Crystal Reports .NET Is Utterly Shite

Discussion in 'ASP .Net' started by Mark Roberts, Jun 26, 2003.

  1. Mark Roberts

    Mark Roberts Guest

    I have enjoyed using .NET, and C# very much and XCOPY deployment is a
    dream.

    Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything that
    DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    designed (push or pull model anyone???).

    But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've had
    the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky if
    it actually works ok.

    I've just had IIS crashing on me after trying to display current
    parameter values in debug mode, and that's after a day of trying to
    get round it's rubbish and convoluted object model.

    It's a shame that Microsoft let this cancerous little embolism
    anywhere near Visual Studio.

    What utter shite.
    Mark Roberts, Jun 26, 2003
    #1
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  2. Jeff. Do you know of any good documentation for someone who has never
    before laid hands on Crystal Reports?

    --
    Stephajn Craig
    "jeff" <> wrote in message
    news:#HaVtp$...
    > i've found it to be buggy to design reports, but once developed, i've

    found
    > it to be rock solid. ie, once working, always working.
    >
    > jeff
    >
    > "Mark Roberts" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > I have enjoyed using .NET, and C# very much and XCOPY deployment is a
    > > dream.
    > >
    > > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything that
    > > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    > > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    > >
    > > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've had
    > > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky if
    > > it actually works ok.
    > >
    > > I've just had IIS crashing on me after trying to display current
    > > parameter values in debug mode, and that's after a day of trying to
    > > get round it's rubbish and convoluted object model.
    > >
    > > It's a shame that Microsoft let this cancerous little embolism
    > > anywhere near Visual Studio.
    > >
    > > What utter shite.

    >
    >
    Stephajn Craig, Jun 26, 2003
    #2
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  3. Mark Roberts

    jeff Guest

    it's difficult to find. you can get a lot of information from the crystal
    reports web site by searching. the info is hard to find, but usually it's
    there somewhere. i've searched for things, not found it then went back
    later with new search ideas and found it. sometimes i couldn't find it by
    searching their site directly, but did find a link to what i needed from
    searching in yeahoo (a link to crystal reports). it's odd. if you are
    familiar with reports in access, i find them to be very similar, identical
    in many cases.

    jeff

    "Stephajn Craig" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > Jeff. Do you know of any good documentation for someone who has never
    > before laid hands on Crystal Reports?
    >
    > --
    > Stephajn Craig
    > "jeff" <> wrote in message
    > news:#HaVtp$...
    > > i've found it to be buggy to design reports, but once developed, i've

    > found
    > > it to be rock solid. ie, once working, always working.
    > >
    > > jeff
    > >
    > > "Mark Roberts" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > > I have enjoyed using .NET, and C# very much and XCOPY deployment is a
    > > > dream.
    > > >
    > > > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything that
    > > > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    > > > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    > > >
    > > > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've had
    > > > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky if
    > > > it actually works ok.
    > > >
    > > > I've just had IIS crashing on me after trying to display current
    > > > parameter values in debug mode, and that's after a day of trying to
    > > > get round it's rubbish and convoluted object model.
    > > >
    > > > It's a shame that Microsoft let this cancerous little embolism
    > > > anywhere near Visual Studio.
    > > >
    > > > What utter shite.

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    jeff, Jun 26, 2003
    #3
  4. So what kind of search keywords would you suggest for a total newbie to use?

    --
    Stephajn Craig
    "jeff" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > it's difficult to find. you can get a lot of information from the crystal
    > reports web site by searching. the info is hard to find, but usually it's
    > there somewhere. i've searched for things, not found it then went back
    > later with new search ideas and found it. sometimes i couldn't find it by
    > searching their site directly, but did find a link to what i needed from
    > searching in yeahoo (a link to crystal reports). it's odd. if you are
    > familiar with reports in access, i find them to be very similar, identical
    > in many cases.
    >
    > jeff
    >
    > "Stephajn Craig" <> wrote in message
    > news:%...
    > > Jeff. Do you know of any good documentation for someone who has never
    > > before laid hands on Crystal Reports?
    > >
    > > --
    > > Stephajn Craig
    > > "jeff" <> wrote in message
    > > news:#HaVtp$...
    > > > i've found it to be buggy to design reports, but once developed, i've

