Dreamweaver or Frontpage or Plain HTML

Discussion in 'HTML' started by MajorSetback@excite.com, Jan 8, 2006.

  1. Guest

    I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor. I have
    not had experience building web pages but have had several years
    experience in programming in C and C++ and in using LaTeX for document
    preparation.

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks,
    Peter.
     
    , Jan 8, 2006
    #1
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  2. Els Guest

    wrote:

    > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor. I have
    > not had experience building web pages but have had several years
    > experience in programming in C and C++ and in using LaTeX for document
    > preparation.
    >
    > Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


    Don't buy a program, just learn HTML and CSS, and use a good editor.

    --
    Els http://locusmeus.com/
    Sonhos vem. Sonhos vão. O resto é imperfeito.
    - Renato Russo -
    Now playing: K3 - Toveren
     
    Els, Jan 9, 2006
    #2
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  3. Fleeing from the madness of the http://groups.google.com jungle
    <> stumbled into
    news:alt.html,alt.www.webmaster,comp.infosystems.www.authoring.html
    and said:

    > ...
    > I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor...


    ok - that's just about the single most controversal question you could ask.

    As you are using the g/groups interface it should be trivial for you to
    research previous threads on the subject - in any of the cross-posted
    groups.

    Your goal is to produce web documents that get your message across to the
    most visitors - which, in part, means ensuring they conform to the
    published specifications.

    If you are able to master the complexities of generated markup then I have
    been led to believe that either d/w or f/p are useful tools - however, it
    seems to me that beginers have enough to learn and would be best advised
    to use a suitable text editor.

    --
    William Tasso

    Save the drama
    for your Mama.
     
    William Tasso, Jan 9, 2006
    #3
  4. wrote:
    > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor.


    I started with FP 8 years ago. After 1 year I've found FP just a pain in
    the a** because it seemed to be ignorant of proper HTML-coding (I don't
    know if the latest version of FP still behaves the same way, I stayed
    away from this editor). What I wanted was a tool that enabled me to
    produce generic HTML-code which I would be able to adapt and change to
    my own needs without having the editor injecting proprietary editor-code
    at a later stage of editing. I've then been using DW for quite some
    time, and found it very appropriate for my needs. The last couple of
    years I switched completely to a plain-text editor (UltraEdit) in order
    to produce my pages. Because I want to have full control over my source,
    and I don't want a big tool to organise my sites structure, I think I am
    big enough to do that myself.
    To sum up: The choice for a WYSIWYG-editor seems to be okay for an
    absolute beginner, but the editor should be able to adapt to the users
    needs, hence the more control a webdesigner wants over the source the
    less proprietary editor behaviour should be involved. IMHO a good editor
    encourages you to learn proper (X)HTML which should be the end goal.

    just my two cents
    bernhard


    --
    www.daszeichen.ch
    remove nixspam to reply

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    Bernhard Sturm, Jan 9, 2006
    #4
  5. wrote:
    > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > market the software that I will be developing in C++....


    You develop in C++ then you have the ability to learn HTML really
    fast. Do a google search of this group for "editor list" and you wil
    be rewarded with a ton of free editors that will let you create the
    site you want.
     
    Travis Newbury, Jan 9, 2006
    #5
  6. Jacque Guest

    Here's my .02:

    Hire someone who does web pages and knows something about usability to
    do this for you. Think of this as a marketing project, not a coding
    project. I believe you when you say you have programming experience,
    but the ability to build a web page does not equate to the ability to
    market your product effectively.

    Jacque
     
    Jacque, Jan 9, 2006
    #6
  7. Jose Guest

    > I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage


    .... don't get FrontPage - not because it's bad (it is awful) but
    rather, because once you start in front page, you canNOT ever release
    yourself from it. Frontpage mungs your source at the server. You
    cannot modify your pages without using FrontPage, which is a problem if
    you are travelling.

    Jose
    --
    Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
    for Email, make the obvious change in the address.
     
    Jose, Jan 9, 2006
    #7
  8. Tony Guest

    wrote:
    > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor. I have
    > not had experience building web pages but have had several years
    > experience in programming in C and C++ and in using LaTeX for document
    > preparation.


    I started coding HTML in straight text. Eventually, I moved on to
    FrontPage to "speed up" development. I found myself spending more time
    in the code view fixing the crap it added. I also tried Dreamweaver,
    and although it was better, I still found myself spending most of my
    time in code view. Given the price involved, I decided to go back to
    using a straight syntax-highlighted text editor (I use Crimson -
    www.crimsoneditor.com) & have been doing quite well with that since.

    Go with the text editor - if you want to see what the page looks like,
    well, you DO have a browser, right? :)
     
    Tony, Jan 9, 2006
    #8
  9. says...
    > Here's my .02:
    >
    > Hire someone who does web pages and knows something about usability to
    > do this for you. Think of this as a marketing project, not a coding
    > project. I believe you when you say you have programming experience,
    > but the ability to build a web page does not equate to the ability to
    > market your product effectively.


    Most strongly concur, this is the best advice you can get.

