Frames question

Discussion in 'HTML' started by Hugo de Payns, Nov 21, 2004.

  1. Goodday,

    I have made (for personal use only) the following frameset;

    <FRAMESET ROWS="20,*" FRAMEBORDER="0" FRAMESPACING="0" BORDER="0">
    <FRAME SRC="banner.htm" FRAMESPACING="0" SCROLLING="NO">

    <FRAMESET COLS="20%,80%">
    <FRAME SRC="directory.htm">
    <FRAME NAME="MAIN-WINDOW" SRC="home.htm">
    </FRAMESET>
    </FRAMESET>

    For both html-files i used a backgroundcolor, but this causes an small
    white gap between the frames.

    how can i close the gap between the top-frame and the left-frame?

    TIA
    Hugo de Payns
     
    Hugo de Payns, Nov 21, 2004
    #1
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  2. Hugo de Payns

    Steve Pugh Guest

    On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 13:13:35 +0100, Hugo de Payns
    <> wrote:

    >I have made (for personal use only) the following frameset;


    And so you promise to never put it on publically accessible a web
    site?

    ><FRAMESET ROWS="20,*" FRAMEBORDER="0" FRAMESPACING="0" BORDER="0">
    > <FRAME SRC="banner.htm" FRAMESPACING="0" SCROLLING="NO">
    >
    > <FRAMESET COLS="20%,80%">
    > <FRAME SRC="directory.htm">
    > <FRAME NAME="MAIN-WINDOW" SRC="home.htm">
    > </FRAMESET>
    ></FRAMESET>
    >
    >For both html-files i used a backgroundcolor, but this causes an small
    >white gap between the frames.
    >
    >how can i close the gap between the top-frame and the left-frame?


    You need to specify the frameborder and framespacing attributes for
    both framesets not just the outer one.

    It's invalid code but it will work in the common graphical browsers
    and if you keep that promise to never let this out onto the WWW we may
    forgive you. Maybe.

    Steve
     
    Steve Pugh, Nov 21, 2004
    #2
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  3. Hugo de Payns

    Jan Faerber Guest

    riding in the slipstream of Steve Pugh:

    > On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 13:13:35 +0100, Hugo de Payns
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>I have made (for personal use only) the following frameset;


    *Jan Faerber quickly changes his expert cap to an amateur cap.*

    > And so you promise to never put it on publically accessible a web
    > site?


    Just add:
    <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Frameset//EN"
    "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/frameset.dtd">

    >><FRAMESET ROWS="20,*" FRAMEBORDER="0" FRAMESPACING="0" BORDER="0">
    >> <FRAME SRC="banner.htm" FRAMESPACING="0" SCROLLING="NO">
    >>
    >> <FRAMESET COLS="20%,80%">
    >> <FRAME SRC="directory.htm">
    >> <FRAME NAME="MAIN-WINDOW" SRC="home.htm">
    >> </FRAMESET>
    >></FRAMESET>
    >>
    >>For both html-files i used a backgroundcolor, but this causes an small
    >>white gap between the frames.


    That can be used to resize the frames - or use 'noresize'.

    >>how can i close the gap between the top-frame and the left-frame?


    ?? ... the left and the right frame.
    In Opera and Mozilla I don't have any gap.

    > You need to specify the frameborder and framespacing attributes for
    > both framesets not just the outer one.


    frameborder="0" should do it.

    Yes, the inner frame set could be aswell another html-file with
    a frameset.

    > It's invalid code but it will work in the common graphical browsers
    > and if you keep that promise to never let this out onto the WWW we may
    > forgive you. Maybe.


    'sorry seems to be the hardest word'

    > Steve


    Or else he will get an extra portion spam.


    --
    Jan

    http://html.janfaerber.com
     
    Jan Faerber, Nov 21, 2004
    #3
  4. On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 12:48:57 +0000, Steve Pugh <> wrote:

    >On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 13:13:35 +0100, Hugo de Payns
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >>I have made (for personal use only) the following frameset;

    >
    >And so you promise to never put it on publically accessible a web
    >site?


    I solemly swear!!
    >
    >><FRAMESET ROWS="20,*" FRAMEBORDER="0" FRAMESPACING="0" BORDER="0">
    >> <FRAME SRC="banner.htm" FRAMESPACING="0" SCROLLING="NO">
    >>
    >> <FRAMESET COLS="20%,80%">
    >> <FRAME SRC="directory.htm">
    >> <FRAME NAME="MAIN-WINDOW" SRC="home.htm">
    >> </FRAMESET>
    >></FRAMESET>
    >>
    >>For both html-files i used a backgroundcolor, but this causes an small
    >>white gap between the frames.
    >>
    >>how can i close the gap between the top-frame and the left-frame?

    >
    >You need to specify the frameborder and framespacing attributes for
    >both framesets not just the outer one.
    >
    >It's invalid code but it will work in the common graphical browsers
    >and if you keep that promise to never let this out onto the WWW we may
    >forgive you. Maybe.
    >
    > Steve


    Is it that bad??
    No worrys, dont own a website and not planning to have one; either,
    the telephonebill is expensive enough.
     
    Hugo de Payns, Nov 21, 2004
    #4
  5. Hugo de Payns

    Jan Faerber Guest

    Hugo de Payns wrote:

    > Is it that bad??


    The www has something they call ... what do they call it ...
    the W3C - the www consortium.
    And they always try to improve the standards for the internet.
    So they have discussions with brucie's little men in the server -
    they give their best.

    > No worrys, dont own a website and not planning to have one; either,
    > the telephonebill is expensive enough.


    Not only one - you have to get 20!



