IE8 standalone IE7?

[Jonathan N. Little]

Okay now that M$ is finally making an effort to catch up IE8 is now out,
but as with each iteration each version has its own unique "features"
that we must all test for until that last Win98 & Win2k PC finally
dies... So has anyone figured out a way to have IE8 and have IE7
standalone on WinXP without a) visualization, b) extra Winbox? Currently
using Tredosoft's MultipleIEs with standalone IE3-6 with IE 7 installed
and do not want to loose IE7 testing by updating to IE8.

 

[C A Upsdell]

Okay now that M$ is finally making an effort to catch up IE8 is now out,
but as with each iteration each version has its own unique "features"
that we must all test for until that last Win98 & Win2k PC finally
dies... So has anyone figured out a way to have IE8 and have IE7
standalone on WinXP without a) visualization, b) extra Winbox? Currently
using Tredosoft's MultipleIEs with standalone IE3-6 with IE 7 installed
and do not want to loose IE7 testing by updating to IE8.

I have tried http://finalbuilds.edskes.net/iecollection.htm , but found
it to be unreliable and destabilizing. The only effective solution I
have found is Virtual PC, which you reject.

 

[dorayme]

I have tried http://finalbuilds.edskes.net/iecollection.htm , but found
it to be unreliable and destabilizing. The only effective solution I
have found is Virtual PC, which you reject.

Don't shoot me down, ... but I have just got a friend to give me the
executable to put IE8 on my winbox. Not yet installed on mine. When I
saw it on his machine, it seemingly showed how things would look in IE 7
under some menu it had, I forget the name of the command or menu name.
And the multiple IE versions from 6 down that were previously there
before he upgraded to IE8 from 7 still worked.

 

[C A Upsdell]

Don't shoot me down, ... but I have just got a friend to give me the
executable to put IE8 on my winbox. Not yet installed on mine. When I
saw it on his machine, it seemingly showed how things would look in IE 7
under some menu it had, I forget the name of the command or menu name.
And the multiple IE versions from 6 down that were previously there
before he upgraded to IE8 from 7 still worked.

To be more specific about my experiences with a recent version of the IE
Collection. On my PC:

1. One version of IE would not run at all.

2. A second version catastrophically failed with a JavaScript driven page.

3. A third version, when run, destabilized my PC so badly that it took
me 30 hours to make my PC trustworthy again.

Working with Virtual PC is slower, but has been reliable.

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

1. One version of IE would not run at all.

Which one?

2. A second version catastrophically failed with a JavaScript driven page.

Hmmm sometimes IE alone catastrophically fails with JavaScript because
their JavaScript interface has always marched to a different drummer,
might have be a code fork problem

3. A third version, when run, destabilized my PC so badly that it took
me 30 hours to make my PC trustworthy again.

What did it screw up?

Working with Virtual PC is slower, but has been reliable.

Just looking for alternatives, I don't believe I have enough computer to
go the Virtual PC route. Even with Tredosoft's 3-6 MulitpleIE version
bombs periodically especially when more than one version of IE open at
once. Did you have your IE upgraded to version 8 and with FinalBuild
installed up to 7? Or did you have 7 and used FinalBuild to supply 8?

 

[C A Upsdell]

1. One version of IE would not run at all.

Which one?

I think it was 5.5, but I don't really remember, because I deleted the
one that failed. And now I've deleted all of them due to my problems.

Hmmm sometimes IE alone catastrophically fails with JavaScript because
their JavaScript interface has always marched to a different drummer,
might have be a code fork problem

You are suggesting, I think, that the version of JS supported by that
version of IE (I think it was IE 6) was not up to date. I don't know
why the most recent version of JS would not have been included, but in
any case I can't determine this now because I later deleted the whole IE
Collection.

What did it screw up?

The IE Advanced Options pane became completely blank, making it
impossible for me to check or change any of the advanced options. This
problem first appeared in one of the versions of IE in the IE Collection
-- IE 8 I think it was -- but I quickly discovered that it had also
affected the default (normally installed) version of IE on my PC, i.e. IE 7.

Whatever caused this problem therefore affected not only the versions of
IE in the IE collection, but also my default version. And it did so on
the day I was supposed to finish off my taxes!!!