    > > found
    > > > it to be rock solid. ie, once working, always working.
    > > >
    > > > jeff
    > > >
    > > > "Mark Roberts" <> wrote in message
    > > > news:...
    > > > > I have enjoyed using .NET, and C# very much and XCOPY deployment is

    a
    > > > > dream.
    > > > >
    > > > > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything

    that
    > > > > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    > > > > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    > > > >
    > > > > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've had
    > > > > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky if
    > > > > it actually works ok.
    > > > >
    > > > > I've just had IIS crashing on me after trying to display current
    > > > > parameter values in debug mode, and that's after a day of trying to
    > > > > get round it's rubbish and convoluted object model.
    > > > >
    > > > > It's a shame that Microsoft let this cancerous little embolism
    > > > > anywhere near Visual Studio.
    > > > >
    > > > > What utter shite.
    > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    Stephajn Craig, Jun 26, 2003
    #4
  5. Mark Roberts wrote:
    > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything that
    > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    >
    > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've had
    > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky if
    > it actually works ok.


    Why would one use it? All you need to output reports is HTML and text
    for the most part.
    Michael D. Kersey, Jun 26, 2003
    #5
  6. Mark Roberts

    jeff Guest

    you can probably just browse for info you're looking for. they have a lot
    of samples, which would be good to start. i think .net installs samples
    also, but i've never looked at them. it really isn't all that difficult,
    it's just picky about how it wants certain things done.

    jeff

    "Stephajn Craig" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > So what kind of search keywords would you suggest for a total newbie to

    use?
    >
    > --
    > Stephajn Craig
    > "jeff" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > it's difficult to find. you can get a lot of information from the

    crystal
    > > reports web site by searching. the info is hard to find, but usually

    it's
    > > there somewhere. i've searched for things, not found it then went back
    > > later with new search ideas and found it. sometimes i couldn't find it

    by
    > > searching their site directly, but did find a link to what i needed from
    > > searching in yeahoo (a link to crystal reports). it's odd. if you are
    > > familiar with reports in access, i find them to be very similar,

    identical
    > > in many cases.
    > >
    > > jeff
    > >
    > > "Stephajn Craig" <> wrote in message
    > > news:%...
    > > > Jeff. Do you know of any good documentation for someone who has never
    > > > before laid hands on Crystal Reports?
    > > >
    > > > --
    > > > Stephajn Craig
    > > > "jeff" <> wrote in message
    > > > news:#HaVtp$...
    > > > > i've found it to be buggy to design reports, but once developed,

    i've
    > > > found
    > > > > it to be rock solid. ie, once working, always working.
    > > > >
    > > > > jeff
    > > > >
    > > > > "Mark Roberts" <> wrote in message
    > > > > news:...
    > > > > > I have enjoyed using .NET, and C# very much and XCOPY deployment

    is
    > a
    > > > > > dream.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything

    > that
    > > > > > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    > > > > > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    > > > > >
    > > > > > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've

    had
    > > > > > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky

    if
    > > > > > it actually works ok.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > I've just had IIS crashing on me after trying to display current
    > > > > > parameter values in debug mode, and that's after a day of trying

    to
    > > > > > get round it's rubbish and convoluted object model.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > It's a shame that Microsoft let this cancerous little embolism
    > > > > > anywhere near Visual Studio.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > What utter shite.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    jeff, Jun 26, 2003
    #6
  7. Mark Roberts

    jeff Guest

    it's a heck of a lot easier... it can export to pdf.... you can use the same
    report file for a windows app and an asp.net app.... it supports
    charts/graphs... plenty of reasons.

    jeff

    "Michael D. Kersey" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Mark Roberts wrote:
    > > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything that
    > > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    > > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    > >
    > > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've had
    > > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky if
    > > it actually works ok.

    >
    > Why would one use it? All you need to output reports is HTML and text
    > for the most part.
    jeff, Jun 26, 2003
    #7
  8. It's crufty to the max.