    Your problems will not be with coding (html is sooo much easier than c++),
    but with design - graphics, accessibility, usability. A little
    professional help will be invaluable.

    Then get a good book on html and css, and a good text editor (if you're a
    coder you'll be able to find one to suit your own preferences - I use
    Crimson Editor) for ongoing maintenance.

    Geoff M
     
    Geoff Muldoon, Jan 9, 2006
    #9
  10. David Ross Guest

    wrote:
    >
    > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor. I have
    > not had experience building web pages but have had several years
    > experience in programming in C and C++ and in using LaTeX for document
    > preparation.


    If you need a tool (rather than hand-coding the HTML), you might
    try Nvu at <http://www.nvu.com/>. It's free, and it seems to
    create Web pages that are compliant with the W3C specifications.

    You say you are a C++ programmer and that you plan to market
    software that you are developing. I hope all your programs
    compile error-free (i.e., that they have correct C++ syntax).
    Similarly, you should try to create Web pages that have correct
    HTML and CSS syntax. Thus, you should test each of your Web pages
    at <http://validator.w3.org/> (for HTML) and at
    <http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/> (for CSS).

    --

    David E. Ross
    <http://www.rossde.com/>

    Concerned about someone (e.g., Pres. Bush) snooping
    into your E-mail? Use PGP.
    See my <http://www.rossde.com/PGP/>
     
    David Ross, Jan 10, 2006
    #10
  11. On 9 Jan 2006, Tony wrote:

    > wrote:
    > > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > > market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    > > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor. I have
    > > not had experience building web pages but have had several years
    > > experience in programming in C and C++ and in using LaTeX for document
    > > preparation.

    [snip]
    > Go with the text editor - if you want to see what the page looks like,
    > well, you DO have a browser, right? :)


    Some text editors may even have a button on their menu bar to invoke your
    browser to view the file being edited. EditPad Lite (freeware) does:
    http://www.editpadlite.com/editpadlite.html
    The same company markets the shareware EditPad Pro (which has more
    features). I currently use the Lite version but plan on registering
    the Pro version if I can ever spare the cash.

    --
    Norman De Forest http://www.chebucto.ns.ca/~af380/Profile.html
    [=||=] (At the Sign of the Flashing Cursor)
    "Oh how I miss the days when it was easier to catch gonorhea than a
    computer virus." -- Big Will in alt.comp.virus, March 9, 2005
     
    Norman L. DeForest, Jan 10, 2006
    #11
  12. Fleeing from the madness of the ISINet, Nova Scotia jungle
    Norman L. DeForest <> stumbled into
    news:alt.html,alt.www.webmaster,comp.infosystems.www.authoring.html
    and said:

    >
    > On 9 Jan 2006, Tony wrote:
    >> ...
    >> Go with the text editor - if you want to see what the page looks like,
    >> well, you DO have a browser, right? :)

    >
    > Some text editors may even have a button on their menu bar to invoke your
    > browser to view the file being edited.


    Yes - but do any integrate with a local http server (so scripts are
    processed too)?

    --
    William Tasso

    Save the drama
    for your Mama.
     
    William Tasso, Jan 10, 2006
    #12
  13. neilr Guest

    "William Tasso" <> wrote in message
    news:eek:...
    > Fleeing from the madness of the ISINet, Nova Scotia jungle
    > Norman L. DeForest <> stumbled into
    > news:alt.html,alt.www.webmaster,comp.infosystems.www.authoring.html
    > and said:
    >
    >>
    >> On 9 Jan 2006, Tony wrote:
    >>> ...
    >>> Go with the text editor - if you want to see what the page looks like,
    >>> well, you DO have a browser, right? :)

    >>
    >> Some text editors may even have a button on their menu bar to invoke your
    >> browser to view the file being edited.

    >
    > Yes - but do any integrate with a local http server (so scripts are
    > processed too)?
    >


    I think PHPEdit ( http://tinyurl.com/77btt ) is getting there.

    __

    Neil
     
    neilr, Jan 10, 2006
    #13
  14. In article <43c3add6$>, neilr
    <> wrote:

    > "William Tasso" <> wrote in message
    > news:eek:...
    > > Fleeing from the madness of the ISINet, Nova Scotia jungle
    > > Norman L. DeForest <> stumbled into
    > > news:alt.html,alt.www.webmaster,comp.infosystems.www.authoring.html
    > > and said:
    > >
    > >>
    > >> On 9 Jan 2006, Tony wrote:
    > >>> ...
    > >>> Go with the text editor - if you want to see what the page looks like,
    > >>> well, you DO have a browser, right? :)
    > >>
    > >> Some text editors may even have a button on their menu bar to invoke your
    > >> browser to view the file being edited.

    > >
    > > Yes - but do any integrate with a local http server (so scripts are
    > > processed too)?
    > >

    >
    > I think PHPEdit ( http://tinyurl.com/77btt ) is getting there.


    Is that related to the PHPNuke-powered sites that have been abused
    to send me lots of yummy spam over the past while?

