How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

Discussion in 'VHDL' started by Weng Tianxiang, Jun 12, 2006.

  1. Hi,
    We want to buy a ModelSim license.

    1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
    $1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;

    2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
    perpatual license.

    Both versions will work and make no differences to our applications.

    Does anyone knows a better way to buy a ModelSim license with lowest
    price except the above two options? For a start-up, we prefer lowest
    price, of course.

    Thank you.

    Weng
     
    Weng Tianxiang, Jun 12, 2006
    #1
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  2. Weng Tianxiang

    oneweek Guest

    you can try lattice semi for a fraction of cost, only restriction is
    you have to use their FPGA, but not bad at all.

    Weng Tianxiang wrote:
    > Hi,
    > We want to buy a ModelSim license.
    >
    > 1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
    > $1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;
    >
    > 2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
    > perpatual license.
    >
    > Both versions will work and make no differences to our applications.
    >
    > Does anyone knows a better way to buy a ModelSim license with lowest
    > price except the above two options? For a start-up, we prefer lowest
    > price, of course.
    >
    > Thank you.
    >
    > Weng
     
    oneweek, Jun 12, 2006
    #2
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  3. Weng Tianxiang

    Andy Guest

    Weng Tianxiang wrote:
    > Hi,
    > We want to buy a ModelSim license.
    >
    > 1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
    > $1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;
    >
    > 2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
    > perpatual license.
    >
    > Both versions will work and make no differences to our applications.
    >
    > Does anyone knows a better way to buy a ModelSim license with lowest
    > price except the above two options? For a start-up, we prefer lowest
    > price, of course.
    >
    > Thank you.
    >
    > Weng
    >


    Hi Weng,
    I guess from 'start-up' you are talking commercial use. If, however, you
    are an academic user, you might want to talk to europractice.

    http://www.msc.rl.ac.uk/europractice/

    Andy
     
    Andy, Jun 12, 2006
    #3
  4. Weng Tianxiang wrote:

    > 1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
    > $1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;


    Quartus FIXEDPC $2k license covers windows modelsim
    for vhdl or verilog.
    One year limit only applies to updates -- tools keep working.
    From distributors only.

    > 2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
    > perpatual license.


    Quartus FLOATLNX $3k license covers linux modelsim
    for vhdl or verilog.
    One year limit only applies to updates -- tools keep working.
    From distributors only.

    -- Mike Treseler
     
    Mike Treseler, Jun 12, 2006
    #4
  5. Weng Tianxiang

    bart Guest

    oneweek wrote:
    > you can try lattice semi for a fraction of cost, only restriction is
    > you have to use their FPGA, but not bad at all.
    >

    ModelSim is included with shipments of Lattice's ispLEVER base
    software, which you can purchase (Windows part number:
    LS-HDL-BASE-PC-N) from the Lattice online store for $495 at
    http://www.latticesemi.com/store/software.cfm

    Regards,
    Bart Borosky, Lattice
     
    bart, Jun 13, 2006
    #5
  6. Weng Tianxiang

    Francesco Guest

    bart wrote:
    > oneweek wrote:
    > > you can try lattice semi for a fraction of cost, only restriction is
    > > you have to use their FPGA, but not bad at all.
    > >

    > ModelSim is included with shipments of Lattice's ispLEVER base
    > software, which you can purchase (Windows part number:
    > LS-HDL-BASE-PC-N) from the Lattice online store for $495 at
    > http://www.latticesemi.com/store/software.cfm
    >
    > Regards,
    > Bart Borosky, Lattice


    if you use verilog I suggest you to try icarus verilog
    :http://www.icarus.com/eda/verilog.
    and the wave viewer you can use wave 1.0 : www.iss-us.com
    I think they are quite good.
    They are free and in my opinion they are veru good.

    Francesco
     
    Francesco, Jun 13, 2006
    #6
  7. Weng Tianxiang

    Nial Stewart Guest

    > Quartus FIXEDPC $2k license covers windows modelsim
    > for vhdl or verilog.
    > One year limit only applies to updates -- tools keep working.



    Are you sure about that Mike, I thought they changed the licencing
    model a while ago so Modelsim only works for 18 months now.


    Nial.
     
    Nial Stewart, Jun 13, 2006
    #7
  8. Weng Tianxiang

    rnbrady Guest

    rnbrady, Jun 13, 2006
    #8
  9. Nial Stewart wrote:
    >> Quartus FIXEDPC $2k license covers windows modelsim
    >> for vhdl or verilog.
    >> One year limit only applies to updates -- tools keep working.

