Evolving Web App Standards and ASP.NET

Discussion in 'ASP .Net' started by =?Utf-8?B?bWtsYXBw?=, Jul 19, 2004.

  1. Hello,

    I am new to Web programming. I have close to 30 years programming in many other areas and that experience leads me to these questions.

    1. Many articles I have read tout VS.NET 2003 as a real breakthrough in productivity. I now believe much of this derives from the ASP.NET Designer Page. Experienced Web programmers here are in the habit of writing HTML (and related) code that cannot be displayed in the Designer. This appears to be caused by Page.resolveURL in the HTML code to point to image files. This is an application that should be (HIPAA regs) relatively isolated. I understand why resolveURL would be used, but is it really necessary in a static directory structure?

    2. Local evolving standards have come out strongly against Grid Layout Forms. I understand one should choose flow layout if multiple browsers are used by the user community, but in this case, only IE 6.0 and up will be used. It seems to me that Grid Layout makes development much faster. What are the good reasons for choosing either strategy here? Is this being driven by prejudices of experienced programmers against new tools and techniques (I remember the howls when Structured Programming came out) ?

    I really want to learn where these lines are drawn.

    Thanks,

    mklapp
    =?Utf-8?B?bWtsYXBw?=, Jul 19, 2004
    #1
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  2. On 7/19/2004 1:03 PM, mklapp wrote:
    > Hello,
    >
    > I am new to Web programming. I have close to 30 years programming in many other areas and that experience leads me to these questions.
    >
    > 1. Many articles I have read tout VS.NET 2003 as a real breakthrough in productivity. I now believe much of this derives from the ASP.NET Designer Page. Experienced Web programmers here are in the habit of writing HTML (and related) code that cannot be displayed in the Designer. This appears to be caused by Page.resolveURL in the HTML code to point to image files. This is an application that should be (HIPAA regs) relatively isolated. I understand why resolveURL would be used, but is it really necessary in a static directory structure?
    >
    > 2. Local evolving standards have come out strongly against Grid Layout Forms. I understand one should choose flow layout if multiple browsers are used by the user community, but in this case, only IE 6.0 and up will be used. It seems to me that Grid Layout makes development much faster. What are the good reasons for choosing either strategy here? Is this being driven by prejudices of experienced programmers against new tools and techniques (I remember the howls when Structured Programming came out) ?
    >
    > I really want to learn where these lines are drawn.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > mklapp
    >


    1. I always build my sites to be portable, so that relative references
    work fine, hence I usually don't need ResolveUrl. However, there are
    times when it is needed depending on how your app is designed (if a
    piece of code is used from multiple URL endpoints, eg). But for the
    most part, if you can use a relative reference, go ahead.

    2. I never use Grid Layout unless I know for sure I'm using an uplevel
    browser and the user's screen dimensions are known (or I design to 800 x
    600, for example). Otherwise it could lead to scrolling problems, etc.
    basically the site looks a little screwy compared to what I may have in
    mind. I don't know how 'well' it works (support, etc.) especially if
    you have a diverse user environment (IE6, Firefox, Opera, etc.). That
    someone else would have to answer.

    But I just like flow layout by experience. I have no need to enforce
    absolute positioning most of the time...

    Just my opinions...

    --
    Craig Deelsnyder
    Microsoft MVP - ASP/ASP.NET
    Craig Deelsnyder, Jul 19, 2004
    #2
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  3. =?Utf-8?B?bWtsYXBw?=

    bruce barker Guest

    1) pretty common to edit the html, the designer is pretty weak. actually i
    do all my work in html mode, not designer.

    2) grid mode does not work even with IE unless you control the screen
    resolution and system font size used by all your users. just make a simple
    page in grid mode, then in advanced setting for display monior pick large
    fonts or change your screen resolution.

