Fonts

Discussion in 'HTML' started by Gyps, Dec 8, 2007.

  1. Gyps

    Gyps Guest

    I'm sorry - this has probably been discussed before, but I didn't find it:

    I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a server
    instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an obvious
    feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in html/css ?
     
    Gyps, Dec 8, 2007
    #1
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  2. Gyps

    +mrcakey Guest

    Gyps wrote:
    > I'm sorry - this has probably been discussed before, but I didn't find it:
    >
    > I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a server
    > instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an obvious
    > feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in html/css ?


    The W3C keeps going round about on it. I don't think it's going to be
    here any time soon. There's this tool:

    http://www.mikeindustries.com/sifr

    which replaces text inline using Flash, but it's not recommended for
    replacing lots of text. It has the advantage that the text it replaces
    remains in the document so that the user can select it and search engine
    bots can read it. Otherwise it's not much over using normal Flash or an
    image.

    Oh, and it only works where users have Flash enabled!

    +mrcakey
     
    +mrcakey, Dec 8, 2007
    #2
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  3. Scripsit Gyps:

    > I'm sorry - this has probably been discussed before, but I didn't
    > find it:


    Try smarter. Consulting FAQs is not a bad idea. Or maybe
    http://groups.google.com/advanced_search with group restricted to
    alt.html and using imaginative search words like
    fonts server

    > I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a
    > server instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an
    > obvious feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in
    > html/css ?


    It would obviously help many authors to make their pages even worse
    crap, that's for sure.

    The technique is called WEFT (IE-only, and works only if permitted by IE
    settings), and despite repeated requests, its proponents have not been
    able to present a single real-life example of its use. "Real-life" means
    anything but pages that have been contrived to demonstrate the
    technique, using dummy content or content that babbles about WEFT.

    --
    Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
    http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/
     
    Jukka K. Korpela, Dec 8, 2007
    #3
  4. Gyps

    zach Guest

    Gyps wrote:
    > I'm sorry - this has probably been discussed before, but I didn't find it:
    >
    > I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a server
    > instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an obvious
    > feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in html/css ?


    This is a bad idea for several reasons. First, after a system
    (especially windows) gets over a certain amount of fonts it will start
    slowing down. Can you imagine if all the websites you viewed started
    downloading fonts onto your computer? Soon it would start running really
    slow.

    For accessibility the best way at this point if you want to use a font
    for a heading or title or some other small amount of text is to use the
    image replacement technique.

    Basically you use css to place a negative text indent which causes the
    block in which the text is placed to remain as is except the text itself
    is moved off the screen, thus when you place a background image of the
    text it shows without any other text over it because its hidden off screen.
     
    zach, Dec 8, 2007
    #4
  5. Gyps

    +mrcakey Guest

    zach wrote:
    > Gyps wrote:
    >> I'm sorry - this has probably been discussed before, but I didn't find
    >> it:
    >>
    >> I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a server
    >> instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an obvious
    >> feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in html/css ?

    >
    > This is a bad idea for several reasons. First, after a system
    > (especially windows) gets over a certain amount of fonts it will start
    > slowing down. Can you imagine if all the websites you viewed started
    > downloading fonts onto your computer? Soon it would start running really
    > slow.
    >
    > For accessibility the best way at this point if you want to use a font
    > for a heading or title or some other small amount of text is to use the
    > image replacement technique.
    >
    > Basically you use css to place a negative text indent which causes the
    > block in which the text is placed to remain as is except the text itself
    > is moved off the screen, thus when you place a background image of the
    > text it shows without any other text over it because its hidden off screen.


    AFAIK, Opera is the only mainstream browser (on Windoze at least) that
    resizes images when adjust text size. So this solution is only the best
    way for accessibility in terms of users with screen readers. Those
    without, who simply want to increase the text size will be left with an
    illegible image, unless they use their own stylesheets, in which case
    you'll end up with the text duplicated.

    I think you just have to put your preferred font at the head of the
    font-family list and hope that the user has it installed. I'd love all
    my sans-serifs to be Helvetica, but it's just not possible, so when I
    want a sans-serif font, I always use Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif. It's
    the only way really.

    +mrcakey
     
    +mrcakey, Dec 9, 2007
    #5
  6. Gyps

    Gyps Guest

    Am Sat, 08 Dec 2007 10:43:05 +0000 schrieb +mrcakey:

    > Gyps wrote:
    >> I'm sorry - this has probably been discussed before, but I didn't find it:
    >>
    >> I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a server
    >> instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an obvious
    >> feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in html/css ?

    >
    > The W3C keeps going round about on it. I don't think it's going to be
    > here any time soon. There's this tool:
    >
    > http://www.mikeindustries.com/sifr
    >
    > which replaces text inline using Flash, but it's not recommended for
    > replacing lots of text. It has the advantage that the text it replaces
    > remains in the document so that the user can select it and search engine
    > bots can read it. Otherwise it's not much over using normal Flash or an
    > image.
    >
    > Oh, and it only works where users have Flash enabled!
    >
    > +mrcakey


    Thanks for your help. So far I have tried to avoid Flash. Maybe I find
    another workaround.
     
    Gyps, Dec 9, 2007
    #6
  7. Gyps

    Gyps Guest

    >> I'm sorry - this has probably been discussed before, but I didn't
    >> find it:

    >
    > Try smarter. Consulting FAQs is not a bad idea. Or maybe
    > http://groups.google.com/advanced_search with group restricted to
    > alt.html and using imaginative search words like
    > fonts server


    Or just: try it less lazily. I could have done that, but I didnt have much
    time when I started the thread, so I took the easiest way.. Shame on me.
    But thanks for replying nevertheless.

    >> I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a
    >> server instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an
    >> obvious feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in
    >> html/css ?

    >
    > It would obviously help many authors to make their pages even worse
    > crap, that's for sure.


    This applies to any powerful web-technology.

    > The technique is called WEFT (IE-only, and works only if permitted by IE
    > settings), and despite repeated requests, its proponents have not been
    > able to present a single real-life example of its use. "Real-life" means
    > anything but pages that have been contrived to demonstrate the
    > technique, using dummy content or content that babbles about WEFT.


    IE-only.. unfortunatly not what I look for, even if it would sound more
    reliable than this.
     
    Gyps, Dec 9, 2007
    #7
  8. Gyps

    Gyps Guest


    >> I wonder whether there is a way to make a browser use fonts from a server
    >> instead of the installed system-fonts. Since this is such an obvious
    >> feature I cannot believe it has never been implemented in html/css ?

    >
    > This is a bad idea for several reasons. First, after a system
    > (especially windows) gets over a certain amount of fonts it will start
    > slowing down. Can you imagine if all the websites you viewed started
    > downloading fonts onto your computer? Soon it would start running really
    > slow.


    I would prefer a browser to download the font and being able to use it
    until the cache is emptied - without having to bother the system with it.

    > For accessibility the best way at this point if you want to use a font
    > for a heading or title or some other small amount of text is to use the
    > image replacement technique.


    Hm. Images are not a good solution, because its a lot of text and even more
    will be added on a regular basis.
     
    Gyps, Dec 9, 2007
    #8
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