    --
    Jan

    http://html.janfaerber.com
     
    Jan Faerber, Nov 21, 2004
    #5
  6. Hugo de Payns

    Jan Faerber Guest

    Jan Faerber wrote:

    > Hugo de Payns wrote:
    >
    >> Is it that bad??

    >
    > The www has something they call ... what do they call it ...
    > the W3C - the www consortium.
    > And they always try to improve the standards for the internet.
    > So they have discussions with brucie's little men in the server -
    > they give their best.


    But I don't want to exclude myself.
    So I make now a contribution to this and translate
    some stuff concerning this topic on www.teamone.de from
    Mr. Stephan Muenz's 'selfhtml' which is very popular
    in areas with german as the local language.

    There is a english version on
    http://en.selfhtml.org/css/index.htm
    for the css section
    but there is still a lot of work to do.

    So I will post here what I use that isn't translated yet (Maybe I should
    join the translation team.)



    HTML variants 'strict', 'transitional' and 'frameset'

    In order that a HTML document is valid it has to conform completely the
    rules that are *defined* in the HTML DTD (DTD = document type definition).
    Those rules define which elements may be used, how they may be nested, which
    attributes according to which elements are allowed and what allocations of
    values to those attributes are allowed.

    Now there are right three html DTDs in HTML 4.0 and HTML 4.01. It is a
    matter of three different variants.

    Variant 'strict'
    --------------------

    The variant 'strict is by the W3-consortium the recommended and preferred
    variant. It is to be distinguished that it only allows slim HTML. Many
    elements and attributes for formatting and displaying of text are missing
    within this variant.
    Instead authors of webpages are encouraged to use css stylesheets for
    formatting. A further specific feature of the variant 'strict' is that
    inside of <body> and </body> any content must stand in block elements.[1]
    The variant 'strict' is suitable especially for new webpages to be produced
    which formatting consequently overemphasizes css. [2]

    To use the variant 'strict' explicitly in HTML 4.01 the following notation
    is required on the very beginning of a HTML file:

    <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN"
    "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd">

    Variant 'transitional'
    ----------------------------

    The variant 'transitional' is a compromise which the w3 consortium provides
    in view of some own mistakes in the past (definitions from the HTML version
    3.2) and in view of the high spreading of webpages that use those features.
    The variant 'transitional' allows the use of divers elements and attributes
    that are branded as 'deprecated' and that no longer appear in the variant
    'strict'. Such favoured HTML elements like 'font' or often used attributes
    like 'align=' or 'bgcolor=' belong to that.
    At the variant 'transitional' it is allowed aswell to note text or inline
    elements[3] within <body> and </body>.
    First of all the variant 'transitional' is adviseable for already existing
    webpages that are to be brought on a state without all-too big effort which
    presents valid HTML 4.0 or 4.01.

    To use the variant 'transitional' explicitly in HTML 4.01 the following
    notation is required on the very beginning of a HTML file:

    <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
    "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">

    remark: Due to the distinction of the name of the variant and the name of
    the DTD, you find the expression 'loose' variant aswell sometimes. Which
    means 'transitional' variant.

    Variant 'frameset'
    ----------------------

    The variant 'frameset' in HTML 4.01 is identic with the variant
    'transitional' with the only exception that the necessary nesting of the
    elements below the root element 'html' differs. In this variant instead of
    a 'body' element a 'frameset' element is required.

    To use the variant 'frameset' explicitly in HTML 4.01 the following notation
    is required on the very beginning of a HTML file:

    <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Frameset//EN"
    "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/frameset.dtd">


    [1]
    Block elements produce a new line in floating Text. Depending on the type of
    element the browser can insert automatically a bigger space to the
    preceding content. E.g. the browser produces a visible space
    in order that the switching of a paragraph is distinguishable from a simple
    new line. In contrast the 'div' element for instance just causes a new
    line.
    As a general rule block elements can contain ordinary text and inline
    elements[3]. Some block elements can contain other block elements aswell.
    Exeptions have to be studied in detail according to the single elements.

    The following elements belong to block elements:

    address | blockquote | center | dl | dir | div | fieldset | form | h1-6 | hr
    | isindex | menu | noframes | noscript | ol | p | pre | table | ul
    (center, dir, menu, noframes and isindex only at HTML transitional)


    [2]
    applet
    basefont
    body alink
    body background
    body bgcolor
    body link
    body text
    body vlink
    br clear
    caption align
    center
    dir
    div
    dl compact
    font
    frame
    frameset
    h1-h6 align
    hr align
    hr size
    hr noshade
    hr width
    html version
    iframe
    img align
    img hspace
    img vspace
    img border
    input align
    isindex
    legend align
    li type
    li value
    menu
    object align
    object border
    object hspace
    object vspace
    ol compact
    ol start
    ol type
    p align
    pre width
    s
    script language
    strike
    table align
    table bgcolor
    td bgcolor
    td height
    td nowrap
    td width
    th bgcolor
    th height
    th nowrap
    th width
    tr bgcolor
    u
    ul compact
    ul


    [3]
    Inline elements don't produce a new line within floating text. Inline
    elements are intended to be subsidiary 'inner' elements of block elements.
    In most cases they can contain ordinary text and other inline elements but
    no block elements. Exeptions have to be studied in detail according to the
    single elements.

    The following elements belong to inline elements:

    a | abbr | acronym | applet | b | basefont | bdo | big | br | button | cite
    | code | dfn | em | font | i | img | input | iframe | kbd | label | map |
    object | q | samp | script | select | small | span | strong | sub | sup |
    textarea | tt | var

    (applet, basefont, font, iframe, u, s and strike only



    --
    Jan

    http://html.janfaerber.com
     
    Jan Faerber, Nov 21, 2004
    #6
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