is this newsgroup for newbies

Discussion in 'C Programming' started by A2B, Dec 6, 2007.

  1. A2B

    A2B Guest

    or advanced ?
    A2B, Dec 6, 2007
    #1
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  2. On 6 Dec 2007 at 18:31, A2B wrote:
    > or advanced ?


    This group enjoys posts from newbies because it can tear them to shreds
    for its own amusement.

    But mainly this group is for language lawyers who want to argue all day
    about irrelevant details and corner cases, and have complete contempt
    for anyone attempting to use C in the real world.
    Antoninus Twink, Dec 6, 2007
    #2
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  3. On Dec 6, 1:31 pm, A2B <> wrote:
    > or advanced ?


    It's for everyone, but you'll find more advanced discussions than
    beginner stuff. For more basic discussions, you might try
    alt.comp.lang.learn.c-c++.


    -Jul
    Julienne Walker, Dec 6, 2007
    #3
  4. A2B

    Ian Collins Guest

    A2B wrote:
    > or advanced ?


    Anyone, but do follow good Usenet practice and check the FAQ (google for
    it) before posting.

    --
    Ian Collins.
    Ian Collins, Dec 6, 2007
    #4
  5. A2B

    Flash Gordon Guest

    A2B wrote, On 06/12/07 18:31:
    > or advanced ?


    Here we tend to expect beginners to show signs of having made a serious
    attempt at solving their problem before asking for help. This should
    include looking at the comp.lang.c FAQ which is at http://c-faq.com/ and
    looking things up in a text book. Don't worry if you have problems
    understanding some of what is in the FAQ since not all of it is beginner
    material.

    You should also read http://clc-wiki.net/wiki/intro_to_clc and
    http://clc-wiki.net/wiki/C_community:comp.lang.c:Portability_attitude to
    get a better understanding of what many of the regulars think.

    Don't worry if code you post here gets "ripped to shreds". People who
    have been programming in C for years still have their code ripped to
    shreds here, but if you can step back from your code and accept the
    criticisms as being criticisms of the code and not of you then you will
    find that you can learn a *lot* from the problems people point out in
    your code.

    Finally, ignore A.Twink, it is one of the resident trolls.
    --
    Flash Gordon
    Flash Gordon, Dec 6, 2007
    #5
  6. A2B wrote:
    > or advanced ?


    Both. Though discussions often get very advanced very quickly...

    But do lurk for a while first, and read the "Welcome" message and FAQ
    referenced in my sig.

    --
    Mark McIntyre

    CLC FAQ <http://c-faq.com/>
    CLC readme: <http://www.ungerhu.com/jxh/clc.welcome.txt>
    Mark McIntyre, Dec 6, 2007
    #6
  7. Antoninus Twink wrote:
    > On 6 Dec 2007 at 18:31, A2B wrote:
    >> or advanced ?

    >
    > This group enjoys posts from newbies because it can tear them to shreds
    > for its own amusement.


    And ignore A Twink, its a troll.

    --
    Mark McIntyre

    CLC FAQ <http://c-faq.com/>
    CLC readme: <http://www.ungerhu.com/jxh/clc.welcome.txt>
    Mark McIntyre, Dec 6, 2007
    #7
  8. A2B said:

    > [is this newsgroup for newbies] or advanced ?


    Both. This newsgroup is for anyone who wishes to discuss the C programming
    language.

    As you will quickly discover, there are C experts here who are very willing
    to help you to get past sticking-points in your learning.

    (There are also several incompetent bozos whose objective seems to be as
    unpleasant and obstructive as possible, but you'll soon identify those for
    yourself, since they hardly ever discuss C, and even when they try, they
    get it wrong. They can safely be ignored.)

    For talking around various aspects of the C language and thus helping you
    to gain familiarity with them, this group is pretty good.

    What this group *won't* do is teach you, or even try to teach you, C
    programming. For that, you will need a good teacher or a very good book;
    you will find a list of very good C books at this URL:

    <http://www.cpax.org.uk/prg/portable/c/resources.php>.

