JAWS and Netscape/Firefox

Discussion in 'Java' started by Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005.

  1. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
    There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
    files to javaws.exe.

    They have plugins, which are more elaborate, but so simple
    associations, at least not that I could fathom.

    Has someone written a minimalist plugin to allow JAWS to work? Or is
    there some simple way to add the association?

    What is more they appear to ignore the association set up in Windows.


    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005
    #1
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  2. On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:05:35 GMT, Roedy Green wrote:

    > Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
    > There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
    > files to javaws.exe.


    Got an URL?

    I just tested using Mozilla 1.7.2 and IE 6.0028 on
    <http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp>
    and they display the *same* behaviour of ..
    displaing my JNLP in the browser, because I have thus
    far failed to set up a Mime-Type for JNLP on the server.
    [ And that is the way to approach this problem, as I understand. ]

    Don't you have a mime-type *checker* on your site?

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    physci.org 1point1c.org javasaver.com lensescapes.com athompson.info
    Where No Fan Has Gone Before
    Andrew Thompson, Aug 2, 2005
    #2
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  3. Roedy Green

    Hemal Pandya Guest


    > Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
    > There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
    > files to javaws.exe.
    >
    > They have plugins, which are more elaborate, but so simple
    > associations, at least not that I could fathom.
    >
    > Has someone written a minimalist plugin to allow JAWS to work? Or is
    > there some simple way to add the association?
    >
    > What is more they appear to ignore the association set up in Windows.


    When I go to http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
    FireFox gives two options:
    1. Open With: The drop-down has one entry JNLPFile(default)
    2. Save to Disk

    Choosing the first opens it with javaws.exe. I think it has picked it
    up from Windows associations, but it could be something I did (opened a
    JNLP with jawaws):

    hpandya@Hemalp ~
    $ cmd /c assoc .jnlp
    ..jnlp=JNLPFile

    hpandya@Hemalp ~
    $ cmd /c ftype JNLPFile
    JNLPFile="C:\Program Files\Java\jre1.5.0_04\bin\javaws.exe" "%1"
    Hemal Pandya, Aug 2, 2005
    #3
  4. On 1 Aug 2005 22:24:48 -0700, Hemal Pandya wrote:

    >> Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
    >> There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
    >> files to javaws.exe.

    ...
    > When I go to http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
    > FireFox gives two options:


    I get another one in between those

    > 1. Open With: The drop-down has one entry JNLPFile(default)


    Open it with ' ' |Choose..|

    > 2. Save to Disk


    ...but basically, yes, I get the exact same behaviour
    that you described, and for the exact same browser that
    displayed the <http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp>
    in the browser.

    [ Check *my* JNLP with your Moz., Hemal, to confirm it
    is not an 'OS' thing. ]

    It comes down to mime-types/content-type
    (actually I think it's content types)
    for the files.

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    physci.org 1point1c.org javasaver.com lensescapes.com athompson.info
    Disclaimer: Any Resemblance To Actual Robots Would Be Really Cool
    Andrew Thompson, Aug 2, 2005
    #4
  5. Roedy Green

    Hemal Pandya Guest


    > On 1 Aug 2005 22:24:48 -0700, Hemal Pandya wrote:
    >
    > >> Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
    > >> There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
    > >> files to javaws.exe.

    > ..
    > > When I go to http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
    > > FireFox gives two options:

    >
    > I get another one in between those
    >
    > > 1. Open With: The drop-down has one entry JNLPFile(default)

    >
    > Open it with ' ' |Choose..|


    Maybe I got it some time in past and I chose javaws at that time. Nope,
    then it would have said open with javaws.

    >
    > > 2. Save to Disk

    >
    > ..but basically, yes, I get the exact same behaviour
    > that you described, and for the exact same browser that
    > displayed the <http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp>
    > in the browser.
    >
    > [ Check *my* JNLP with your Moz., Hemal, to confirm it
    > is not an 'OS' thing. ]


    Like you said, it displays the JNLP text in the browser.

    >
    > It comes down to mime-types/content-type
    > (actually I think it's content types)
    > for the files.


    Yes. When I wget the two URLS, the sun url returns
    application/x-java-jnlp-file while the PhySci returns text/plain:

    $ wget -O /dev/null
    http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
    --12:49:20-- http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
    => `/dev/null'
    Resolving java.sun.com... 209.249.116.141
    Connecting to java.sun.com[209.249.116.141]:80... connected.
    HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK
    Length: 1,067 [application/x-java-jnlp-file]

    0K . 100%
    10.18 MB/s

    12:49:21 (10.18 MB/s) - `/dev/null' saved [1067/1067]

    hpandyaHemalp /tmp Tue Aug 2 12:49:21 2005
    $ wget http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp
    --12:49:29-- http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp
    => `PhySci.jnlp.1'
    Resolving www.physci.org... 195.141.149.14
    Connecting to www.physci.org[195.141.149.14]:80... connected.
    HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK
    Length: 808 [text/plain]

    0K 100%
    7.71 MB/s

    12:49:31 (7.71 MB/s) - `PhySci.jnlp.1' saved [808/808]
    Hemal Pandya, Aug 2, 2005
    #5
  6. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:20:00 GMT, Andrew Thompson
    <> wrote or quoted :

    >Got an URL?


