Disappearing RoadRunner messages (Sea Wasp, Keith Thompson)

Discussion in 'C Programming' started by Hallvard B Furuseth, Nov 13, 2007.

  1. Regarding the threads
    comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp

    Sea Wasp's and Keith Thompson's messages have both been disappearing
    from for some people (including me) since 2. or 3. November. Both post
    from RoadRunner. Checking comp.lang.c++, the last message I see there
    with with "X-Complaints-To: " is from 29. October. (There
    were rr postings there though, so it could be a coincidence.)

    Anyway, my bet is on a filter against the sci.crypt sporger, like
    someone mentioned in the threads above.

    Headers from those last three messages as I see them:

    Path: nntp.uio.no!uio.no!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!nx01.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!post02.iad01!roadrunner.com!not-for-mail
    Newsgroups: comp.lang.c
    Subject: Re: Bug/Gross InEfficiency in HeathField's fgetline program
    From: Keith Thompson <>
    Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2007 12:51:41 -0700
    Message-ID: <>
    NNTP-Posting-Host: 75.80.183.54
    X-Complaints-To:

    Path: nntp.uio.no!uio.no!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!nx01.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!post01.iad01!roadrunner.com!not-for-mail
    Message-ID: <>
    Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 09:31:10 -0400
    From: Sea Wasp <>
    Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
    Subject: Re: Booklog October 2007
    NNTP-Posting-Host: 72.226.104.84
    X-Complaints-To:

    Path: nntp.uio.no!uio.no!news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!novia!nx01.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!post01.iad01!roadrunner.com!not-for-mail
    From: "911 Who Really Did It?" <>
    Newsgroups: comp.lang.c++, alt.guitar, rec.games.pinball, misc.writing,
    rec.bicycles.misc
    Subject: Re: THEY WANT YOU DEAD. Watch Alex Jones's ENDGAME - The master plan of the globalist elite is no longer a secret
    Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 10:44:10 -0500
    Message-ID: <4725ff57$0$20586$>
    NNTP-Posting-Host: 72.133.206.236
    X-Complaints-To:

    --
    Regards,
    Hallvard
    Hallvard B Furuseth, Nov 13, 2007
    #1
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  2. In article <>,
    Hallvard B Furuseth <> wrote:
    >Regarding the threads
    > comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    > rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp


    Due to RoadRunner's unwillingness, or inability, to deal with the "sporger,"
    someone has been cancelling every usenet message from rr.com. This is a
    "UseNET Death Penalty," or UDP. This, presumably, is discussed/announced in
    some of the news.admin.net-abuse groups.

    Not every site honours cancels, so some sites will see the messages, while
    others will not.
    Sean Eric Fagan, Nov 13, 2007
    #2
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  3. That'll teach you to use the ACME news server.
    Mike Schilling, Nov 13, 2007
    #3
  4. Hallvard B Furuseth

    Default User Guest

    Hallvard B Furuseth wrote:

    > Regarding the threads
    > comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    > rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp
    >
    > Sea Wasp's and Keith Thompson's messages have both been disappearing
    > from for some people (including me) since 2. or 3. November. Both
    > post from RoadRunner. Checking comp.lang.c++, the last message I see
    > there with with "X-Complaints-To: " is from 29. October.
    > (There were rr postings there though, so it could be a coincidence.)


    I mentioned in CLC hearing something about RR posts being targeted by
    cancelbots in response to the sporge.




    Brian

    --
    If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
    won't shut up.
    -- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)
    Default User, Nov 13, 2007
    #4
  5. "Sean Eric Fagan" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > In article <>,
    > Hallvard B Furuseth <> wrote:
    >>Regarding the threads
    >> comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    >> rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp

    >
    > Due to RoadRunner's unwillingness, or inability, to deal with the
    > "sporger,"
    > someone has been cancelling every usenet message from rr.com. This is a
    > "UseNET Death Penalty," or UDP.


    Oh, *that*'s what UDP means here. I thought it mean "Under the current
    heavy load, it's too expensive to create TCP connections." :).
    Mike Schilling, Nov 13, 2007
    #5
  6. Hallvard B Furuseth

    Don Bruder Guest

    <snippage here and there for space>

    In article <>,
    Hallvard B Furuseth <> wrote:

    > Regarding the threads
    > comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    > rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp
    >
    > Sea Wasp's and Keith Thompson's messages have both been disappearing


    > Anyway, my bet is on a filter against the sci.crypt sporger, like
    > someone mentioned in the threads above.
    >
    > Headers from those last three messages as I see them:


    > NNTP-Posting-Host: 75.80.183.54


    > NNTP-Posting-Host: 72.226.104.84


    > NNTP-Posting-Host: 72.133.206.236


    I'd bet on these NNTP-posting-host entries being the culprit. All three
    are in the range that the sporge-creature has been using heavily. (I
    just added two more (not wildcarded) for him just a few minutes ago.
    Those two wiped his entire crop for me, and touched nothing legit.)