    >
    > Are you sure about that Mike, I thought they changed the licencing
    > model a while ago so Modelsim only works for 18 months now.


    I'm not 100% sure of anything.
    But that is what the licensing data sheet says.
    Anybody from Altera got their ears on?

    -- Mike Treseler
     
    Mike Treseler, Jun 13, 2006
    #9
  10. Weng Tianxiang

    Nial Stewart Guest

    "Weng Tianxiang" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hi,
    > We want to buy a ModelSim license.
    > 1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
    > $1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;
    > 2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
    > perpatual license.
    > Both versions will work and make no differences to our applications.
    > Does anyone knows a better way to buy a ModelSim license with lowest
    > price except the above two options? For a start-up, we prefer lowest
    > price, of course.



    If you're not tied to Modelsim it might be worth looking at
    VHDL Simili from SymphonyEDA...

    http://www.symphonyeda.com/

    It's a fully compliant VHDL simulator. I've been evaluating it since it
    came out, it's always been a bit slower than Modelsim but I see that they've
    put some effort into speeding it up for the latest release (I haven't tried
    this so can't comment).

    Hard to beat for the price


    Nial.
     
    Nial Stewart, Jun 13, 2006
    #10
  11. Weng Tianxiang

    Guest

    Hi Weng,

    How large designs are we talking about?

    For small designs, you can always use free tools. Both open-source like
    IcarusVerilog and free versions of commercials products. For example,
    Altera Quartus II WebPack and Actel Libero Gold are both free and
    include simulators. In the case of Actel it is actually a version of
    ModelSim.


    The free versions may sometimes be a little limited, but we have paid
    hundreds of thousands of dollars for much worse tools in past.


    (Please note that I dont suggest you should switch to Altera/Actel).

    regards
    -Burns

    >Weng Tianxiang wrote:
    > Hi,
    > We want to buy a ModelSim license.
    >
    > 1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
    > $1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;
    >
    > 2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
    > perpatual license.
    >
    > Both versions will work and make no differences to our applications.
    >
    > Does anyone knows a better way to buy a ModelSim license with lowest
    > price except the above two options? For a start-up, we prefer lowest
    > price, of course.
    >
    > Thank you.
    >
    > Weng
     
    , Jun 13, 2006
    #11
  12. Hi Everyone,
    Thank you for your responses.

    It is a start-up project for commercial use and I am not an academic
    researcher, instead of, an engineer who has a 2nd own project going on
    at home and hasn't got financial support from any investors.

    I have been using Xilinx free tools with ModelSim free software. Now
    ModelSim says that the size of project is beyond 50K statements that is
    beyond its limit of 10K statements. Whie beyond limit, ModelSim goes
    very slow.

    $3K price for ModelSim PE is acceptable to us, but finally it is found
    that ModelSim Design is for $3K and ModelSim PE for $5K.

    So we are wighting for other choice.

    Thank you.

    Weng

    wrote:
    > Hi Weng,
    >
    > How large designs are we talking about?
    >
    > For small designs, you can always use free tools. Both open-source like
    > IcarusVerilog and free versions of commercials products. For example,
    > Altera Quartus II WebPack and Actel Libero Gold are both free and
    > include simulators. In the case of Actel it is actually a version of
    > ModelSim.
    >
    >
    > The free versions may sometimes be a little limited, but we have paid
    > hundreds of thousands of dollars for much worse tools in past.
    >
    >
    > (Please note that I dont suggest you should switch to Altera/Actel).
    >
    > regards
    > -Burns
    >
    > >Weng Tianxiang wrote:
    > > Hi,
    > > We want to buy a ModelSim license.
    > >
    > > 1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
    > > $1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;
    > >
    > > 2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
    > > perpatual license.
    > >
    > > Both versions will work and make no differences to our applications.
    > >
    > > Does anyone knows a better way to buy a ModelSim license with lowest
    > > price except the above two options? For a start-up, we prefer lowest
    > > price, of course.
    > >
    > > Thank you.
    > >
    > > Weng
     
    Weng Tianxiang, Jun 13, 2006
    #12
  13. Weng Tianxiang

    Ray Andraka Guest

    Weng,

    Have you looked at Aldec? Their simulator is as good as modelsim, and
    has an easier user interface. They also offer VHDL/verilog/edif/matlab
    co-simulation. The cadillac version competes favorably with modelsim PE
    for I think a similar price. The versions with fewer features are
    cheaper. You might contact Aldec and talk to them about your needs.
    One of the big advantages with Aldec is the customer support, I've
    always gotten personal attention from their support within hours. Model
    tech, on the other hand has not been all that responsive when issues
    come up.
     