    I discovered IE, Firefox and Netscape all work with a web based URL,
    presumably because it gets the extra hint of the mime-type from the
    server.

    IE does nothing with a local hard disk reference. It just displays a
    blank screen with no message.

    Firefox and Netscape display it as colourised XML.

    This all seems quite bizarre since the Windows registry has a huge
    database of mime types and extensions. There is no excuse for any of
    this.

    if you want a JNLP file to play with see
    http://mindprod.com/webstarts/setclock.jnlp

    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005
    #6
  7. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On 1 Aug 2005 22:24:48 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    wrote or quoted :

    >When I go to http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
    >FireFox gives two options:
    >1. Open With: The drop-down has one entry JNLPFile(default)
    >2. Save to Disk
    >
    >Choosing the first opens it with javaws.exe. I think it has picked it
    >up from Windows associations, but it could be something I did (opened a
    >JNLP with jawaws):


    to see the problem, select save to disk.

    Now create a tiny piece of HTML to access the jnlp file locally or
    just type the local url on the command line.

    <a href="../draw.jnlp">run</a>


    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005
    #7
  8. On 2 Aug 2005 00:22:24 -0700, Hemal Pandya wrote:

    > Yes. When I wget the two URLS, the sun url returns
    > application/x-java-jnlp-file while the PhySci returns text/plain:


    Thank you. I think that cuts straight to the heart of
    the problem.

    Note - to all listeners, that I am soon to change the
    content type for the PhySci pages, so that should not
    happen at the PhySci site for much longer.

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    physci.org 1point1c.org javasaver.com lensescapes.com athompson.info
    Filmed on Location
    Andrew Thompson, Aug 2, 2005
    #8
  9. On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 07:27:14 GMT, Roedy Green wrote:

    > to see the problem, select save to disk.
    >
    > Now create a tiny piece of HTML to access the jnlp file locally


    That would seem to be entirely the problem.

    >...or just type the local url on the command line.
    >
    > <a href="../draw.jnlp">run</a>


    Your *OS* is not correctly specifying the type.

    Check it here, if possible ..
    <http://www.mindprod.com/jgloss/mime.html>
    Does your type checker work with local files?

    Off Apache on 'localhost', it should work just fine if the
    content-types are set correctly.

    But I would not expect it to work off a local HTML
    [ ..which suggests that installing off a CD would
    also be problematic ].

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    physci.org 1point1c.org javasaver.com lensescapes.com athompson.info
    Featuring Gratuitous Alien Nudity
    Andrew Thompson, Aug 2, 2005
    #9
  10. Roedy Green

    Hemal Pandya Guest

    > On 1 Aug 2005 22:24:48 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    > wrote or quoted :
    >

    [....]
    > to see the problem, select save to disk.
    >
    > Now create a tiny piece of HTML to access the jnlp file locally or
    > just type the local url on the command line.
    >
    > <a href="../draw.jnlp">run</a>


    It is still opened with javaws. Both from html file and using cmd /c
    start file://c:/cygwin/tmp/draw.jnlp. Actually I had expected that it
    will open them in the browser -- I remember some lengthy discussion in
    FireFox forums about why not to obey Windows associations. Maybe it is
    different for local files; even for PhySci.jnlp it asks whether I want
    to download and save or open it.

    Running FF 1.0.6 on Windows XPSP2.
    Hemal Pandya, Aug 2, 2005
    #10
  11. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 07:29:02 GMT, Andrew Thompson
    <> wrote or quoted :

    >> Yes. When I wget the two URLS, the sun url returns
    >> application/x-java-jnlp-file while the PhySci returns text/plain:


    You can find out what a server is returning with my mimecheck Applet
    available to run online or download at

    http://mindprod.com/applets/mimecheck.html


    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005
    #11
  12. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 07:48:40 GMT, Andrew Thompson
    <> wrote or quoted :

    >Your *OS* is not correctly specifying the type.


    file://localhost/E:/mindprod/webstarts/setclock.jnlp

    on the command line, with Opera, launches properly. Opera is
    configured with mime and extension.

    On the command line with Mozilla, I get a colourised listing>

    in MimeCheck, with either, it just sits there. I will have to change
    the program to give a better message.

    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005
    #12
  13. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 07:48:40 GMT, Andrew Thompson
    <> wrote or quoted :

    >Check it here, if possible ..
    ><http://www.mindprod.com/jgloss/mime.html>
    >Does your type checker work with local files?