    Interestingly enough, I'm seeing that he's using almost exclusively
    *.rr.com news servers to do his posts. I've got a collection of
    something like 40 filters targeting the NNTP-posting-host line to whack
    this mole. Of those 40-ish, I've actually taken the time to run an
    nslookup against just under half of them, and aside from two that point
    to *.suddenlink.net machines, they all come back to *.rr.com.

    Which means that sporge-boy seems to be exploiting roadrunner's servers.

    Small wonder, since Roadrunner has a PARTICULARLY bad reputation when it
    comes to dealing with 'net abuse reports (basically, they fall into a
    black hole) so I'd bet that some upstream news admin has decided to
    impose a usenet death sentence on Roadrunner.

    (And for my nickel, it's about time - that outfit has been rogue from
    the git-go)


    half of them,

    --
    Don Bruder - - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist,
    or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow"
    somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my
    ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd> for more info
    Don Bruder, Nov 13, 2007
    #6
  7. Default User writes:
    > I mentioned in CLC hearing something about RR posts being targeted by
    > cancelbots in response to the sporge.


    Yes, I saw your message shortly after posting my own:)

    --
    Regards,
    Hallvard
    Hallvard B Furuseth, Nov 13, 2007
    #7
  8. Hallvard B Furuseth

    Sea Wasp Guest

    Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Hallvard B Furuseth <> wrote:
    >
    >>Regarding the threads
    >>comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    >>rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp

    >
    >
    > Due to RoadRunner's unwillingness, or inability, to deal with the "sporger,"
    > someone has been cancelling every usenet message from rr.com.


    How nice of them. Because RR won't do the job, they'll just kill
    everyone -- thus punishing everyone EXCEPT Roadrunner and the sporger,
    of course.

    If the identity of this person is known, convey my fondest wishes
    that they be tied up in front of a television playing nothing but the
    Star Wars Holiday Special. With their eyelids glued open.


    --
    Sea Wasp
    /^\
    ;;;
    Live Journal: http://seawasp.livejournal.com
    Sea Wasp, Nov 14, 2007
    #8
  9. Hallvard B Furuseth

    Default User Guest

    Hallvard B Furuseth wrote:

    > Default User writes:
    > > I mentioned in CLC hearing something about RR posts being targeted
    > > by cancelbots in response to the sporge.

    >
    > Yes, I saw your message shortly after posting my own:)


    I read the original in rasfw, not realizing at the time it was crossed
    to clc.




    Brian
    Default User, Nov 14, 2007
    #9
  10. In article <>, Sea Wasp
    <> wrote:

    > Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    > > In article <>,
    > > Hallvard B Furuseth <> wrote:
    > >
    > >>Regarding the threads
    > >>comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    > >>rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp

    > >
    > >
    > > Due to RoadRunner's unwillingness, or inability, to deal with the "sporger,"
    > > someone has been cancelling every usenet message from rr.com.

    >
    > How nice of them. Because RR won't do the job, they'll just kill
    > everyone -- thus punishing everyone EXCEPT Roadrunner and the sporger,
    > of course.
    >
    > If the identity of this person is known, convey my fondest wishes
    > that they be tied up in front of a television playing nothing but the
    > Star Wars Holiday Special. With their eyelids glued open.


    Sir, you are too kind. Complete reruns of Gilligan's island, with test
    questions afterward. Oh, yes: commercials ARE included. And, no: you
    do not have a "mute" button.

    --
    Chris Henrich
    http://www.mathinteract.com
    "It's our supreme ability and willingness to screw up that is the secret of our
    success."
    -- R. X. Cringely
    Christopher J. Henrich, Nov 14, 2007
    #10
  11. In article <f%m_i.69512$>, Mike
    Schilling <> wrote:

    > That'll teach you to use the ACME news server.
    >
    >

    That's a very wily remark. LOL!