    Ray Andraka, Jun 13, 2006
    #13
  14. Francesco wrote:
    > bart wrote:
    > > oneweek wrote:
    > > > you can try lattice semi for a fraction of cost, only restriction is
    > > > you have to use their FPGA, but not bad at all.
    > > >

    > > ModelSim is included with shipments of Lattice's ispLEVER base
    > > software, which you can purchase (Windows part number:
    > > LS-HDL-BASE-PC-N) from the Lattice online store for $495 at
    > > http://www.latticesemi.com/store/software.cfm
    > >
    > > Regards,
    > > Bart Borosky, Lattice

    >
    > if you use verilog I suggest you to try icarus verilog
    > :http://www.icarus.com/eda/verilog.


    I wanted to use Icarus but I was confronted to a big problem (as a user
    of Xilinx): in the simlation libraries there are specify blocs and
    Icarus verilog doesn't support them and there are no shoft term plans
    to support them. Great was my deception (as open source enthusiast) but
    now I'm obliged to use a commercial simulator.

    > and the wave viewer you can use wave 1.0 : www.iss-us.com
    > I think they are quite good.


    I used gtk-wave for that.

    > They are free and in my opinion they are veru good.
    >
    > Francesco
     
    =?iso-8859-1?B?R2FMYUt0SWtVc5k=?=, Jun 15, 2006
    #14
  15. "GaLaKtIkUs" <> writes:

    > I wanted to use Icarus but I was confronted to a big problem (as a user
    > of Xilinx): in the simlation libraries there are specify blocs and
    > Icarus verilog doesn't support them and there are no shoft term plans
    > to support them.


    There was a bug in the unisim libraries at one point which make ghdl
    (rightfully) choke: an element of an enum had the same name as a
    variable or a type IIRC. Maybe that is your problem?

    Cheers,
    Colin
     
    Colin Marquardt, Jun 15, 2006
    #15
  16. Colin Marquardt wrote:
    > "GaLaKtIkUs" <> writes:
    >
    > > I wanted to use Icarus but I was confronted to a big problem (as a user
    > > of Xilinx): in the simlation libraries there are specify blocs and
    > > Icarus verilog doesn't support them and there are no shoft term plans
    > > to support them.

    >
    > There was a bug in the unisim libraries at one point which make ghdl
    > (rightfully) choke: an element of an enum had the same name as a
    > variable or a type IIRC. Maybe that is your problem?
    >
    > Cheers,
    > Colin


    I'm talking about icarus verilog ... not about ghdl!!!
    Cheers
     
    =?iso-8859-1?B?R2FMYUt0SWtVc5k=?=, Jun 16, 2006
    #16
  17. GaLaKtIkUs™ wrote:

    > I wanted to use Icarus but I was confronted to a big problem (as a user
    > of Xilinx): in the simlation libraries there are specify blocs and
    > Icarus verilog doesn't support them.


    Could you write your own code
    and not use the libraries?

    -- Mike Treseler
     
    Mike Treseler, Jun 17, 2006
    #17
  18. Rewrite the whole libraries, which model Xilinx primitives for all
    Xilinx FPGA/CPLD families and all speed grades?
    :-S


    Mike Treseler wrote:
    > GaLaKtIkUs™ wrote:
    >
    > > I wanted to use Icarus but I was confronted to a big problem (as a user
    > > of Xilinx): in the simlation libraries there are specify blocs and
    > > Icarus verilog doesn't support them.

    >
    > Could you write your own code
    > and not use the libraries?
    >
    > -- Mike Treseler
     
    =?iso-8859-1?B?R2FMYUt0SWtVc5k=?=, Jun 17, 2006
    #18
  19. GaLaKtIkUs™ wrote:
    > Rewrite the whole libraries, which model Xilinx primitives for all
    > Xilinx FPGA/CPLD families and all speed grades?


    No.
    Leave the primitives to synthesis.
    Leave the timing to STA.

    -- Mike Treseler
     
    Mike Treseler, Jun 17, 2006
    #19
  20. Mike Treseler wrote:
    > GaLaKtIkUs™ wrote:
    > > Rewrite the whole libraries, which model Xilinx primitives for all
    > > Xilinx FPGA/CPLD families and all speed grades?

    >
    > No.
    > Leave the primitives to synthesis.
    > Leave the timing to STA.


    STA?

    >
    > -- Mike Treseler
     
    =?iso-8859-1?B?R2FMYUt0SWtVc5k=?=, Jun 17, 2006
    #20
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