JAWS and Netscape/Firefox

R

Roedy Green

Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
files to javaws.exe.

They have plugins, which are more elaborate, but so simple
associations, at least not that I could fathom.

Has someone written a minimalist plugin to allow JAWS to work? Or is
there some simple way to add the association?

What is more they appear to ignore the association set up in Windows.


--
Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
 
A

Andrew Thompson

Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
files to javaws.exe.

Got an URL?

I just tested using Mozilla 1.7.2 and IE 6.0028 on
<http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp>
and they display the *same* behaviour of ..
displaing my JNLP in the browser, because I have thus
far failed to set up a Mime-Type for JNLP on the server.
[ And that is the way to approach this problem, as I understand. ]

Don't you have a mime-type *checker* on your site?
 
H

Hemal Pandya

Netscape is built on Firefox and they seem to have a common omission.
There is no way to set up an association, e.g. for JAWS to send JNLP
files to javaws.exe.

They have plugins, which are more elaborate, but so simple
associations, at least not that I could fathom.

Has someone written a minimalist plugin to allow JAWS to work? Or is
there some simple way to add the association?

What is more they appear to ignore the association set up in Windows.

When I go to http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
FireFox gives two options:
1. Open With: The drop-down has one entry JNLPFile(default)
2. Save to Disk

Choosing the first opens it with javaws.exe. I think it has picked it
up from Windows associations, but it could be something I did (opened a
JNLP with jawaws):

hpandya@Hemalp ~
$ cmd /c assoc .jnlp
..jnlp=JNLPFile

hpandya@Hemalp ~
$ cmd /c ftype JNLPFile
JNLPFile="C:\Program Files\Java\jre1.5.0_04\bin\javaws.exe" "%1"
 
A

Andrew Thompson


I get another one in between those
1. Open With: The drop-down has one entry JNLPFile(default)

Open it with ' ' |Choose..|
2. Save to Disk

...but basically, yes, I get the exact same behaviour
that you described, and for the exact same browser that
displayed the <http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp>
in the browser.

[ Check *my* JNLP with your Moz., Hemal, to confirm it
is not an 'OS' thing. ]

It comes down to mime-types/content-type
(actually I think it's content types)
for the files.
 
H

Hemal Pandya

I get another one in between those


Open it with ' ' |Choose..|

Maybe I got it some time in past and I chose javaws at that time. Nope,
then it would have said open with javaws.
2. Save to Disk

..but basically, yes, I get the exact same behaviour
that you described, and for the exact same browser that
displayed the <http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp>
in the browser.

[ Check *my* JNLP with your Moz., Hemal, to confirm it
is not an 'OS' thing. ]

Like you said, it displays the JNLP text in the browser.
It comes down to mime-types/content-type
(actually I think it's content types)
for the files.

Yes. When I wget the two URLS, the sun url returns
application/x-java-jnlp-file while the PhySci returns text/plain:

$ wget -O /dev/null
http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
--12:49:20-- http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
=> `/dev/null'
Resolving java.sun.com... 209.249.116.141
Connecting to java.sun.com[209.249.116.141]:80... connected.
HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK
Length: 1,067 [application/x-java-jnlp-file]

0K . 100%
10.18 MB/s

12:49:21 (10.18 MB/s) - `/dev/null' saved [1067/1067]

hpandyaHemalp /tmp Tue Aug 2 12:49:21 2005
$ wget http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp
--12:49:29-- http://www.physci.org/jnlp/PhySci.jnlp
=> `PhySci.jnlp.1'
Resolving www.physci.org... 195.141.149.14
Connecting to www.physci.org[195.141.149.14]:80... connected.
HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK
Length: 808 [text/plain]

0K 100%
7.71 MB/s

12:49:31 (7.71 MB/s) - `PhySci.jnlp.1' saved [808/808]
 
R

Roedy Green

Got an URL?

I discovered IE, Firefox and Netscape all work with a web based URL,
presumably because it gets the extra hint of the mime-type from the
server.

IE does nothing with a local hard disk reference. It just displays a
blank screen with no message.

Firefox and Netscape display it as colourised XML.

This all seems quite bizarre since the Windows registry has a huge
database of mime types and extensions. There is no excuse for any of
this.

if you want a JNLP file to play with see
http://mindprod.com/webstarts/setclock.jnlp

--
Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
 
R

Roedy Green

When I go to http://java.sun.com/products/javawebstart/apps/draw.jnlp
FireFox gives two options:
1. Open With: The drop-down has one entry JNLPFile(default)
2. Save to Disk

Choosing the first opens it with javaws.exe. I think it has picked it
up from Windows associations, but it could be something I did (opened a
JNLP with jawaws):

to see the problem, select save to disk.

Now create a tiny piece of HTML to access the jnlp file locally or
just type the local url on the command line.

<a href="../draw.jnlp">run</a>


--
Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
 
A

Andrew Thompson

Yes. When I wget the two URLS, the sun url returns
application/x-java-jnlp-file while the PhySci returns text/plain:

Thank you. I think that cuts straight to the heart of
the problem.

Note - to all listeners, that I am soon to change the
content type for the PhySci pages, so that should not
happen at the PhySci site for much longer.
 
A

Andrew Thompson

to see the problem, select save to disk.

