Mysterious problem with pages not displaying properly.

Discussion in 'HTML' started by New Conservative, Mar 8, 2005.

  1. Hi all,

    A colleague of mine has put together a web site which shows up
    faultlessly on the browsers I use on two separate computers in my
    home. However, it transpires that on many other people's browsers,
    the pages don't display properly at all. Sometimes there's missing
    text formatting, sometimes the colors don't render properly and in one
    case, all someone could see was the original html source code! I'm
    baffled! Can anyone identify the problem?

    Here's the site: www.newconservativeparty.org

    As I say, it displays fine here, but probably not on a browser near
    you. :-| The site was created with Serif's PagePlus9, BTW.
    --

    "Suffer no one to tell you what to think."
    Martin Smith, the New Conservative Party.

    http://www.newconservativeparty.org
     
    New Conservative, Mar 8, 2005
    #1
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  2. New Conservative

    Mark Parnell Guest

    Previously in alt.html.web-accessibility,alt.html, New Conservative
    <78738@virgin_not_for_mail.net> said:
    [f'ups set to alt.html]

    > Hi all,


    I have multiple personalities?

    > Sometimes there's missing
    > text formatting,


    Sounds like your code is a mess.

    > sometimes the colors don't render properly


    Could be any number of things. What do you mean by "don't render
    properly"? That there aren't any colours? They are just a slightly
    different shade to your monitor? Something else?

    > and in one
    > case, all someone could see was the original html source code!


    This is usually due to it being sent with an incorrect mime type, e.g.
    text/plain, but that doesn't seem to be the case here.

    > Here's the site: www.newconservativeparty.org


    Ugh. No offence, but that is awful. The background image hurts my eyes.
    As far as the code goes, it would be mostly the absolute positioning
    everywhere that is causing the problems with the text formatting etc.
    The incomplete doctype is throwing browsers into quirks mode, too. That
    can't be helping.

    > The site was created with Serif's PagePlus9, BTW.


    Then I suggest you throw it out and get something decent.

    --
    Mark Parnell
    http://www.clarkecomputers.com.au
     
    Mark Parnell, Mar 8, 2005
    #2
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  3. New Conservative

    Andy Dingley Guest

    It was somewhere outside Barstow when New Conservative
    <> wrote:

    >However, it transpires that on many other people's browsers,
    >the pages don't display properly at all.


    > The site was created with Serif's PagePlus9, BTW.


    Well that's you problem. The whole site coding is complete crap and
    it looks like it's Serif's fault.

    I suggest an upgrade to FrontPage.
     
    Andy Dingley, Mar 8, 2005
    #3
  4. New Conservative

    Dan Guest

    New Conservative wrote:
    > A colleague of mine has put together a web site which shows up
    > faultlessly on the browsers I use on two separate computers in my
    > home.


    You apparently don't have a sufficient variety of browsers for good
    testing.

    > However, it transpires that on many other people's browsers,
    > the pages don't display properly at all. Sometimes there's missing
    > text formatting, sometimes the colors don't render properly and in

    one
    > case, all someone could see was the original html source code! I'm
    > baffled! Can anyone identify the problem?


    There's more than one problem. Your code is a horrible mess. Also,
    many of your pages are served by your server with MIME type
    "text/plain", which instructs the browser to render them as plain text
    instead of HTML; the more standards-compliant browsers do this as
    requested, resulting in the displaying of raw code instead of a
    rendered page. Your use of filenames without extensions is probably
    confusing the server in this regard.

    --
    Dan
     
    Dan, Mar 8, 2005
    #4
  5. New Conservative

    Mark Parnell Guest

    Previously in alt.html.web-accessibility,alt.html, Dan <>
    said:

    > Also,
    > many of your pages are served by your server with MIME type
    > "text/plain",


    Aha! I _was_ right. I only looked at the front page though, which is why
    I didn't see it myself.