    --
    Chris Henrich
    http://www.mathinteract.com
    Q: Who lives at 668?
    A: The next-door neighbor of the Beast.
    -- (?)Joshua Burton
    Christopher J. Henrich, Nov 14, 2007
    #11
  12. In article <131120072151486183%>,
    "Christopher J. Henrich" <> said:

    > In article <>, Sea Wasp
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >> If the identity of this person is known, convey my fondest wishes
    >> that they be tied up in front of a television playing nothing but
    >> the Star Wars Holiday Special. With their eyelids glued open.

    >
    > Sir, you are too kind. Complete reruns of Gilligan's island, with
    > test questions afterward. Oh, yes: commercials ARE included. And,
    > no: you do not have a "mute" button.


    But hey, you at least get to look at Mary Ann.

    --
    William December Starr <>
    William December Starr, Nov 14, 2007
    #12
  13. Sea Wasp <> wrote:
    >Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    >> Hallvard B Furuseth <> wrote:
    >>>Regarding the threads
    >>>comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    >>>rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp

    >>
    >> Due to RoadRunner's unwillingness, or inability, to deal with the "sporger,"
    >> someone has been cancelling every usenet message from rr.com.

    >
    > How nice of them. Because RR won't do the job, they'll just kill
    >everyone -- thus punishing everyone EXCEPT Roadrunner and the sporger,
    >of course.


    Whereas I've been seeing Sea Wasp's posts and, I think, Thompson's, but also
    the sporger's - but the ones he's sending from rr.com are quite killable, it
    turns out. (Though he seems to have a dynamic IP, so I have to update every
    so often.)

    Dave
    --
    \/David DeLaney posting from "It's not the pot that grows the flower
    It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
    Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
    http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
    David DeLaney, Nov 14, 2007
    #13
  14. Hallvard B Furuseth

    Sea Wasp Guest

    Christopher J. Henrich wrote:
    > In article <>, Sea Wasp
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    >>
    >>>In article <>,
    >>>Hallvard B Furuseth <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>Regarding the threads
    >>>>comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    >>>>rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>Due to RoadRunner's unwillingness, or inability, to deal with the "sporger,"
    >>>someone has been cancelling every usenet message from rr.com.

    >>
    >> How nice of them. Because RR won't do the job, they'll just kill
    >>everyone -- thus punishing everyone EXCEPT Roadrunner and the sporger,
    >>of course.
    >>
    >> If the identity of this person is known, convey my fondest wishes
    >>that they be tied up in front of a television playing nothing but the
    >>Star Wars Holiday Special. With their eyelids glued open.

    >
    >
    > Sir, you are too kind. Complete reruns of Gilligan's island, with test
    > questions afterward. Oh, yes: commercials ARE included. And, no: you
    > do not have a "mute" button.


    Gilligan's Island is sometimes watchable. Some commercials, as well.

    Not so the abomination called the Star Wars Holiday Special. "This
    review might make it sound like it's so bad it's good, and maybe in
    some ways it is, but in most other ways it's like putting live hornets
    in your ass."

    "... and just when you think this show couldn't hurt you any worse
    unless the tape were ejected from the VCR at high speed straight into
    your face... Carrie Fisher starts to sing."

    >




    --
    Sea Wasp
    /^\
    ;;;
    Live Journal: http://seawasp.livejournal.com
    Sea Wasp, Nov 14, 2007
    #14
  15. In article <>,
    David DeLaney <> wrote:
    >Sea Wasp <> wrote:
    >>Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    >> How nice of them. Because RR won't do the job, they'll just kill
    >>everyone -- thus punishing everyone EXCEPT Roadrunner and the sporger,
    >>of course.


    Because RR won't do the job they're supposed to, why should they be allowed to
    participate?

    UseNET is entirely cooperative. If you don't play by the rules, there are
    plenty of people who *will*, and RR could farm out to them.

    Instead, they're allowing spamming, out of pure laziness.

    Sorry. I have no sympathy for RR users who choose to keep supporting a
    spam-friendly organization.
    Sean Eric Fagan, Nov 14, 2007
    #15
  16. Hallvard B Furuseth wrote:
    > Regarding the threads
    > comp.lang.c: Keith Thompson's messages dont come through
    > rec.arts.sf.written: The Strange Case of the Invisible Wasp
    >
    > Sea Wasp's and Keith Thompson's messages have both been disappearing
    > from for some people (including me) since 2. or 3. November. Both
    > post
    > from RoadRunner. Checking comp.lang.c++, the last message I see there
    > with with "X-Complaints-To: " is from 29. October. (There
    > were rr postings there though, so it could be a coincidence.)
    >
    > Anyway, my bet is on a filter against the sci.crypt sporger, like
    > someone mentioned in the threads above.
    >

    Sea Wasp's posts only started going missing for me in the last couple of
    days. I thought is was just something in my filters. I'm glad it wasn't my
    own stupidity.