Now create a tiny piece of HTML to access the jnlp file locally

That would seem to be entirely the problem.
...or just type the local url on the command line.

<a href="../draw.jnlp">run</a>

Your *OS* is not correctly specifying the type.

Check it here, if possible ..
<http://www.mindprod.com/jgloss/mime.html>
Does your type checker work with local files?

Off Apache on 'localhost', it should work just fine if the
content-types are set correctly.

But I would not expect it to work off a local HTML
[ ..which suggests that installing off a CD would
also be problematic ].
 
H

Hemal Pandya

On 1 Aug 2005 22:24:48 -0700 said:
wrote or quoted :
[....]
to see the problem, select save to disk.

Now create a tiny piece of HTML to access the jnlp file locally or
just type the local url on the command line.

<a href="../draw.jnlp">run</a>

It is still opened with javaws. Both from html file and using cmd /c
start file://c:/cygwin/tmp/draw.jnlp. Actually I had expected that it
will open them in the browser -- I remember some lengthy discussion in
FireFox forums about why not to obey Windows associations. Maybe it is
different for local files; even for PhySci.jnlp it asks whether I want
to download and save or open it.

Running FF 1.0.6 on Windows XPSP2.
 
R

Roedy Green

Your *OS* is not correctly specifying the type.

file://localhost/E:/mindprod/webstarts/setclock.jnlp

on the command line, with Opera, launches properly. Opera is
configured with mime and extension.

On the command line with Mozilla, I get a colourised listing>

in MimeCheck, with either, it just sits there. I will have to change
the program to give a better message.

--
Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
 
R

Roedy Green

Check it here, if possible ..
<http://www.mindprod.com/jgloss/mime.html>
Does your type checker work with local files?

The fault lies in the OS/browser. They, between them, should be
supplying MIME types for reads from the local file system, effectively
simulating a tiny HTTP server.

In the meantime, Use Opera, or set up a small local HTTP server with
port inaccessible to the outside world.
--
Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
 
R

Roedy Green

It is still opened with javaws

That is not what it is doing on my machine. Did you do an experiment
or are you arguing from theoretical understanding?

With the Windows association set, I can launch from the command line
with

setclock.jnlp

But that still does not help Firefox, Netscape and IE launch a local
file.

Mozilla is ok, as is Opera, if you set up the association. Sorry I
often confuse Mozilla and Firefox.

One source of the problem is when you set up the Windows association,
Windows is not interested in being told the MIME type. Browsers want
the MIME type for confirmation of the association. It is one thing to
associate an extension on your machine with a program, and quite
another to associate any file on the net's extension with one of your
programs.



--
Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
 
H

Hemal Pandya

That is not what it is doing on my machine. Did you do an experiment
or are you arguing from theoretical understanding?


I did try it out. Yesterday and again today. Same results. FireFox asks
me if I want to it Open with JNLPFile (default) or Save it to disk.
With the Windows association set, I can launch from the command line
with

setclock.jnlp

But that still does not help Firefox, Netscape and IE launch a local
file.

What is your version of FF?
Mozilla is ok, as is Opera, if you set up the association. Sorry I
often confuse Mozilla and Firefox.

One source of the problem is when you set up the Windows association,
Windows is not interested in being told the MIME type. Browsers want
the MIME type for confirmation of the association. It is one thing to
associate an extension on your machine with a program, and quite
another to associate any file on the net's extension with one of your
programs.

I suspect the argument is that a lot of users don't know what files are
on their system. With Windows Explorer hiding the (lat) file extension
it easy to fool a user.
 
R

Roedy Green

I did try it out. Yesterday and again today. Same results. FireFox asks
me if I want to it Open with JNLPFile (default) or Save it to disk.

Are you doing local or web? With me it works fine on the web but not
locally.

I have Firefox 1.0.6 and Win2K. If you get different results, perhaps
the OS is behaving differently.

That might explain why this slipped through. Most people are on XP
now.

--
Bush crime family lost/embezzled $3 trillion from Pentagon.
Complicit Bush-friendly media keeps mum. Rumsfeld confesses on video.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
 
H

Hemal Pandya

I did try it out. Yesterday and again today. Same results. FireFox asks
me if I want to it Open with JNLPFile (default) or Save it to disk.

Are you doing local or web? With me it works fine on the web but not
locally.[/QUOTE]

Local. The following all open the file with javaws:
Cygwin bash prompt: cygstart PhySci.jnlp
Cygwin bash prompt: cmd /c start PhySci.jnlp
On WinXP cmd prompt: start PhySci.jnlp
Clicking on the link in file:///c:/cygwin/tmp/a/t.html
I have Firefox 1.0.6 and Win2K. If you get different results, perhaps
the OS is behaving differently.

That might explain why this slipped through. Most people are on XP
now.

I do use XP. But the start command works for you (with association set)
so I do not think it can be the OS.
 
R

Roedy Green

H

Hemal Pandya

Roedy said:
did you set up some sort of association in Firefox?

Both. The only way I know of to set up association in FireFox is as
follows: when FF asks me whether to open the file or download it, if I
tick on the check-box "Do this automatically for files like this from
now on" then it creates an association, which I can change or delete in
Tools/Options. But this just affects the "automatically" part.

Without the association (before setting it up and after deleting it) it
asks me what I want to do with it. Always offering JNLPFile default.
 

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