Coming from .NET and VB and C

Discussion in 'Python' started by ToPostMustJoinGroup22, Sep 3, 2008.

  1. I'm coming from a .NET, VB, C background.

    C was good, and VB was better (with all of its libraries). Than .NET
    came along and all the libraries you can require are ready to go. I
    have no preference with MySQL or SQL, stored procedures or ad-hoc
    queries.

    SO, I'm interested in using my Google App space (free 500MB) to
    develop a quick database application. Using Python. I found "Dive
    Into Python" which I will be reading shortly.

    Any suggestions for someone new to the scene like me?
    ToPostMustJoinGroup22, Sep 3, 2008
    #1
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  2. 2008/9/3 ToPostMustJoinGroup22 <>:
    > Any suggestions for someone new to the scene like me?


    Welcome!

    There's a number of resources that you might find useful here:
    http://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide

    --
    Cheers,
    Simon B.
    Simon Brunning, Sep 3, 2008
    #2
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  3. ToPostMustJoinGroup22

    Eric Wertman Guest

    > Using Python. I found "Dive Into Python" which I will be reading shortly

    The title of the book is good advice all by itself. Especially with
    prior programming experience, you'll get started very quickly. What
    will take longer is the assimilation of some of python's neater and
    more idiomatic features, like list comprehensions and generators.
    Also, the fact that strings are immutable threw me off a little the
    first day or two.

    If you stick with it, I think you'll find those little things to be
    your favorite parts though. Certainly I use list comprehensions all
    the time now, when I used to not use them at all.

    In about 90% or more of cases, you can avoid doing things that you do
    routinely in other languages.. mostly by iterating directly over
    things you don't need counter variables or intermediate variable
    names. In fact, I find myself going back through old code and
    removing variables pretty frequently.

    I'm sure there's a lot more. Personally I find it a lot of fun to code in.
    Eric Wertman, Sep 3, 2008
    #3
  4. ToPostMustJoinGroup22 a écrit :
    > I'm coming from a .NET, VB, C background.
    >
    > C was good, and VB was better (with all of its libraries). Than .NET
    > came along and all the libraries you can require are ready to go. I
    > have no preference with MySQL or SQL, stored procedures or ad-hoc
    > queries.
    >
    > SO, I'm interested in using my Google App space (free 500MB) to
    > develop a quick database application. Using Python. I found "Dive
    > Into Python" which I will be reading shortly.
    >
    > Any suggestions for someone new to the scene like me?


    The worst thing you could would be to try to write VB in Python. While
    Python may not - for someone coming from more mainstream languages -
    look as weird as Lisp or Haskell or etc..., it's really a totally
    different beast. Lurking here, trying to answer other's persons
    questions, and reading other peoples solution might be a good way to
    learn idiomatic Python.
    Bruno Desthuilliers, Sep 3, 2008
    #4
  5. 2008/9/3 Dennis Lee Bieber <>:

    > non-relational DBMS (if any such are still in use),


    There certainly are...

    >> SO, I'm interested in using my Google App space (free 500MB) to
    >> develop a quick database application. Using Python. I found "Dive
    >> Into Python" which I will be reading shortly.
    >>

    > So one question: what RDBMs are supported in that space?


    .... and the Google's BigTable (see
    <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BigTable>) is one of them.

    --
    Cheers,
    Simon B.
    Simon Brunning, Sep 4, 2008
    #5
  6. On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 12:16 AM, Dennis Lee Bieber
    <> wrote:
    > On Wed, 3 Sep 2008 09:52:06 -0700 (PDT), ToPostMustJoinGroup22
    > <> declaimed the following in
    > comp.lang.python:
    >
    >> have no preference with MySQL or SQL, stored procedures or ad-hoc
    >> queries.
    >>

    > Please note: MySQL is specific relational database management system
    > (RDBMs), which uses a dialect of structured query language (SQL). SQL by
    > itself is just a semi-standardized query language -- and can technically
    > be used to access non-relational DBMS (if any such are still in use),
    > though the query processor would be a pain to program (map a relational
    > join into a hierarchical DBMS schema? ugh).
    >
    >> SO, I'm interested in using my Google App space (free 500MB) to
    >> develop a quick database application. Using Python. I found "Dive
    >> Into Python" which I will be reading shortly.
    >>

    > So one question: what RDBMs are supported in that space?


    The appearance is not an RDBMS, at least, maybe it is, but under the surface.

    Looks more that you've persistent objects with a SQL-like language to
    query them.

    Regards
    Marco


    --
    Marco Bizzarri
    http://notenotturne.blogspot.com/
    http://iliveinpisa.blogspot.com/
    Marco Bizzarri, Sep 4, 2008
    #6
  7. Marco Bizzarri a écrit :
    > On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 12:16 AM, Dennis Lee Bieber
    > <> wrote:
    >> On Wed, 3 Sep 2008 09:52:06 -0700 (PDT), ToPostMustJoinGroup22
    >> <> declaimed the following in
    >> comp.lang.python:
    >>
    >>> have no preference with MySQL or SQL, stored procedures or ad-hoc
    >>> queries.
    >>>

    >> Please note: MySQL is specific relational database management system
    >> (RDBMs), which uses a dialect of structured query language (SQL). SQL by
    >> itself is just a semi-standardized query language -- and can technically
    >> be used to access non-relational DBMS (if any such are still in use),
    >> though the query processor would be a pain to program (map a relational
    >> join into a hierarchical DBMS schema? ugh).
    >>
    >>> SO, I'm interested in using my Google App space (free 500MB) to
    >>> develop a quick database application. Using Python. I found "Dive
    >>> Into Python" which I will be reading shortly.
    >>>

    >> So one question: what RDBMs are supported in that space?