    --
    Mark Parnell
    http://www.clarkecomputers.com.au
     
    Mark Parnell, Mar 8, 2005
    #5
  6. New Conservative

    Toby Inkster Guest

    Toby Inkster, Mar 8, 2005
    #6
  7. New Conservative

    Big Bill Guest

    On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 00:44:36 GMT, New Conservative
    <78738@virgin_not_for_mail.net> wrote:

    >Hi all,
    >
    >A colleague of mine has put together a web site which shows up
    >faultlessly on the browsers I use on two separate computers in my
    >home. However, it transpires that on many other people's browsers,
    >the pages don't display properly at all. Sometimes there's missing
    >text formatting, sometimes the colors don't render properly and in one
    >case, all someone could see was the original html source code! I'm
    >baffled! Can anyone identify the problem?
    >
    >Here's the site: www.newconservativeparty.org
    >
    >As I say, it displays fine here, but probably not on a browser near
    >you. :-| The site was created with Serif's PagePlus9, BTW.


    First of all, you need to get the site to validate. This means you'll
    need someone to go into the code and correct all the faults. That
    should really be your first objective. It may well mean that some of
    the effects or areas of display that you like a lot will have to be
    abandoned as they rely (I'm guessing) on proprietary code that some
    mainstream browsers simply cannot render properly.
    Keep everything simple and you'll be on the right road.

    BB
    --
    www.kruse.co.uk/
    Affordable SEO!
    --
     
    Big Bill, Mar 8, 2005
    #7
  8. Here's one problem:

    ..PPStyle0-P
    {
    margin:0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; text-align:left;
    line-height:1.29;
    }

    You can't use fractions when determining dimensions in pixels. A pixel
    is a pixel; there are no fractional pixels.
     
    Steve Sundberg, Mar 8, 2005
    #8
  9. On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 02:07:41 +0000, Andy Dingley
    <> wrote:

    >
    >I suggest an upgrade to FrontPage.


    No, no, no. FrontPage is crap, too, if only because it creates
    proprietary code not rendered in standards-compliant browsers like
    Mozilla, Firefox and Opera.

    If you need to spend money, get something good -- like HomeSite.
     
    Steve Sundberg, Mar 8, 2005
    #9
  10. New Conservative

    Guest

    Steve Sundberg wrote:
    > Here's one problem:
    >
    > .PPStyle0-P
    > {
    > margin:0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; text-align:left;
    > line-height:1.29;
    > }
    >
    > You can't use fractions when determining dimensions in pixels. A

    pixel
    > is a pixel; there are no fractional pixels.


    In that particular case, the "1.29" actually has no unit shown, which
    is a standards violation in itself.

    --
    Dan
     
    , Mar 8, 2005
    #10
  11. Andy Dingley wrote:
    > It was somewhere outside Barstow when New Conservative
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>However, it transpires that on many other people's browsers,
    >>the pages don't display properly at all.

    >
    >
    >>The site was created with Serif's PagePlus9, BTW.

    >
    >
    > Well that's you problem. The whole site coding is complete crap and
    > it looks like it's Serif's fault.
    >
    > I suggest an upgrade to FrontPage.
    >


    A better grade of crap?

    [f-u's to alt.html only--this has nothing to do with accessibility]
     
    Harlan Messinger, Mar 8, 2005
    #11
  12. New Conservative

    kchayka Guest

    Andy Dingley wrote:
    > It was somewhere outside Barstow when New Conservative
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >> The site was created with Serif's PagePlus9, BTW.

    >
    > I suggest an upgrade to FrontPage.


    LOL

    In this case, FrontPage might actually be an upgrade. ;)

    --
    Reply email address is a bottomless spam bucket.
    Please reply to the group so everyone can share.
     
    kchayka, Mar 8, 2005
    #12
  13. New Conservative

    kchayka Guest

    wrote:
    > Steve Sundberg wrote:
    >> Here's one problem:
    >>
    >> line-height:1.29;

    >
    > In that particular case, the "1.29" actually has no unit shown, which
    > is a standards violation in itself.


    line-height is one case that doesn't require a unit:
    <URL:http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/visudet.html#propdef-line-height>

    --
    Reply email address is a bottomless spam bucket.
    Please reply to the group so everyone can share.
     
    kchayka, Mar 8, 2005
    #13
  14. New Conservative

    Steve Pugh Guest

    wrote:
    >Steve Sundberg wrote:
    >> Here's one problem:
    >>
    >> .PPStyle0-P
    >> {
    >> margin:0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; text-align:left;
    >> line-height:1.29;
    >> }
    >>
    >> You can't use fractions when determining dimensions in pixels. A
    >> pixel is a pixel; there are no fractional pixels.