    -- bruce (sqlwork.com)

    "mklapp" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hello,
    >
    > I am new to Web programming. I have close to 30 years programming in

    many other areas and that experience leads me to these questions.
    >
    > 1. Many articles I have read tout VS.NET 2003 as a real breakthrough in

    productivity. I now believe much of this derives from the ASP.NET Designer
    Page. Experienced Web programmers here are in the habit of writing HTML
    (and related) code that cannot be displayed in the Designer. This appears
    to be caused by Page.resolveURL in the HTML code to point to image files.
    This is an application that should be (HIPAA regs) relatively isolated. I
    understand why resolveURL would be used, but is it really necessary in a
    static directory structure?
    >
    > 2. Local evolving standards have come out strongly against Grid Layout

    Forms. I understand one should choose flow layout if multiple browsers are
    used by the user community, but in this case, only IE 6.0 and up will be
    used. It seems to me that Grid Layout makes development much faster. What
    are the good reasons for choosing either strategy here? Is this being
    driven by prejudices of experienced programmers against new tools and
    techniques (I remember the howls when Structured Programming came out) ?
    >
    > I really want to learn where these lines are drawn.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > mklapp
    >
    bruce barker, Jul 19, 2004
    #3
  4. "mklapp" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hello,
    >
    > I am new to Web programming. I have close to 30 years programming in

    many other areas and that experience leads me to these questions.
    >
    > 2. Local evolving standards have come out strongly against Grid Layout

    Forms. I understand one should choose flow layout if multiple browsers are
    used by the user community, but in this case, only IE 6.0 and up will be
    used. It seems to me that Grid Layout makes development much faster. What
    are the good reasons for choosing either strategy here? Is this being
    driven by prejudices of experienced programmers against new tools and
    techniques (I remember the howls when Structured Programming came out) ?
    >



    I never use Grid layout, and I don't understand why anyone would use it.
    Take a look at the horrible HTML it generates. I also used to have problems
    with elements which were meant to line up, but which wound up being off by a
    pixel or two.
    --
    John Saunders
    johnwsaundersiii at hotmail
    John Saunders, Jul 20, 2004
    #4
  5. =?Utf-8?B?bWtsYXBw?=

    Mr. Dot Net Guest

    Hi,

    I will answer your questions in a LIFO manner..

    The second question was:
    "Local evolving standards have come out strongly against Grid Layout Forms.
    I understand one should choose flow layout if multiple browsers are used by
    the user community, but in this case, only IE 6.0 and up will be used. It
    seems to me that Grid Layout makes development much faster. What are the
    good reasons for choosing either strategy here? Is this being driven by
    prejudices of experienced programmers against new tools and techniques (I
    remember the howls when Structured Programming came out) ?"

    My answer:
    "The grid layout is based on absolute positioning of the controls while the
    in flow layout the positioning is relative.
    Normally, you should use container elements (usually tables) for
    positioning.
    Anyhow the definition flow\grid layout only determines the default behavior
    of the asp.net designer.
    When used with grid layout each control will be given X Y coordinates of
    positioning in the style attribute while flow layout will not.
    So, if you decide not to use absolute positioning that would be pretty
    annoying to erase the extra layout style.
    Using absolute positioning (grid) is much more easy though it will be much
    harder to scale screen resolutions though I guess there are some applicative
    aids for that task.
    Using flow layout is much more uncomfortable to develop (though experienced
    programmers might prefer that) though more scalable for different screen
    resolutions."

    Your first question was:
    "Many articles I have read tout VS.NET 2003 as a real breakthrough in
    productivity. I now believe much of this derives from the ASP.NET Designer
    Page. Experienced Web programmers here are in the habit of writing HTML
    (and related) code that cannot be displayed in the Designer. This appears
    to be caused by Page.resolveURL in the HTML code to point to image files.
    This is an application that should be (HIPAA regs) relatively isolated. I
    understand why resolveURL would be used, but is it really necessary in a
    static directory structure?"


    My Answer:
    "If I understand your question correctly then is seems that there is no need
    to use ResolveURL there.
    Though, the designer is not 'the' most important breakthrough in
    productivity it's only the symptom but about that I will deal in another
    session."


    "mklapp" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hello,
    >
    > I am new to Web programming. I have close to 30 years programming in

    many other areas and that experience leads me to these questions.
    >
    >>

    >
    > I really want to learn where these lines are drawn.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > mklapp
    >
    Mr. Dot Net, Jul 20, 2004
    #5
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