not suggesting what you've been
    saying. I'm suggesting that the OP's original question was a server-side
    issue, not a client-side issue as you assert. As such, it was posted to an
    appropriate forum and deserves our attention.


    > : > We can still agree to disagree.
    > :
    > : No, we can't.
    >
    > Well, that's where I'm leaving it. I'm tired of repeating myself as

    you're
    > probably tired of reading it. If you feel the need to respond, go ahead

    but
    > I'm done with this thread. I'm here to participate, learn and help where

    I
    > can. If I am told I'm missing it and I'm wrong, then obviously I'm not
    > helping.


    Please reconsider. Take the weekend to rest up, then we can start arguing
    again on Monday. I am tire of reading this thread, so I could use the rest
    as well. I don't doubt you good intentions, just the effects. You are
    missing it, you are wrong and you're not helping, but it takes a big man to
    admit it. You are to be commended. You're a bigger man than I.


    > Thanks for the discussion.


    You're welcome.
    Chris Hohmann, Mar 4, 2005
    #18
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