Newbie questions on google placement

John D. · May 19, 2004

I saw this ad a while ago "get top placement in google". (They where
pitching a publication if I remember right.) Anyway, The ad uses an example
of key words: 'car' and 'wax' in a google search. Sure enough their ad comes
up at the very top of the list.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=car+wax

The two things I am curious about are the meta tags and also at the very
bottom of the page there is a link called "links".

when you click on the links you see a ton of links and another link: Add
Your URL To Our Directory!
http://www.5starshine.com/linkinfo.html
If you are interested in having your web site's link placed in our link
directory please give us a link using the "ready to paste" text link below
and fill out the link request form below. We'll get your link up within 24
hours!

Good networking huh? Opinions, coments?

Regarding the meta tags:
<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>5 Star Shine Car Wax, Polish & Car Care!</TITLE><META
name="description" content="Never Wax Your Car, Boat, or Plane Again: New
Discovery produces superior shine for five years instead of five
weeks!"><META name="keywords" content="car wax, auto wax,car
polish,carnuba,detailing,detailing products,car care,car accessories,auto
care,aircraft paint,marine paint,aircraft detailing,rv detailing,auto
paint,boat detailing,car paint,car accessory,paint protection"><META
name="allow-search" content="yes"><META name="audience" content="all"><META
name="robots" content="all, index, follow"><META name="revisit-after"
content="3 days"><META name="Rating" content="General"><META name="Language"
content="en"><META name="distribution" content="Global"><META
name="Classification" content="Premium Car Care Products"><META
http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">

Again:

<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>5 Star Shine Car Wax, Polish & Car Care!</TITLE>

<META name="description" content="Never Wax Your Car, Boat, or Plane Again:
New Discovery produces superior shine for five years instead of five
weeks!"><META name="keywords" content="car wax, auto wax,car
polish,carnuba,detailing,detailing products,car care,car accessories,auto
care,aircraft paint,marine paint,aircraft detailing,rv detailing,auto
paint,boat detailing,car paint,car accessory,paint protection">

<META name="allow-search" content="yes">

<META name="audience" content="all">

<META name="robots" content="all, index, follow">

<META name="revisit-after" content="3 days">

<META name="Rating" content="General"><META name="Language" content="en">

<META name="distribution" content="Global">

<META name="Classification" content="Premium Car Care Products">

<META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">

Big Bill · May 20, 2004

Phillip Hudson · May 20, 2004

It's good for the time being but when Google does the next big update of
it's index the site will be dropped from any decent ranking.

It's basically a link farm which Google doesn't like. Read this page:

http://www.google.co.uk/webmasters/seo.html

And some of the related pages on Google's site to find out.

It's basically thousands of text links on one site, most sites like this
just have their pagerank drained meaning that they don't get any ranking at
all.

There's far better ways to get a placing like that, ways which won't ruin
your future searchn results.

Mabden · May 20, 2004

AFAIK, Your Google ranking gets higher by having other sites link to you. So
if you have a business, get on the sites that also relate to your business.
Anything else is a scam, and may work for a while, but they'll eventually
find out about you.

For example, this may get me a higher ranking...

For pictures of the San Jose Sharks statues: click here:
http://sharks.sitenook.com/

;-)

Phillip Hudson · May 20, 2004

Having sites link to you is one of the ways to get a good ranking but you
also need content too.

It's also the value of the site that links to you, the pagerank that Google
gives every site. A few sites with a page rank of 5,6 or 7 linking to you
will benefit you far more than a lot more sites with a PR of 1.

When Google finds the link farm, which is all that it is, the rating of the
site will drop as the links will become near to worthless.

Greg Schmidt · May 20, 2004

It's basically a link farm which Google doesn't like. Read this page:

http://www.google.co.uk/webmasters/seo.html

And some of the related pages on Google's site to find out.

It's basically thousands of text links on one site, most sites like this
just have their pagerank drained meaning that they don't get any ranking at
all.

Does anyone know what number of links is okay before you start getting
dinged? I have my bookmarks online (http://bookmarks.trawna.com/) so that
I can get to them from any client's office, and I would hate to be dragging
down the page rank of any of the excellent sites I link to.

Neal · May 20, 2004

Does anyone know what number of links is okay before you start getting
dinged? I have my bookmarks online (http://bookmarks.trawna.com/) so
that
I can get to them from any client's office, and I would hate to be
dragging
down the page rank of any of the excellent sites I link to.

If I'm incorrect, someone will correct me, I'm sure. But as far as I know
having a link to your site on a list won't negatively affect your PR
compared to not having that link. Worst case scenario would be no change
at all.

Otherwise, you could create link farms listing all your competitors under
different domains and drag their PRs down. That would make no sense.

So even if your list is deemed a "link farm" it won't damage the linked
site's PR. And if it isn't a link farm it might help.

Roedy Green · May 20, 2004

I saw this ad a while ago "get top placement in google". (They where
pitching a publication if I remember right.) Anyway, The ad uses an example
of key words: 'car' and 'wax' in a google search. Sure enough their ad comes
up at the very top of the list.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=car+wax

I have very good Google placement and I get emails asking me how I
"did it."