    HTH,

    Kevin Spencer
    Microsoft FrontPage MVP
    Internet Developer
    http://www.takempis.com
    Big things are made up of
    lots of Little things.

    "jeff" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > it's a heck of a lot easier... it can export to pdf.... you can use the

    same
    > report file for a windows app and an asp.net app.... it supports
    > charts/graphs... plenty of reasons.
    >
    > jeff
    >
    > "Michael D. Kersey" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Mark Roberts wrote:
    > > > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond anything that
    > > > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky, badly
    > > > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    > > >
    > > > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've had
    > > > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be lucky if
    > > > it actually works ok.

    > >
    > > Why would one use it? All you need to output reports is HTML and text
    > > for the most part.

    >
    >
    Kevin Spencer, Jun 26, 2003
    #8
  9. Mark Roberts

    jeff Guest

    not a problem. deploying is easy. there are simple, clear instructions
    from crystal reports called "Crystal Reports for Visual Studio .NET
    Application Deployment". It has both web and windows form application
    deployment. other than that, it's like creating a report in access, and
    actually the .net 1.1 version doesn't seem to be nearly as buggy. i haven't
    had a crash yet (biggest problem in 1.0 version for me).

    the problem i had was stupid things like you weren't able to drag/drop
    certain things because it would blow .net up. however, if you double click
    it, then it would work. after learning these things (a quick learner will
    figure out quickly that dragging crashes it so you don't do it), it is a
    breeze.

    jeff

    "Kevin Spencer" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > If you can put together and deploy an ASP.Net Crystal Report in 5 minutes,
    > my hat is off to you!
    >
    > HTH,
    >
    > Kevin Spencer
    > Microsoft FrontPage MVP
    > Internet Developer
    > http://www.takempis.com
    > Big things are made up of
    > lots of Little things.
    >
    > "jeff" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > well, if you find a way to put a chart in an html file in 5 minutes with

    > the
    > > basic tools supplied with .net, you might get me to listen to you.
    > >
    > > jeff
    > >
    > > "Kevin Spencer" <> wrote in message
    > > news:%23$...
    > > > It's crufty to the max.
    > > >
    > > > HTH,
    > > >
    > > > Kevin Spencer
    > > > Microsoft FrontPage MVP
    > > > Internet Developer
    > > > http://www.takempis.com
    > > > Big things are made up of
    > > > lots of Little things.
    > > >
    > > > "jeff" <> wrote in message
    > > > news:...
    > > > > it's a heck of a lot easier... it can export to pdf.... you can use

    > the
    > > > same
    > > > > report file for a windows app and an asp.net app.... it supports
    > > > > charts/graphs... plenty of reasons.
    > > > >
    > > > > jeff
    > > > >
    > > > > "Michael D. Kersey" <> wrote in message
    > > > > news:...
    > > > > > Mark Roberts wrote:
    > > > > > > Until I started to use Crystal Reports. It's crap beyond

    anything
    > > that
    > > > > > > DLL hell ever managed to product. It's buggy, slow, clunky,

    badly
    > > > > > > designed (push or pull model anyone???).
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > But that's not the worst. It a bastard to deploy (esp. if you've

    > had
    > > > > > > the pleasure of going from 2002 to 2003). And then you'd be

    lucky
    > if
    > > > > > > it actually works ok.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Why would one use it? All you need to output reports is HTML and

    > text
    > > > > > for the most part.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    jeff, Jun 26, 2003
    #9
  10. Mark Roberts

    jeff Guest

    i'm just a user of cr.

    how do you think it's difficult to install. just read "Crystal Reports for
    Visual Studio .NET Application Deployment". it puts in very plain english
    the exact steps to deploy. it's about 6 steps. if you follow them (takes
    you no more than 5 minutes to get it setup in .net), it works perfectly
    every time. i don't know why nobody seems to read white papers on how to do
    things.

    jeff

    "Michael D. Kersey" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > jeff wrote:
    > >
    > > it's a heck of a lot easier... it can export to pdf.... you can use the

    same
    > > report file for a windows app and an asp.net app.... it supports
    > > charts/graphs... plenty of reasons.