It took a long time to fix the problem, in part because the initial
fixes I found did not work, and in part because I had to do thorough
scans for malware in case in was malware which caused the problem, and
some of the malware scans took hours and hours and hours. It turned out
that it was not caused by malware, unless you want to call the IE
Collection malware. In the end, re-installing IE 7 fixed the problem --
perhaps aided by other things I did before re-installing it -- but it
cost me a lot of time at the worst possible time.

Just looking for alternatives, I don't believe I have enough computer to
go the Virtual PC route. Even with Tredosoft's 3-6 MulitpleIE version
bombs periodically especially when more than one version of IE open at
once. Did you have your IE upgraded to version 8 and with FinalBuild
installed up to 7? Or did you have 7 and used FinalBuild to supply 8?

I have IE7 installed, tried to use the IE collection for IE 5.01, 5.5,
6.0, and 8.0, but now continue to use Virtual PC for all of these.

As for alternatives: *one* potential problem with Virtual PC is
inadequate HD disk space: but this is not a problem for me, because I
bought an external 1T (1 Terabyte) drive for other purposes -- 1T drives
are not that costly today -- so I have no shortage of HD space. RAM is
more of a problem for me -- I have only 1G -- but I have found that I
can run several instances of Windows with no problem when testing sites.

 

[Harlan Messinger]

Okay now that M$ is finally making an effort to catch up IE8 is now out,
but as with each iteration each version has its own unique "features"
that we must all test for until that last Win98 & Win2k PC finally
dies... So has anyone figured out a way to have IE8 and have IE7
standalone on WinXP without a) visualization,

I like that. No need to install IE7 to test it, just close your eyes and
imagine how it would work. I suspect that you meant "virtualization".

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

I like that. No need to install IE7 to test it, just close your eyes and
imagine how it would work. I suspect that you meant "virtualization".

I wish! I close my eyes and dream that IE never existed...ahhhh. Oops
back to reality! Yep wrong word that I must of click from the list when
I made my ever-present typo!

Yes I still have the IE8 installer still sitting on my desktop.
Reluctant to do the upgrade until I can be sure that I will still be
able to test that
"not-as-bad-a-turkey-as-IE6-but-a-turkey-none-the-less" browser.

 

[dorayme]

Yes I still have the IE8 installer still sitting on my desktop.
Reluctant to do the upgrade until I can be sure that I will still be
able to test that
"not-as-bad-a-turkey-as-IE6-but-a-turkey-none-the-less" browser.

Has anyone a clue about the button that comes on IE8 that lets you see
how things would look in IE7 (so I was hesitantly told)?

There is a button over the contents bit of the browser, it looked like
it rendered an IE7 (and 6) float bug (that had disappeared in 8) when I
saw it. But is it modelling IE7 or vaguely 6/7? And I saw with my own
eyes that this 8 did not disable the stand alone multiple 6 and down.

I saw this button on a working machine of friend. I have the IE8 on a
USB stick but have not installed yet because, like Jonathan, I do not
know quite if it it will mean not having an accurate look at 7. Does
anyone know that there is this rendering facility (the button I speak
of) in IE8 or anything about it?

 

[David Mark]

Has anyone a clue about the button that comes on IE8 that lets you see
how things would look in IE7 (so I was hesitantly told)?

Forget it. You will need at least two machines.

[snip]

 

[dorayme]

Forget it.

Is *the reason for this* in your secret knowledge file? I have
instructed my men just now to hunt this file down. If you hear a sort of
shuffling sound from your filing cabinet, don't worry, I have ordered
them not to harm you in any way.

 

[dorayme]

dorayme wrote: .... ....
I haven't tried it yet myself but I seriously doubt that anything other
than IE6/IE7 running natively on a separate machine/virtualization will
be a valid test bed. I have kept an old 933MHz XP machine around for
just this purpose (IE6). My main machines run WXP-Pro/IE7 but I did let
my laptop install IE8 (WXP-Pro). Although, frankly, I really am
seriously considering saying: "Screw all of this. If you want to use
my site(s), here's the new minimum. Get a life." And set it at either
a modern Mozilla browser or IE7+. I mean, at some point ENOUGH!
....
Boy, I sure wish this had been an issue for me when I met Bill Gates in
the early 90s. It wouldn't have been such a nice conversation.