First I did not consciously do anything.

What I did do was:

1. many small documents that stick to a single topic.

2. keywords.

3. lots of internal cross linking between documents.

4. I use the Compactor to squeeze out any unnecessary space. This
makes the pages faster to download and faster to spider.
see http://mindprod.com/projhtmlcompactor.html

5. I use untouch, so that pages are not redated unless they truly have
changed.
see http:/mindprod.com/projhtmluntouch.html

6. There are no broken internal links.
see http://mindprod.com/projhtmlbrokenlink.html

7. All pages are validated with HTMLValidator.
see http://mindprod.com/jgloss/htmlvalidator.html

8. I use Java-powered macros to generate much of the boilerplate in a
very standard way. See http://mindprod.com/projhtmlmacros.html

9. But I think the real secret is I have many little free Applets that
Java programmers use all the time, and they bookmark them or but links
to them on their private websites.
see http://mindprod.com/amanuenses.html.

Lois · May 21, 2004

"Neal" summarized:
: So even if your list is deemed a "link farm" it won't damage the linked
: site's PR. And if it isn't a link farm it might help.

Here's some info I found recently:

Warning!! Link Farm Ahead
http://www.searchengineguide.com/krause/2002/1219_kk1.html
"The appearance of link farm pages made some websites appear
unprofessional."
"...Search engines began to penalize websites containing link farm pages."

Link Farms Grow Spam
http://www.netmechanic.com/news/vol5/promo_no7.htm
"...bad linking strategies may get you banned from some engines."

How Search Engines Use Link Analysis
http://searchenginewatch.com/searchday/article.php/2158431
"A topical directory on a particular subject would be deemed of higher
authority that Free For All links page. Thus it's important to have links on
topical directories or web guides related to your sites subject matter."

Search Engine Secrets
http://www.captiva-search-engine-positioning.com/secrets.html
"...your site can get de-listed if you get into a link farm or link circle
whereby sites simply trade links for the “sole” purpose of inflating PR. The
tricky part here is that what may seem legitimate to you may not for the
search engine. As a general rule, it is wise to get links from “on topic”
sites and set up your outbound links in an intelligent manner. "

It looks to me like search engines look more favourably on links if they're
with text, in context, and surrounded by related keywords.

Lois

Greg Schmidt · May 21, 2004

"Neal" summarized:
: So even if your list is deemed a "link farm" it won't damage the linked
: site's PR. And if it isn't a link farm it might help.

Here's some info I found recently:

Warning!! Link Farm Ahead
http://www.searchengineguide.com/krause/2002/1219_kk1.html
"The appearance of link farm pages made some websites appear
unprofessional."

That's why I've got a whole separate subdomain set up just for that, not
linked to from my company page.

"...Search engines began to penalize websites containing link farm pages."

I don't much care how lowly my bookmark pages get ranked, so this part
doesn't bother me.

Link Farms Grow Spam
http://www.netmechanic.com/news/vol5/promo_no7.htm
"...bad linking strategies may get you banned from some engines."

How Search Engines Use Link Analysis
http://searchenginewatch.com/searchday/article.php/2158431
"A topical directory on a particular subject would be deemed of higher
authority that Free For All links page. Thus it's important to have links on
topical directories or web guides related to your sites subject matter."

I do categorize things, so all the links on a page should be considered
topical. I'll review and maybe break things into even more pages.

Search Engine Secrets
http://www.captiva-search-engine-positioning.com/secrets.html
"...your site can get de-listed if you get into a link farm or link circle
whereby sites simply trade links for the “sole” purpose of inflating PR. The

This is what concerns me the most. If Google decides I'm a link farm,
might it decide to de-list some very good pages (or rank them more lowly).

tricky part here is that what may seem legitimate to you may not for the
search engine. As a general rule, it is wise to get links from “on topic”
sites and set up your outbound links in an intelligent manner. "

It looks to me like search engines look more favourably on links if they're
with text, in context, and surrounded by related keywords.

I'll have to see what I can do about adding in descriptive text for more of
the links; right now the only ones that have it are ones where the page
title is not good enough for me to remember what the page was about.

Lois · May 22, 2004

: On Thu, 20 May 2004 21:46:46 -0700, Lois wrote:
: : > Warning!! Link Farm Ahead
: > http://www.searchengineguide.com/krause/2002/1219_kk1.html
: > "The appearance of link farm pages made some websites appear
: > unprofessional."

"Greg Schmidt" responded:
: That's why I've got a whole separate subdomain set up just for that, not
: linked to from my company page.

Uh oh. On one of the pages I read recently, maybe one in my previous post,
it said a site that not linking a page/section with lots of links was one
mark of a link farm.

: > "...Search engines began to penalize websites containing link farm
pages."
:
: I don't much care how lowly my bookmark pages get ranked, so this part
: doesn't bother me.

The quote is about websites, not web pages.

I don't know how accurate the info that I quoted is, but it sounds like it
could be right.

Lois

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Newbie questions on google placement

John D.

Big Bill

Phillip Hudson

Mabden

Phillip Hudson

Greg Schmidt

Neal

Roedy Green

Lois

Greg Schmidt

Lois

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