    The fault lies in the OS/browser. They, between them, should be
    supplying MIME types for reads from the local file system, effectively
    simulating a tiny HTTP server.

    In the meantime, Use Opera, or set up a small local HTTP server with
    port inaccessible to the outside world.
    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005
    #13
  14. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On 2 Aug 2005 00:57:53 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    wrote or quoted :

    >It is still opened with javaws


    That is not what it is doing on my machine. Did you do an experiment
    or are you arguing from theoretical understanding?

    With the Windows association set, I can launch from the command line
    with

    setclock.jnlp

    But that still does not help Firefox, Netscape and IE launch a local
    file.

    Mozilla is ok, as is Opera, if you set up the association. Sorry I
    often confuse Mozilla and Firefox.

    One source of the problem is when you set up the Windows association,
    Windows is not interested in being told the MIME type. Browsers want
    the MIME type for confirmation of the association. It is one thing to
    associate an extension on your machine with a program, and quite
    another to associate any file on the net's extension with one of your
    programs.



    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 2, 2005
    #14
  15. Roedy Green

    Hemal Pandya Guest


    > On 2 Aug 2005 00:57:53 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    > wrote or quoted :
    >
    > >It is still opened with javaws

    >
    > That is not what it is doing on my machine. Did you do an experiment
    > or are you arguing from theoretical understanding?



    I did try it out. Yesterday and again today. Same results. FireFox asks
    me if I want to it Open with JNLPFile (default) or Save it to disk.

    >
    > With the Windows association set, I can launch from the command line
    > with
    >
    > setclock.jnlp
    >
    > But that still does not help Firefox, Netscape and IE launch a local
    > file.


    What is your version of FF?

    >
    > Mozilla is ok, as is Opera, if you set up the association. Sorry I
    > often confuse Mozilla and Firefox.
    >
    > One source of the problem is when you set up the Windows association,
    > Windows is not interested in being told the MIME type. Browsers want
    > the MIME type for confirmation of the association. It is one thing to
    > associate an extension on your machine with a program, and quite
    > another to associate any file on the net's extension with one of your
    > programs.
    >


    I suspect the argument is that a lot of users don't know what files are
    on their system. With Windows Explorer hiding the (lat) file extension
    it easy to fool a user.
    Hemal Pandya, Aug 3, 2005
    #15
  16. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On 2 Aug 2005 21:23:35 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    wrote or quoted :

    >I did try it out. Yesterday and again today. Same results. FireFox asks
    >me if I want to it Open with JNLPFile (default) or Save it to disk.


    Are you doing local or web? With me it works fine on the web but not
    locally.

    I have Firefox 1.0.6 and Win2K. If you get different results, perhaps
    the OS is behaving differently.

    That might explain why this slipped through. Most people are on XP
    now.

    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 3, 2005
    #16
  17. Roedy Green

    Hemal Pandya Guest

    > On 2 Aug 2005 21:23:35 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    > wrote or quoted :
    >
    > >I did try it out. Yesterday and again today. Same results. FireFox asks
    > >me if I want to it Open with JNLPFile (default) or Save it to disk.

    >
    > Are you doing local or web? With me it works fine on the web but not
    > locally.


    Local. The following all open the file with javaws:
    Cygwin bash prompt: cygstart PhySci.jnlp
    Cygwin bash prompt: cmd /c start PhySci.jnlp
    On WinXP cmd prompt: start PhySci.jnlp
    Clicking on the link in file:///c:/cygwin/tmp/a/t.html

    >
    > I have Firefox 1.0.6 and Win2K. If you get different results, perhaps
    > the OS is behaving differently.
    >
    > That might explain why this slipped through. Most people are on XP
    > now.
    >


    I do use XP. But the start command works for you (with association set)
    so I do not think it can be the OS.
    Hemal Pandya, Aug 3, 2005
    #17
  18. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On 3 Aug 2005 01:49:13 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    wrote or quoted :

    >I do use XP. But the start command works for you (with association set)
    >so I do not think it can be the OS.


    did you set up some sort of association in Firefox?

    --
    Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
    Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
    http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
    Roedy Green, Aug 3, 2005
    #18
  19. Roedy Green

    Hemal Pandya Guest

    Roedy Green wrote:
    > On 3 Aug 2005 01:49:13 -0700, "Hemal Pandya" <>
    > wrote or quoted :
    >
    > >I do use XP. But the start command works for you (with association set)
    > >so I do not think it can be the OS.

    >
    > did you set up some sort of association in Firefox?


    Both. The only way I know of to set up association in FireFox is as
    follows: when FF asks me whether to open the file or download it, if I
    tick on the check-box "Do this automatically for files like this from
    now on" then it creates an association, which I can change or delete in
    Tools/Options. But this just affects the "automatically" part.

    Without the association (before setting it up and after deleting it) it
    asks me what I want to do with it. Always offering JNLPFile default.
    Hemal Pandya, Aug 3, 2005
    #19
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