    >
    > You must be a Crystal Reports employee!-)) They're the only ones pushing
    > the product.
    >
    > Crystal Reports is quite obviously an old Windows/Novell client/server
    > package retrofitted to the WWW market. Crystal Reports is a pain to
    > install and a pain to use. It is unnecessary: one needs only output HTML
    > from ASP to produce reports.
    >
    > FWIW PDF is Adobe's proprietary format and is not a WWW standard at all
    > (I *do* like PDFs for paper documents, but not for the WWW).
    >
    > The company needs to find a useful product to market and quit feeding
    > off the oft-mistaken view of unknowing IT managers and other PHBs that
    > somehow "reports" on the WWW should be anything other than HTML. Taking
    > advantage of the stupidity of customers is NOT a marketing strategy.
    >
    > Good Luck,
    > Michael D. Kersey
    jeff, Jun 27, 2003
    #10
  11. Mark Roberts

    jeff Guest

    plenty of people like pdf, and many documents online are in that format.
    you must see that as an advantage, maybe not to you, but to most users,
    especially since you claim html is all that you need. html printing is
    garbage. you can open a pdf file and print perfect files.

    so, how do you do graphs/charts with html?

    jeff

    "Michael D. Kersey" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > jeff wrote:
    > >
    > > it's a heck of a lot easier... it can export to pdf.... you can use the

    same
    > > report file for a windows app and an asp.net app.... it supports
    > > charts/graphs... plenty of reasons.

    >
    > You must be a Crystal Reports employee!-)) They're the only ones pushing
    > the product.
    >
    > Crystal Reports is quite obviously an old Windows/Novell client/server
    > package retrofitted to the WWW market. Crystal Reports is a pain to
    > install and a pain to use. It is unnecessary: one needs only output HTML
    > from ASP to produce reports.
    >
    > FWIW PDF is Adobe's proprietary format and is not a WWW standard at all
    > (I *do* like PDFs for paper documents, but not for the WWW).
    >
    > The company needs to find a useful product to market and quit feeding
    > off the oft-mistaken view of unknowing IT managers and other PHBs that
    > somehow "reports" on the WWW should be anything other than HTML. Taking
    > advantage of the stupidity of customers is NOT a marketing strategy.
    >
    > Good Luck,
    > Michael D. Kersey
    jeff, Jun 27, 2003
    #11
  12. Mark Roberts

    tom Guest

    "jeff" <> wrote in message news:<ebX3$>...
    > so, how do you do graphs/charts with html?
    > jeff
    > jeff wrote:
    > > so, how do you do graphs/charts with html?


    http://www.aspfaq.com/show.asp?id=2170 has suggestions for charting
    and graphing on the WWW using Microsoft-compatible components and
    tools.
    tom, Jun 28, 2003
    #12
  13. Mark Roberts

    tom Guest

    "Rick" <> wrote in message
    news:<>...
    > "Michael D. Kersey" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Why would one use it? All you need to output reports is HTML and text
    > > for the most part.


    > Youre not serious are you? Have you noticed that HTML produces different
    > results at different resolutions, and even more different results with
    > different browsers? This is just the tip of the iceberg as far as using
    > HTML for reports goes.

    Top-posting is bad etiquette. I have corrected your mistakes. I see
    you are new to WWW by how you post and your old Windows ideas. Maybe
    you go back to Visual Basic and leave WWW alone, OK?

    PDF is proprietary format of Adobe corporation. HTML is W3C standard
    http://www.w3c.org/ and is the language of the WWW. HTML is great for
    reports: millions use it each day.

    You have weird definition of "reports", since you do not use HTML for
    reports, no? Tell us definition of a "report" without using the words
    "HTML" or "PDF" or "Crystal Reports" so we can understand.

    > With CR (which im not a big fan of either, but what
    > else is out there?), at least you get consistent results, and you can export
    > to PDF, which will definitely print correctly.

    You cannot print from the browser?
    Is not Crystal Reports license for that $200 per client?

    Pay more for more trouble, slower response, extra API, new tool to
    learn, and to make users angry with slow PDFs and Crystal Reports? Use
    HTML and be OK.
    tom, Jun 30, 2003
    #13
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