hi 2 all

Discussion in 'Java' started by manishkp84@gmail.com, Feb 1, 2007.

  1. Guest

    i wanted u know which book is good 4 a jsp/j2ee/servlet beginers
     
    , Feb 1, 2007
    #1
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  2. Lew Guest

    wrote:
    > i wanted u know which book is good 4 a jsp/j2ee/servlet beginers


    /The Elements of Style/, by Strunk and White, is recommended in your case.

    - Lew
     
    Lew, Feb 1, 2007
    #2
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  3. David Segall Guest

    Lew <> wrote:

    > wrote:
    >> i wanted u know which book is good 4 a jsp/j2ee/servlet beginers

    >
    >/The Elements of Style/, by Strunk and White, is recommended in your case.

    I am willing to bet that his style in his native language is
    infinitely better than yours. He took the trouble to post in English.
    The least you can do is to suggest an appropriate book to improve his
    English rather than a book aimed at proficient English speakers.
     
    David Segall, Feb 1, 2007
    #3
  4. Lew Guest

    wrote:
    >>> i wanted u know which book is good 4 a jsp/j2ee/servlet beginers


    Lew wrote:
    >> /The Elements of Style/, by Strunk and White, is recommended in your case.


    David Segall wrote:
    > I am willing to bet that his style in his native language is
    > infinitely better than yours. He took the trouble to post in English.
    > The least you can do is to suggest an appropriate book to improve his
    > English rather than a book aimed at proficient English speakers.


    What TOEFL course teaches the spelling "u" for "you", "4" for "for", to
    lower-case the pronoun "I"?

    What makes you think the person's native language is not English? I see no
    evidence for that assertion.

    Unless you count "l33t" as a non-English language, which I might endorse.

    Actually, I see no evidence the OP was asking a question. I parse the message
    as "I wanted you to know which book is good for JSP/J2EE/servlet beginners",
    but then they never told us.

    Unless someone explicitly apologizes for their lack of command of English, I
    will hold it a given that posting in English implies the most basic
    familiarity with English syntax and orthography.

    As to the point of the recommended book being too advanced, you are right.
    Next time I will recommend /Dick and Jane/ and a subscription to /My Weekly
    Reader/.

    - Lew
     
    Lew, Feb 1, 2007
    #4
  5. "Lew" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > wrote:
    >>>> i wanted u know which book is good 4 a jsp/j2ee/servlet beginers

    >
    > Lew wrote:
    >>> /The Elements of Style/, by Strunk and White, is recommended in your
    >>> case.

    >
    > David Segall wrote:
    >> I am willing to bet that his style in his native language is
    >> infinitely better than yours. He took the trouble to post in English.
    >> The least you can do is to suggest an appropriate book to improve his
    >> English rather than a book aimed at proficient English speakers.

    >
    > What TOEFL course teaches the spelling "u" for "you", "4" for "for", to
    > lower-case the pronoun "I"?
    >
    > What makes you think the person's native language is not English? I see no
    > evidence for that assertion.
    >
    > Unless you count "l33t" as a non-English language, which I might endorse.
    >
    > Actually, I see no evidence the OP was asking a question. I parse the
    > message as "I wanted you to know which book is good for JSP/J2EE/servlet
    > beginners", but then they never told us.
    >
    > Unless someone explicitly apologizes for their lack of command of English,
    > I will hold it a given that posting in English implies the most basic
    > familiarity with English syntax and orthography.
    >
    > As to the point of the recommended book being too advanced, you are right.
    > Next time I will recommend /Dick and Jane/ and a subscription to /My
    > Weekly Reader/.


    My god! Is everyone on the edge or something?

    What is wrong with answering questions with a gentle reminder to try to
    avoid 1337 speak and text message abbreviations . . . rather than replying
    with just an insult and no useful information?

    I feel like I'm in alt.games.*

    --
    LTP

    :)
     
    Luc The Perverse, Feb 1, 2007
    #5
  6. On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 13:38:18 -0500, Lew wrote:
    > What TOEFL course teaches the spelling "u" for "you", "4" for "for", to
    > lower-case the pronoun "I"?


    Does it really matter that much to you?

    If someone on the street was asking for directions, would you
    condescendingly refuse to provide help because they had used broken
    English or too much slang?

    If you don't *approve* of the language used by some posters, then
    simply ignore their posts. If it bothers you to help, then don't.

    I find it incredibly arrogant, petty and irritating that a small
    number of regular posters to this group have taken it upon themselves
    to "teach a lesson" to newbies and others coming here for help. Claims
    that this somehow helps the newbie are ridiculous.

    In a recent thread, someone asked why so many people work so hard to
    answer other peoples questions. I find the current trend to be in
    stark contrast with the altruism expressed in many of the replies to
    that question.