    But if you get stuck, read the FAQ (the URL for which can also be found on
    that page). If you can't find your question there, by all means ask it
    here.

    --
    Richard Heathfield <http://www.cpax.org.uk>
    Email: -http://www. +rjh@
    Google users: <http://www.cpax.org.uk/prg/writings/googly.php>
    "Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
    Richard Heathfield, Dec 6, 2007
    #8
  9. >>>>> "FG" == Flash Gordon <> writes:

    FG> Don't worry if code you post here gets "ripped to
    FG> shreds". People who have been programming in C for years still
    FG> have their code ripped to shreds here, but if you can step
    FG> back from your code and accept the criticisms as being
    FG> criticisms of the code and not of you then you will find that
    FG> you can learn a *lot* from the problems people point out in
    FG> your code.

    On the other hand, few things are more happy-making than posting code
    in here, seeing a few of the resident experts comment on it, and *not*
    having it ripped to shreds.

    Charlton



    --
    Charlton Wilbur
    Charlton Wilbur, Dec 6, 2007
    #9
  10. A2B

    Guest

    A2B wrote:
    > or advanced ?


    This newsgroup is, ideally, a place where newbies can go to post
    questions about using the C language that people with more advanced
    knowledge of C can answer. It's also a place those people can discuss
    things with each other. They can also argue with each other. On
    occasion, they can engage in bitter flame wars. That's life in an
    unmoderated newsgroup. Personally, I prefer moderated newsgroups, but
    for some reason comp.lang.c.moderated is a ghost town.

    If you post a question to this newsgroup, any little detail of your
    question might prompt one of the more advanced people to make a
    comment that will trigger yet another flame war. Be warned.
    , Dec 6, 2007
    #10
  11. A2B

    santosh Guest

    wrote:

    [ ... ]

    > Personally, I prefer moderated newsgroups, but
    > for some reason comp.lang.c.moderated is a ghost town.


    Traffic on C language is usually too high for practical moderation. As a
    result posts can take days to appear on c.l.c.m after they have been
    sent. That was probably the reason that no one favours it.

    > If you post a question to this newsgroup, any little detail of your
    > question might prompt one of the more advanced people to make a
    > comment that will trigger yet another flame war. Be warned.


    The term flame war is misleading. In war you have no choice. On Usenet
    you always have the choice of ignoring useless posts/threads.
    santosh, Dec 6, 2007
    #11
  12. A2B

    vlsidesign Guest

    On Dec 6, 12:27 pm, Richard Heathfield <> wrote:
    > A2B said:
    >
    > > [is this newsgroup for newbies] or advanced ?

    >
    > Both. This newsgroup is for anyone who wishes to discuss the C programming
    > language.
    >
    > As you will quickly discover, there are C experts here who are very willing
    > to help you to get past sticking-points in your learning.
    >


    This newsgroup is awesome. Normally you would have to pay good money
    to get the type of insight that is given. Thanks for the awesome
    contributions from the experts.
    vlsidesign, Dec 7, 2007
    #12
  13. In article <>,
    One of (yet another one of) RH's sock puppets <> fawned:
    ....
    >This newsgroup is awesome. Normally you would have to pay good money
    >to get the type of insight that is given. Thanks for the awesome
    >contributions from the experts.


    Yeah. Right.
    Kenny McCormack, Dec 7, 2007
    #13
  14. A2B wrote:
    >
    > or advanced ?


    "What they said." :)

    Also, please realize that what is discussed here is "C", as defined
    by the ISO standards. It does not include extensions to the language,
    such as network I/O, graphics, and so on, even if you are using a
    "standard" API, as there are other places where those topics can be
    discussed.

    There are numerous reasons for limiting the discussion to just the
    ISO C standards. Among these (in no particular order) are the fact
    that allowing discussions of anything written in "C", regardless of
    the extensions being used, would dilute the intent of this group,
    which is to focus on standard C itself. Also, while most of the
    regulars here know numerous such extensions (even "standard" ones),
    no one knows all. If someone were to post an answer on one of
    these topics, and that answer was wrong, or included bad advice for
    that particular extension, the others here couldn't point that out.
    Finally, there are usually better venus for discussing such topics,
    such as the many Microsoft groups for discussing Windows programs,
    or numerous Unix groups for discussing things such as TCP/IP or
    POSIX functions.