    Not true for various reasons. Not least of which - the CSS spec allows
    the px unit to be more than one display pixel (and whilst most
    browser's blindly px to screen pixels they do scale the pixel when
    printing, after all a 10 pixel length on a 100dpi screen is very
    different to a 10 dot length on a 1200dpi printer. Whether the get the
    scaling right is another matter).

    Anyway, just because something doesn't make sense doesn't mean that
    it's an error to specify it in the code. And at the end of the day any
    browser that accepted opx but had problems with 0.0px as given here is
    very broken.

    >In that particular case, the "1.29" actually has no unit shown, which
    >is a standards violation in itself.


    No it's not. Look up line-height is the CSS spec and you'll see that
    it can take either a number or a length as a value.

    Steve

    --
    "My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
    I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

    Steve Pugh <> <http://steve.pugh.net/>
     
    Steve Pugh, Mar 8, 2005
    #14
  15. New Conservative

    Toby Inkster Guest

    dan wrote:
    > Steve Sundberg wrote:
    >
    >> Here's one problem:
    >> line-height:1.29;
    >> You can't use fractions when determining dimensions in pixels. A
    >> pixel is a pixel; there are no fractional pixels.

    >
    > In that particular case, the "1.29" actually has no unit shown, which
    > is a standards violation in itself.


    Egads! You're both way off! "line-height" can be specified without any
    units (one of the few CSS numerical values that can!). The default unit is
    a equal to "em", but has some slight differences from the usual "em"
    behaviour when dealing nested elements of different font sizes -- see the
    spec for details.

    --
    Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
    Contact Me ~ http://tobyinkster.co.uk/contact
    Now Playing ~ ./ben_folds/super_d/04_rent_a_cop.ogg
     
    Toby Inkster, Mar 8, 2005
    #15
  16. On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 08:16:23 +0000, Toby Inkster
    <> wrote:

    >New Conservative wrote:
    >
    >> Here's the site: www.newconservativeparty.org

    >
    >I *would* help you, only you're a tory.


    Er, we're certainly *not* tories, I can assure you. I could even
    *prove* it if I could get these problems with the site sorted out!

    --

    "Suffer no one to tell you what to think."
    Martin Smith, the New Conservative Party.

    http://www.newconservativeparty.org
     
    New Conservative, Mar 9, 2005
    #16
  17. New Conservative

    dorayme Guest

    > From: New Conservative <78738@virgin_not_for_mail.net>
    > Organization: The New Conservatives
    > Reply-To: 78738@virgin_not_for_mail.net
    > Newsgroups: alt.html.web-accessibility,alt.html
    > Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 00:44:36 GMT
    > Subject: Mysterious problem with pages not displaying properly.
    >
    > Hi all,
    >
    > A colleague of mine has put together a web site which shows up
    > faultlessly on the browsers I use on two separate computers in my
    > home. However, it transpires that on many other people's browsers,
    > the pages don't display properly at all. Sometimes there's missing
    > text formatting, sometimes the colors don't render properly and in one
    > case, all someone could see was the original html source code! I'm
    > baffled! Can anyone identify the problem?
    >
    > Here's the site: www.newconservativeparty.org
    >
    > As I say, it displays fine here, but probably not on a browser near
    > you. :-| The site was created with Serif's PagePlus9, BTW.




    Well, it is truly dreadful even when it "shows up ok" as on my machines...
    there is not much point in trying to sort out such a "generated" mess. Best
    to get rid of the generator. It is hard to believe that for just what is
    presented, the code should be so ... so... complex and inelegant. Use a
    simple css external stylesheet and trust it (don't be throwing in tons of
    css inline), a few divs in a simple html source page, bring the font size
    down, line things up in a tidier way, don't say it is under construction.
    Construct something that has some quality and as you improve it, improve it
    without saying a word.

    Sorry, it has put me in a bad mood...


    dorayme
     
    dorayme, Mar 9, 2005
    #17
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