    To the op, if you're really stuck, Mozilla/Netscape do have a basic
    wysiwyg-style html editor (Composer) in them. I've personally used
    ye Ancient Claris HomePage*, various text editors, Mozila Composer,
    and Dreamweaver. Not sure I'd want to launch into Dreamweaver
    without having some basic knowledge of html and css first, though.
    Composer is ok, but a little clunky.

    I think the suggestion of getting professional help for your particular
    situation is a good one, since you are trying to generate sales through
    the website. You really want to make a good impression when folks
    visit your site. I would suggest having a look at the various different
    authoring approaches suggested here, though, then find someone who works
    in that environment to get things set up for you. The last thing you
    want is to decide you'll work in a text editor, and have someone set
    up a site in FrontPage for you!!

    Good luck...

    * and way before that, something ISTR was called "Arachnid"...
     
    David C. Stone, Jan 10, 2006
    #14
  15. wrote:
    > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor. I have
    > not had experience building web pages but have had several years
    > experience in programming in C and C++ and in using LaTeX for document
    > preparation.
    >
    > Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
    >
    > Thanks,
    > Peter.


    I hand-code my pages (HTML, CSS, PHP) using the text editor of
    HTML-Kit: http://www.chami.com -- I also use this free implementation
    to test my pages in a variety of Browsers and check HTML syntax via the
    TIDY plug-in.

    --
    James Pickering
    http://jp29.org/
     
    James Pickering, Jan 13, 2006
    #15
  16. Jacque wrote:
    > Here's my .02:
    >
    > Hire someone who does web pages and knows something about usability to
    > do this for you. Think of this as a marketing project, not a coding
    > project. I believe you when you say you have programming experience,
    > but the ability to build a web page does not equate to the ability to
    > market your product effectively.
    >
    > Jacque
    >

    axemurderer writes:

    There is a cross-platform free-ware version available from the fine
    folks at W3C.org (the folks who do the whole web thing) called AmayaWX
    version 9. It's available for WinXP->, MacOS X (all flaves except 10.1),
    and Linux, as well as a BSD version.

    It's also small, disk space-wise, and is not just HTML, but XML as well.

    It's like BBEdit on steroids!

    I heartily recommend it.
    http://www.w3.org/Amaya/
     
    A. Russell Murray, Jan 14, 2006
    #16
  17. Guest

    Els wrote:
    > Don't buy a program, just learn HTML and CSS, and use a good editor.


    That would appear to be the general concensus. I think I would like to
    get familiar with HTML anyway.

    Many thanks for your help,
    Peter.
     
    , Jan 16, 2006
    #17
  18. Guest

    Jacque wrote:
    > Here's my .02:
    >
    > Hire someone who does web pages and knows something about usability to
    > do this for you. Think of this as a marketing project, not a coding
    > project. I believe you when you say you have programming experience,
    > but the ability to build a web page does not equate to the ability to
    > market your product effectively.
    >
    > Jacque


    I see your point. I think I am very Renaissance as engineers go but
    one should not expect me to put out a music video any time soon. I do,
    however, have a sense of what I like and dislike about web pages and my
    wife is a fine arts major. I may do the best we can with a web page
    and then show it an expert, or experts, for critique.

    Thanks,
    Peter.
     
    , Jan 16, 2006
    #18
  19. Chaddy2222 Guest

    wrote:

    > I am starting up a home business and will be setting up a web site to
    > market the software that I will be developing in C++. I was wondering
    > if I should buy something like Dreamweaver or Frontpage or try to
    > develop the web pages directly using HTML and a text editor. I have
    > not had experience building web pages but have had several years
    > experience in programming in C and C++ and in using LaTeX for document
    > preparation.
    >
    > Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
    >
    > Thanks,
    > Peter.

    Perhaps NVU would be a good application. Download it from:
    http://www.nvu.com
    I think it's a good program. It's Free Open Source and if you want to
    improve it you can add your own extentions.
    Try it out.
    --
    Regards Chad. http://freewebdesign.cjb.cc
     
    Chaddy2222, Jan 16, 2006
    #19
  20. Lester L. Guest

    On Tue, 10 Jan 2006 11:49:56 -0000, "William Tasso" <>
    wrote:

    |Fleeing from the madness of the ISINet, Nova Scotia jungle
    |Norman L. DeForest <> stumbled into
    |news:alt.html,alt.www.webmaster,comp.infosystems.www.authoring.html
    |and said:
    |
    |>
    |> On 9 Jan 2006, Tony wrote:
    |>> ...
    |>> Go with the text editor - if you want to see what the page looks like,
    |>> well, you DO have a browser, right? :)
    |>
    |> Some text editors may even have a button on their menu bar to invoke your
    |> browser to view the file being edited.
    |
    |Yes - but do any integrate with a local http server (so scripts are
    |processed too)?

    I use easyPHP for the server side of things, and have heard good things about
    Xammp. Just make sure you edit the config file to answer only to requests from
    127.0.0.1
    --
    LesterOfPuppets
    http://stumptownrock.servebeer.com/
    http://thedings.servebeer.com/
     
    Lester L., Jan 22, 2006
    #20
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