    /gordon

    --
    [ don't email me support questions or followups ]
    g o r d o n + n e w s @ b a l d e r 1 3 . s e
     
    Gordon Beaton, Feb 1, 2007
    #6
  7. Lew Guest

    Gordon Beaton wrote:
    > In a recent thread, someone asked why so many people work so hard to
    > answer other peoples questions. I find the current trend to be in
    > stark contrast with the altruism expressed in many of the replies to
    > that question.


    I apologize for not evincing appropriate generosity of spirit in my response.

    - Lew
     
    Lew, Feb 1, 2007
    #7
  8. Stefan Ram Guest

    Lew <> writes:
    >What TOEFL course teaches the spelling "u" for "you", "4" for "for"


    »Secondary school students will be able to use text speak
    in written examinations this year, legitimising a language
    loved by teenagers.

    The move has divided students and educators amid concerns
    the move could damage the English language.

    The second language of thousands of teenagers, text
    language usually incorporates abbreviated words and
    phrases such as txt for "text", lol for "laugh out loud"
    or "lots of love" and CU for "see you".«

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3854612a11,00.html
     
    Stefan Ram, Feb 1, 2007
    #8
  9. Lew Guest

    Lew writes:
    >> What TOEFL course teaches the spelling "u" for "you", "4" for "for"


    Stefan Ram wrote:
    > »Secondary school students will be able to use text speak
    > in written examinations this year, legitimising a language
    > loved by teenagers.
    >
    > The move has divided students and educators amid concerns
    > the move could damage the English language.
    >
    > The second language of thousands of teenagers, text
    > language usually incorporates abbreviated words and
    > phrases such as txt for "text", lol for "laugh out loud"
    > or "lots of love" and CU for "see you".«
    >
    > http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3854612a11,00.html


    New Zealand teaches English as a foreign language?

    My post was in response to someone thinking that the "leet" speak was from a
    non-native English speaker. My point was that it was more typical of native
    English speakers, as the New Zealand Qualifications Authority (NZQA) is
    finding out, according to the link you posted.

    I am sure looking forward to having a crop of illiterate, undereducated
    coworkers to come out of this system. There was a recent thread where many
    folks endorsed the notion that effective communication skills are necessary
    for success as a programmer. If we do not help people recognize that "l33t"
    does not effectively communicate, nor is professional, then they will be
    hampered by their own lack of skill forever.

    Do we not owe it to folks in this forum to help them advance?

    - Lew
     
    Lew, Feb 1, 2007
    #9
  10. Alex Hunsley Guest

    David Segall wrote:
    > Lew <> wrote:
    >
    >> wrote:
    >>> i wanted u know which book is good 4 a jsp/j2ee/servlet beginers

    >> /The Elements of Style/, by Strunk and White, is recommended in your case.

    > I am willing to bet that his style in his native language is
    > infinitely better than yours. He took the trouble to post in English.


    No, he took the trouble to post in txt-english, which isn't quite English.

    > The least you can do is to suggest an appropriate book to improve his
    > English rather than a book aimed at proficient English speakers.
     
    Alex Hunsley, Feb 1, 2007
    #10
  11. OT: English proper (was Re: hi 2 all)

    On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 15:34:03 -0800, Lew <> wrote:
    > Lew writes:
    >
    >>> What TOEFL course teaches the spelling "u" for "you", "4" for "for"

    >
    > Stefan Ram wrote:
    >> »Secondary school students will be able to use text speak
    >> in written examinations this year, legitimising a language
    >> loved by teenagers.
    >> The move has divided students and educators amid concerns
    >> the move could damage the English language.
    >> The second language of thousands of teenagers, text
    >> language usually incorporates abbreviated words and
    >> phrases such as txt for "text", lol for "laugh out loud"
    >> or "lots of love" and CU for "see you".«
    >> http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3854612a11,00.html


    That looks a lot like "a school system admitting that they've failed to
    teach proper English."

    [sNip]
    > I am sure looking forward to having a crop of illiterate, undereducated
    > coworkers to come out of this system. There was a recent thread where


    Isn't that happening today? It has been reported numerous times on the
    local radio that some North American university students can't read or
    write, and yet somehow this isn't discovered until they are confronted
    with an exam.

    > many folks endorsed the notion that effective communication skills are
    > necessary for success as a programmer. If we do not help people
    > recognize that "l33t" does not effectively communicate, nor is
    > professional, then they will be hampered by their own lack of skill
    > forever.


    Myself, and a number of people I know who are in positions to hire
    people, ignore resumes that are written in this style because bad English
    always reflects poorly on the public. Proper English style (or at least
    an attempt to get it right) is something that can be taught, but typically
    those who go out of their way to reduce English to this cryptic style make
    themselves look ignorant.