    --
    +-------------------------+--------------------+-----------------------+
    | Kenneth J. Brody | www.hvcomputer.com | #include |
    | kenbrody/at\spamcop.net | www.fptech.com | <std_disclaimer.h> |
    +-------------------------+--------------------+-----------------------+
    Don't e-mail me at: <mailto:>
    Kenneth Brody, Dec 7, 2007
    #14
  15. "Kenny McCormack" <> wrote in message > In
    article
    > One of (yet another one of) RH's sock puppets <> fawned:
    > ...
    >>This newsgroup is awesome. Normally you would have to pay good
    >> money to get the type of insight that is given. Thanks for the awesome
    >>contributions from the experts.

    >
    > Yeah. Right.
    >

    Richard Heathfield is generous with the amount of effort he devotes to
    helping newbies.
    You can say other things against him, but I think you've got to grant that.

    --
    Free games and programming goodies.
    http://www.personal.leeds.ac.uk/~bgy1mm
    Malcolm McLean, Dec 10, 2007
    #15
  16. In article <>,
    Malcolm McLean <> wrote:
    >
    >"Kenny McCormack" <> wrote in message > In
    >article
    >> One of (yet another one of) RH's sock puppets <> fawned:
    >> ...
    >>>This newsgroup is awesome. Normally you would have to pay good
    >>> money to get the type of insight that is given. Thanks for the awesome
    >>>contributions from the experts.

    >>
    >> Yeah. Right.
    >>

    >Richard Heathfield is generous with the amount of effort he devotes to
    >helping newbies.


    Helping them to the door, you mean.

    At best, the help is "go see newsgroup xyz and re-ask your question
    there". Now, as an experienced Usenetter (and, presumably native
    speaker of English), you may think this is just fine (and you may not
    see how cruel it is), but trust me, as a newbie, you just don't want to
    hear that sort of crap. Especially when you know damn well that they
    could easily answer it, and that they are feigning ignorance of what
    you're asking.

    >You can say other things against him, but I think you've got to grant that.


    I don't people credit for effort. I.e., if the help is useless, then
    the effort is worse than nothing.
    Kenny McCormack, Dec 10, 2007
    #16
  17. A2B

    CBFalconer Guest

    Malcolm McLean wrote:
    > "Kenny McCormack" <> wrote
    >> <> fawned:
    >> ...
    >>> This newsgroup is awesome. Normally you would have to pay good
    >>> money to get the type of insight that is given. Thanks for the
    >>> awesome contributions from the experts.

    >>
    >> Yeah. Right.

    >
    > Richard Heathfield is generous with the amount of effort he
    > devotes to helping newbies. You can say other things against
    > him, but I think you've got to grant that.


    Please don't amuse the McCormack troll with responses.

    --
    Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukah, Happy New Year
    Joyeux Noel, Bonne Annee.
    Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
    <http://cbfalconer.home.att.net>



    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    CBFalconer, Dec 10, 2007
    #17
  18. In article <>,
    CBFalconer <> wrote:
    >Malcolm McLean wrote:
    >> "Kenny McCormack" <> wrote
    >>> <> fawned:
    >>> ...
    >>>> This newsgroup is awesome. Normally you would have to pay good
    >>>> money to get the type of insight that is given. Thanks for the
    >>>> awesome contributions from the experts.
    >>>
    >>> Yeah. Right.

    >>
    >> Richard Heathfield is generous with the amount of effort he
    >> devotes to helping newbies. You can say other things against
    >> him, but I think you've got to grant that.

    >
    >Please don't amuse the McCormack troll with responses.


    Um, Malcolm has a brain. He cannot be pushed around by you turkeys.

    I know you and Thompson are used to being able to push the newbies
    around, but it won't work here.
    Kenny McCormack, Dec 10, 2007
    #18
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