Model Centric Perl Web Framework

Discussion in 'Perl Misc' started by Ilias Lazaridis, Oct 29, 2011.

  1. I am looking for a perl web application framework, and found this
    overview here:

    https://www.socialtext.net/perl5/web_frameworks

    I have two basic requierements:

    a) "Model Centric".

    "Model Centric" means, that the Model (and thus the OO Classes) is the
    central point of development, and that the database is *not* a "point
    of development" (or only optional if wanted, e.g. when dealing with a
    given db-schema).

    If I specify my model, I can then create the underlying database using
    automations.

    The same is true for CRUD functionality, which should be created
    either dynamically at runtime, or via generators - using the classes
    and metadata specified in the model.

    An ideal implementation would allow me to continue incrementally,
    creating automaticly updates of db-schemas and CRUD's, whilst
    preserving data and my custom-changes made to the CRUD's.

    b) "Authentication Functionality" (Modules / Components)

    I would need modules for Open Auth Systems (Opent Auth, Open ID) and
    modules for popular sites like facebook, twitter, google etc.

    -

    Can anyone tell me which framework fullfills the requirement "a" and
    ideally requirement "b", too) ?

    Thank you in advance.

    ..

    --
    http://lazaridis.com
    Ilias Lazaridis, Oct 29, 2011
    #1
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  2. On 29 Ïêô, 16:17, Ilias Lazaridis <> wrote:
    > I am looking for a perl web application framework, and found this
    > overview here:
    >
    > https://www.socialtext.net/perl5/web_frameworks
    >
    > I have two basic requierements:
    >
    > a) "Model Centric".
    >
    > "Model Centric" means, that the Model (and thus the OO Classes) is the
    > central point of development, and that the database is *not* a "point
    > of development" (or only optional if wanted, e.g. when dealing with a
    > given db-schema).
    >
    > If I specify my model, I can then create the underlying database using
    > automations.
    >
    > The same is true for CRUD functionality, which should be created
    > either dynamically at runtime, or via generators - using the classes
    > and metadata specified in the model.
    >
    > An ideal implementation would allow me to continue incrementally,
    > creating automaticly updates of db-schemas and CRUD's, whilst
    > preserving data and my custom-changes made to the CRUD's.
    >
    > b) "Authentication Functionality" (Modules / Components)
    >
    > I would need modules for Open Auth Systems (Opent Auth, Open ID) and
    > modules for popular sites like facebook, twitter, google etc.
    >
    > -
    >
    > Can anyone tell me which framework fullfills the requirement "a" and
    > ideally requirement "b", too) ?
    >
    > Thank you in advance.
    >
    > .


    Anything here?

    I got some info on mojolicious

    http://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious/browse_frm/thread/695af4c5ae661d90

    ..

    --
    http://lazaridis.com
    Ilias Lazaridis, Nov 4, 2011
    #2
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  3. Your question is very generic. For me the simple CGI with some DBI
    module is enough.
    George Mpouras, Nov 5, 2011
    #3
  4. On 5 ÍïÝ, 02:11, George Mpouras
    <> wrote:
    > Your question is very generic. For me the simple CGI with some DBI
    > module is enough.


    the question is quite concrete. I do not ask "what perl webframework
    do you prefere" but "which perl webframework is model-centric".

    It's sad, if I've really to go through every documentation.

    --
    http://lazaridis.com
    Ilias Lazaridis, Nov 7, 2011
    #4
  5. Ben Morrow <> writes:

    [...]

    > IMHO if you're using an RDBMS just to serialise a handful of objects
    > you're wasting it: the whole point of SQL is it lets you ask
    > questions you weren't expecting when you put the data in the
    > database.


    The irony of SQL is that it was designed in order to enable people to
    perform complex data analysis tasks without having to learn how to
    write programs in an imperative programming language but that it is
    mostly used by people who know how to do the latter and are not
    exactly keen on learning the former.

    [SCNR]
    Rainer Weikusat, Nov 7, 2011
    #5
  6. On 7 Îοέ, 03:22, Ben Morrow <> wrote:
    > Quoth Ilias Lazaridis <>:
    >
    > > On 5 , 02:11, George Mpouras
    > > <> wrote:
    > > > Your question is very generic. For me the simple CGI with some DBI
    > > > module is enough.

    >
    > > the question is quite concrete.

    >
    > I agree. I only didn't respond because I don't think I've got a good
    > answer.
    >
    > > I do not ask "what perl webframework do you prefere" but "which perl
    > > webframework is model-centric".

    >
    > IIUC you aren't just looking for something which puts the business logic
    > in the model (which is simply good practice in an MVC system) but you
    > more specifically want a system which will generate and update a
    > database schema out of thin air given only a set of objects to store.


    like you write, but "out of the class definition and related meta-
    data" (and some version information about the database which the
    framework keeps internally)

    > If you just want a good MVC system, I'd recommend Catalyst. Cat supports
    > lots of Model classes: the one usually used in the examples is based on
    > DBIx::Class. DBIC is, I think, exactly what you *aren't* looking for:
    > while it will generate DDL for you, and it gives you an OO interface to
    > the database, it will only do so after you've set up a 'schema' which
    > ends up mostly equivalent to an SQL schema.