    > Do we not owe it to folks in this forum to help them advance?


    I thought your response was both witty and relevant.

    --
    Randolf Richardson -
    The Lumber Cartel, local 42 (Canadian branch)
    http://www.lumbercartel.ca/
     
    Randolf Richardson, Feb 2, 2007
    #11
  12. On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 11:33:09 -0800, Luc The Perverse
    <> wrote:
    > "Lew" <> wrote in message
    > news:...

    [sNip]
    >> Unless someone explicitly apologizes for their lack of command of
    >> English, I will hold it a given that posting in English implies the
    >> most basic familiarity with English syntax and orthography.
    >>
    >> As to the point of the recommended book being too advanced, you are
    >> right. Next time I will recommend /Dick and Jane/ and a
    >> subscription to /My Weekly Reader/.

    >
    > My god! Is everyone on the edge or something?


    I rest my case that "proper English doesn't offend most people."

    > What is wrong with answering questions with a gentle reminder to try to
    > avoid 1337 speak and text message abbreviations . . . rather than
    > replying with just an insult and no useful information?


    Good point.

    > I feel like I'm in alt.games.*


    Maybe you should have cross-posted your reply. ;-D

    [IRC command: /me ducks, then runs for cover...]

    --
    Randolf Richardson -
    The Lumber Cartel, local 42 (Canadian branch)
    http://www.lumbercartel.ca/
     
    Randolf Richardson, Feb 2, 2007
    #12
  13. "Lew" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Do we not owe it to folks in this forum to help them advance?


    It is neither your right nor your obligation to change people who happen
    upon a forum you visit and ask a simple question in a manner that doesn't
    appeal to you.

    Oh wait . . . That is what I do with top posters and non quoters all the
    time.

    Ahem . . what I mean is that you should still answer their question . . and
    be more "Gentle" in your approach.

    --
    LTP

    :)
     
    Luc The Perverse, Feb 2, 2007
    #13
  14. Re: English proper (was Re: hi 2 all)

    "Randolf Richardson" <> wrote in message
    news:eek:-corporate.com...
    > Myself, and a number of people I know who are in positions to hire
    > people, ignore resumes that are written in this style because bad English
    > always reflects poorly on the public. Proper English style (or at least
    > an attempt to get it right) is something that can be taught, but typically
    > those who go out of their way to reduce English to this cryptic style make
    > themselves look ignorant.


    WTF? Resumés written in l33t?

    That's insane.

    The most unprofessional thing I ever did involved some mild sexual inuendo
    about getting "the head" of a tree structure which I had named Betty. I
    didn't remember doing it . . but I felt a little stupid during a code review
    meeting once. Everyone chuckled - but I felt sincerely stupid about the
    incident.
    --
    LTP

    :)
     
    Luc The Perverse, Feb 2, 2007
    #14
  15. On Feb 2, 7:59 pm, "Luc The Perverse"
    <> wrote:

    > . . and
    > be more "Gentle" in your approach.


    I* save my 'gentle' for c.l.j.help, mostly.

    Posters to c.l.j.p. can either be greatful
    for any response, or 'get stuffed'.

    * Not that I had made any posts on this
    thread, but just throwing my 2c worth in.

    Andrew T.
     
    Andrew Thompson, Feb 2, 2007
    #15
  16. Re: English proper (was Re: hi 2 all)

    On Fri, 02 Feb 2007 01:10:26 -0800, Luc The Perverse
    <> wrote:
    > "Randolf Richardson" <> wrote in message
    > news:eek:-corporate.com...
    >
    >> Myself, and a number of people I know who are in positions to hire
    >> people, ignore resumes that are written in this style because bad
    >> English always reflects poorly on the public. Proper English style
    >> (or at least an attempt to get it right) is something that can be
    >> taught, but typically those who go out of their way to reduce
    >> English to this cryptic style make themselves look ignorant.

    >
    > WTF? Resumés written in l33t?
    >
    > That's insane.


    I suspect that many of these types eventually wind up in a political
    career -- that seems to be a common destination for many insane people who
    successfully dodge those really nice people who wear white coats and
    always travel in pairs.

    > The most unprofessional thing I ever did involved some mild sexual
    > inuendo about getting "the head" of a tree structure which I had
    > named Betty. I didn't remember doing it . . but I felt a little
    > stupid during a code review meeting once. Everyone chuckled - but
    > I felt sincerely stupid about the incident.


    Skipped College, eh? ;-D

    --
    Randolf Richardson -
    The Lumber Cartel, local 42 (Canadian branch)
    http://www.lumbercartel.ca/
     
    Randolf Richardson, Feb 3, 2007
    #16
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