    --
    "I reject your reality and substitute my own."
    "Now, quack, damn you!"
    James Gassaway, Nov 14, 2007
    #16
  17. Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > David DeLaney <> wrote:
    >> Sea Wasp <> wrote:
    >>> Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    >>> How nice of them. Because RR won't do the job, they'll just kill
    >>> everyone -- thus punishing everyone EXCEPT Roadrunner and the sporger,
    >>> of course.

    >
    > Because RR won't do the job they're supposed to, why should they be allowed to
    > participate?
    >
    > UseNET is entirely cooperative. If you don't play by the rules, there are
    > plenty of people who *will*, and RR could farm out to them.
    >
    > Instead, they're allowing spamming, out of pure laziness.
    >
    > Sorry. I have no sympathy for RR users who choose to keep supporting a
    > spam-friendly organization.


    I agree (mostly). The UDP (Usenet Death Penalty) is, as I understand
    it, used only as a last resort, when a provider utterly fails to exhibit
    the cooperation that's necessary for the whole thing to work. Though
    it's a considerable inconvenience to me personally, a quick look at
    sci.crypt convinces me that it's necessary.

    See <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usenet_Death_Penalty>. (Insert
    standard disclaimer about the reliability of Wikipedia, but the
    information in the article agrees with what I already knew.)

    I've been a Roadrunner customer for a number of years; I didn't find out
    about their failure to police their users until a few days ago.
    Unfortunately, they're the only reasonable high-speed ISP available to
    me. I'll do what I can to call their attention to this (I've sent them
    several complaints, and I'll continue to do so if they don't fix this).
    I can stop using their Usenet service, but that won't have any impact
    on their bottom line, since it's bundled with the rest of their Internet
    service.

    The whole point of a UDP, after all, is to encourage the offending ISP's
    customers to pressure it to comply, not to drive the ISP out of business.

    --
    Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) <>
    Looking for software development work in the San Diego area.
    "We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
    Keith Thompson, Nov 14, 2007
    #17
  18. Hallvard B Furuseth

    Keith Willis Guest

    On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 01:20:02 -0800, Keith Thompson <>
    wrote:

    > I can stop using their Usenet service, but that won't have any impact
    >on their bottom line, since it's bundled with the rest of their Internet
    >service.
    >
    >The whole point of a UDP, after all, is to encourage the offending ISP's
    >customers to pressure it to comply, not to drive the ISP out of business.


    Welcome back, Mr T!
    --
    PGP key ID 0xEB7180EC
    Keith Willis, Nov 14, 2007
    #18
  19. Keith Willis <> writes:
    [...]
    > Welcome back, Mr T!


    I pity the fool!

    --
    Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
    Looking for software development work in the San Diego area.
    "We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
    Keith Thompson, Nov 14, 2007
    #19
  20. Hallvard B Furuseth

    Sea Wasp Guest

    Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > David DeLaney <> wrote:
    >
    >>Sea Wasp <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
    >>> How nice of them. Because RR won't do the job, they'll just kill
    >>>everyone -- thus punishing everyone EXCEPT Roadrunner and the sporger,
    >>>of course.

    >>

    >
    > Because RR won't do the job they're supposed to, why should they be allowed to
    > participate?
    >
    > UseNET is entirely cooperative. If you don't play by the rules, there are
    > plenty of people who *will*, and RR could farm out to them.
    >
    > Instead, they're allowing spamming, out of pure laziness.
    >
    > Sorry. I have no sympathy for RR users who choose to keep supporting a
    > spam-friendly organization.
    >


    *shrug* Then I may have to remain invisible, and if it becomes more
    widespread, stop using Usenet (since no one will be seeing me anyway
    at that point). I get the combination of internet, cable, and phone
    service a lot more cheap from them than I could by splitting them
    separately between other providers, and it's a hell of a lot easier
    then dealing with the foibles of three different companies and three
    different bills.

    My stopping using them, or sending a complaint, is as likely to
    result in them changing their policies as...well... the OTHER
    complaints people say they're ignoring. And won't impact the sporger
    in the least.

    --
    Sea Wasp
    /^\
    ;;;
    Live Journal: http://seawasp.livejournal.com
    Sea Wasp, Nov 14, 2007
    #20
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