    >
    > The appearance is not an RDBMS, at least, maybe it is, but under the surface.


    Not AFAIK, cf:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BigTable
    Bruno Desthuilliers, Sep 4, 2008
    #7
  8. Marco Bizzarri, Sep 4, 2008
    #8
  9. ToPostMustJoinGroup22

    Guest

    BigTable looks great! There's a 3% performance hit for these types of
    databases. However it makes up for it in other ways.

    "Dive Into Python" seems to suggest there is less busy work, but I am
    still looking into the GUI components of Python. Say, a grid of 10x10
    tiles of PNGs.


    _______________________________________________________________________________
    > have no preference with MySQL or SQL, stored procedures or ad-hoc
    > queries.


    Please note: MySQL is specific relational database management
    system
    (RDBMs), which uses a dialect of structured query language (SQL). SQL
    by
    itself is just a semi-standardized query language -- and can
    technically
    be used to access non-relational DBMS (if any such are still in use),
    though the query processor would be a pain to program (map a
    relational
    join into a hierarchical DBMS schema? ugh).
    > SO, I'm interested in using my Google App space (free 500MB) to
    > develop a quick database application. Using Python. I found "Dive
    > Into Python" which I will be reading shortly.


    So one question: what RDBMs are supported in that space?
    --
    Wulfraed Dennis Lee Bieber KD6MOG
    , Sep 9, 2008
    #9
  10. ToPostMustJoinGroup22

    sturlamolden Guest

    On 3 Sep, 18:52, ToPostMustJoinGroup22 <>
    wrote:

    > I'm coming from a .NET, VB, C background.


    > Any suggestions for someone new to the scene like me?



    Welcome! Unfortunately, you probably have a lot of bad habits to
    unlearn. Don't use Python like another C, VB or Java. It will cause a
    lot of grief, and you'll end up with the idea that Python is slow like
    a slug. Python is more like Lisp or Haskell, but with a readable
    syntax. There are list comprehensions, generator expressions,
    dictionaries, sets, lists, list slicing, lambdas, map, reduce, filter,
    closures, etc. They are there to be used, and be used a lot. Learning
    to use Python efficiently is what has the steepest learning curve.
    sturlamolden, Sep 9, 2008
    #10
  11. ToPostMustJoinGroup22

    timh Guest

    Hi

    What do you mean by a 3% performance hit? And compared to what ?

    Any performance hit or for that matter
    a performance improvement would very much dependant on the problem
    domain
    , how it maps to the data store and what you are trying to do with it,
    and
    your choice of algorithms.

    T

    On Sep 9, 8:02 am, wrote:
    > BigTable looks great!  There's a 3% performance hit for these types of
    > databases.  However it makes up for it in other ways.
    >
    > "Dive Into Python" seems to suggest there is less busy work, but I am
    > still looking into the GUI components of Python.  Say, a grid of 10x10
    > tiles of PNGs.
    >
    > _______________________________________________________________________________
    >
    > > have no preference with MySQL or SQL, stored procedures or ad-hoc
    > > queries.

    >
    >         Please note: MySQL is specific relational database management
    > system
    > (RDBMs), which uses a dialect of structured query language (SQL). SQL
    > by
    > itself is just a semi-standardized query language -- and can
    > technically
    > be used to access non-relational DBMS (if any such are still in use),
    > though the query processor would be a pain to program (map a
    > relational
    > join into a hierarchical DBMS schema? ugh).
    >
    > > SO, I'm interested in using my Google App space (free 500MB) to
    > > develop a quick database application.  Using Python.  I found "Dive
    > > Into Python" which I will be reading shortly.

    >
    >         So one question: what RDBMs are supported in that space?
    > --
    >         Wulfraed        Dennis Lee Bieber               KD6MOG
    timh, Sep 9, 2008
    #11
  12. [OT] top-posting and quoting (was: Re: Coming from .NET and VB andC)

    Could you please timh and belindelof learn to quote properly and stop
    top-posting ?

    TIA
    Bruno Desthuilliers, Sep 9, 2008
    #12
  13. ToPostMustJoinGroup22

    castironpi Guest

    On Sep 8, 9:31 pm, sturlamolden <> wrote:
    > On 3 Sep, 18:52, ToPostMustJoinGroup22 <>
    > wrote:
    >
    > > I'm coming from a .NET, VB, C background.
    > > Any suggestions for someone new to the scene like me?

    >
    > Welcome! Unfortunately, you probably have a lot of bad habits to
    > unlearn. Don't use Python like another C, VB or Java. It will cause a
    > lot of grief, and you'll end up with the idea that Python is slow like
    > a slug. Python is more like Lisp or Haskell, but with a readable
    > syntax. There are list comprehensions, generator expressions,
    > dictionaries, sets, lists, list slicing, lambdas, map, reduce, filter,
    > closures, etc. They are there to be used, and be used a lot. Learning
    > to use Python efficiently is what has the steepest learning curve.


    Variable argument lists, first-class function objects.
    castironpi, Sep 10, 2008
    #13
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