    Another person wrote: "You may want to look at DBIx::Class which is a
    mature and feature-rich Perl ORM that lets you generate your model
    classes automatically from your database schema or vice-versa."

    So, DBIC need the "schema" section in addition to the class-
    definition. I understand.

    > Perhaps what you want is Catalyst::Model::KiokuDB? I've never used it,
    > with or without Catalyst[0], but Florian (who appears to be the current
    > maintainer) certainly knows what he's doing.


    ok, will take a look.

    Maybe I ask a different way: which existent framework (or ORM) come
    nearest to "Model-Centric"?

    > Ben
    >
    > [0] and probably wouldn't want to. IMHO if you're using an RDBMS just to
    > serialise a handful of objects you're wasting it: the whole point of SQL
    > is it lets you ask questions you weren't expecting when you put the data
    > in the database. If all the important bits are stuffed into blobs you
    > might as well have been using BDB or something simple like that from the
    > start. (In fact, I see KiokuDB supports BDB as a backend...)


    I want to use an sql db, in order to be able to switch to other
    frameworks, languages etc.

    --
    http://lazaridis.com
    Ilias Lazaridis, Nov 8, 2011
    #6
  7. On 8 Îοέ, 13:40, Ben Morrow <> wrote:
    > Quoth Ilias Lazaridis <>:
    >
    > > On 7 Îοέ, 03:22, Ben Morrow <> wrote:

    >
    > > > Perhaps what you want is Catalyst::Model::KiokuDB? I've never used it,
    > > > with or without Catalyst[0], but Florian (who appears to be the current
    > > > maintainer) certainly knows what he's doing.

    >
    > > ok, will take a look.

    >
    > > Maybe I ask a different way: which existent framework (or ORM) come
    > > nearest to "Model-Centric"?

    >
    > As I said, I don't know. It's not a property I would consider desirable,
    > so it's not something I've looked into.


    ok

    > > > [0] and probably wouldn't want to. IMHO if you're using an RDBMS justto
    > > > serialise a handful of objects you're wasting it: the whole point of SQL
    > > > is it lets you ask questions you weren't expecting when you put the data
    > > > in the database. If all the important bits are stuffed into blobs you
    > > > might as well have been using BDB or something simple like that from the
    > > > start. (In fact, I see KiokuDB supports BDB as a backend...)

    >
    > > I want to use an sql db, in order to be able to switch to other
    > > frameworks, languages etc.

    >
    > Well, in that case, don't you want to put a bit more thought into
    > designing the DB schema properly?

    [...]

    No, want to write classes, and get the rest done. Just as within an
    OODBMS. I use ORM/SQL just because those OODBMS systems are not that
    much available.

    Thank you for your for your answers.

    --
    http://lazaridis.com
    Ilias Lazaridis, Nov 11, 2011
    #7
  8. Instead of opening a new thread, I post it here, as it's directly
    related.

    I just refere to php's Doctrine2 ORM because it showcases what I am
    looking for

    In Doctrine2, you write a usual clall ("Person" in the example). After
    this, you declare (via metadata) the mapping. This metadata can be
    added in 3 different ways: separate XML file, separate YAML file, or
    directly in sources via annotations (my main intrest):

    http://symfony.com/doc/2.0/book/doctrine.html

    Is there a similar ORM available for perl?

    If not, which toolkit (library, product etc.) would come closest to
    the functionality mentioned above?

    And finally: is there a annotation system/standard available for perl?


    On 29 Ïêô, 16:17, Ilias Lazaridis <> wrote:
    > I am looking for a perl web application framework, and found this
    > overview here:
    >
    > https://www.socialtext.net/perl5/web_frameworks
    >
    > I have two basic requierements:
    >
    > a) "Model Centric".
    >
    > "Model Centric" means, that the Model (and thus the OO Classes) is the
    > central point of development, and that the database is *not* a "point
    > of development" (or only optional if wanted, e.g. when dealing with a
    > given db-schema).
    >
    > If I specify my model, I can then create the underlying database using
    > automations.
    >
    > The same is true for CRUD functionality, which should be created
    > either dynamically at runtime, or via generators - using the classes
    > and metadata specified in the model.
    >
    > An ideal implementation would allow me to continue incrementally,
    > creating automaticly updates of db-schemas and CRUD's, whilst
    > preserving data and my custom-changes made to the CRUD's.
    >
    > b) "Authentication Functionality" (Modules / Components)
    >
    > I would need modules for Open Auth Systems (Opent Auth, Open ID) and
    > modules for popular sites like facebook, twitter, google etc.
    >
    > -
    >
    > Can anyone tell me which framework fullfills the requirement "a" and
    > ideally requirement "b", too) ?
    >
    > Thank you in advance.
    >
    > .


    --
    http://lazaridis.com
    Ilias Lazaridis, Dec 4, 2011
    #8
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