I know what you mean, Ed. When I am chatting to Bill during the breaks I
give him (he does a bit of gardening for me every week) I sometimes want
to raise a few issues too. But I worry about little things like he might
go on a ring-barking and poisoning spree in my garden.

Perhaps no one has seen that button that gives a pre IE8 render?

 

[Gus Richter]

The problem is: What does it do? Should we trust it? I mean, c'mon!
Billy Boy and his minions have hardly been trust-worthy in the past, eh?

I understand, commercial sites and developers have a real issue to
accommodate IE, past and future. But, I'm a hobbyist when it comes to
Web sites. It keeps me off the streets at night, ya know? So, I'm about
getting to the point where it's too much trouble to accommodate
Microsoft or those mindless blind users of its software. Not quite
there yet but real close.


And, as I think about it, isn't all of this a huge joke? I mean,
"standards." Look, I buy a car. I can put gasoline into its tank at
any gas station in my country (and probably any country in the world)
and my car works and doesn't crash and my engine doesn't corrode.

HTML? CSS? Hilarious. What a freaking joke. Standards. Yeah. Call
me when it's sorted out. I won't be losing sleep waiting for the call.
What utter nonsense.

Read this titled, "Spiderman and the XHTML Kindergarten". It will really
give you something to chuckle about:

<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2009May/0029>

 

[dorayme]

....

The problem is: What does it do? Should we trust it? I mean, c'mon!
Billy Boy and his minions have hardly been trust-worthy in the past, eh?

There must be a funny gas spreading over usenet. The problem is no one
but me seems to have seen it - assuming, reasonably enough no?, that
everyone in the world has read my post.

....

HTML? CSS? Hilarious. What a freaking joke. Standards. Yeah. Call
me when it's sorted out. I won't be losing sleep waiting for the call.
What utter nonsense.

I like the way you talk Ed, reminds me of Jimmy Cagney.

 

[Neredbojias]

...

There must be a funny gas spreading over usenet. The problem is no
one but me seems to have seen it - assuming, reasonably enough no?,
that everyone in the world has read my post.

...

I like the way you talk Ed, reminds me of Jimmy Cagney.

Nah, sounds more like Karl Childers.

....

The few times I've used "the button", it emulated ie7 precisely as I
expected but who knows if it's equivalent in all ways?

 

[David Mark]

Is *the reason for this* in your secret knowledge file? I have

You snipped the reason and then apparently forgot you did it.

instructed my men just now to hunt this file down. If you hear a sort of
shuffling sound from your filing cabinet, don't worry, I have ordered
them not to harm you in any way.

I thought you were a loon.

 

[dorayme]

You snipped the reason and then apparently forgot you did it.

What I snipped in that reply of mine was:

To which you replied forget "it" (the button?) and gave no reason.

I thought you were a loon.

It is true I was mad to instruct them to be so restrained. Maybe it is
you who is the real loon pretending not to be. Give me pretending to be
a loon any day!

 

[David Mark]

What I snipped in that reply of mine was:


To which you replied forget "it" (the button?) and gave no reason.

For the love of Christ. You snipped the next sentence (on the same
line no less.)

"You will need at least two machines."

Sound familiar?

[snip]

 

[dorayme]

For the love of Christ. You snipped the next sentence (on the same
line no less.)

"You will need at least two machines."

Sound familiar?

"Sounding familiar" is not a clarifying reply to my complaint. Why do
you need two machines? Why is the button I referred to not good enough
to view IE7? Does the button not represent IE7 at all? Does it represent
it with any useful accuracy to any degree?

You are the one in that Windoze world so how about telling those of us
not in it something about it instead of your short grunts that do their
own snipping of context.

 

[David Mark]

"Sounding familiar" is not a clarifying reply to my complaint. Why do
you need two machines? Why is the button I referred to not good enough
to view IE7? Does the button not represent IE7 at all? Does it represent
it with any useful accuracy to any degree?

You could just accept my advice. No, the IE7 button will not be
suitable for testing IE7. Not a chance.

You are the one in that Windoze world so how about telling those of us
not in it something about it instead of your short grunts that do their
own snipping of context.

It's not a help desk and I am not in any "Windoze world." I have a
few Windows machines, as would any professional.