Oppinion regarding grid layout vs flow layout

Discussion in 'ASP .Net' started by NWx, Feb 19, 2004.

  1. NWx

    NWx Guest

    Hi,

    I develop an ASP.NET app which should be used from Internet, so I don't have
    control over what browsers will be used.

    I don't want to target every possible users, so I don't really mind is some
    user with a very ancient browser (Netscape 3 or 4, or IE 3) won't be able to
    view the site properly.
    However, I want that modern browsers (IE 5+, Netscape 6, Mozilla, Opera, and
    possible other browsers with new versions) to be able to access the site and
    render it as good as possible.

    My question is if I should use Grid layout, or use Flow layout, and design
    my site using tables?

    Does new browsers (well, most of them) handle grid layout OK?

    Any suggestions, advices or opinions regarding this are welcome.

    Best regards
     
    NWx, Feb 19, 2004
    #1
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  2. A grid layout simply uses absolute positioning to achieve its results, and
    most browsers will support this. the downside of this is that you become
    very unresponsive to a user's settings for the size of their browser window
    or for their DPI, as positions are set in pixels regardless of how big or
    small those pixels are and how many are showing in the user's window. For
    that reason, I always use the flow layout.

    --
    Chris Jackson
    Software Engineer
    Microsoft MVP - Windows Client
    Windows XP Associate Expert
    --
    More people read the newsgroups than read my email.
    Reply to the newsgroup for a faster response.
    (Control-G using Outlook Express)
    --

    "NWx" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hi,
    >
    > I develop an ASP.NET app which should be used from Internet, so I don't
    > have
    > control over what browsers will be used.
    >
    > I don't want to target every possible users, so I don't really mind is
    > some
    > user with a very ancient browser (Netscape 3 or 4, or IE 3) won't be able
    > to
    > view the site properly.
    > However, I want that modern browsers (IE 5+, Netscape 6, Mozilla, Opera,
    > and
    > possible other browsers with new versions) to be able to access the site
    > and
    > render it as good as possible.
    >
    > My question is if I should use Grid layout, or use Flow layout, and design
    > my site using tables?
    >
    > Does new browsers (well, most of them) handle grid layout OK?
    >
    > Any suggestions, advices or opinions regarding this are welcome.
    >
    > Best regards
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
     
    Chris Jackson, Feb 19, 2004
    #2
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  3. "NWx" <> wrote in news::
    > I don't want to target every possible users, so I don't really mind is
    > some user with a very ancient browser (Netscape 3 or 4, or IE 3) won't
    > be able to view the site properly.


    You need to stick to HTML 3.2. Unfortunately ASP.net is not very good about
    that. Before anyone jumps on me - Im sure its possible to do. But if so its
    not very easy and you'd lose probably about 90% of what "makes" ASP.net
    ASP.net.

    Your mileage of course will vary.

    > However, I want that modern browsers (IE 5+, Netscape 6, Mozilla, Opera,
    > and possible other browsers with new versions) to be able to access the
    > site and render it as good as possible.


    This is another issue. Dumbing down the interface for older clients while
    still providing a smarter interface for newer clients. ASP.net does support
    this to some degree, but at least in my (maybe biased) opinion it really
    doesnt go far enough.

    > My question is if I should use Grid layout, or use Flow layout, and
    > design my site using tables?


    Stay away from grid layout. And even then that likely wont be enough.

    > Does new browsers (well, most of them) handle grid layout OK?


    Yes. New ones do - old ones dont.

    > Any suggestions, advices or opinions regarding this are welcome.


    If you are open to third party tools, take a look at IntraWeb.
    http://www.atozed.com/intraweb/

    Im not just pushing a 3P solution. There are a few very specific reasons I
    am recommending this to you.

    1) It has a specific HTML 3.2 mode that allows you to deploy to ALL old
    browsers, even Lynx, PDA's and soon. (Also has WAP if you want that).

    2) Its HTML 4.0 mode is a "Smart" mode. It detects each browser and
    automatically renders to their level, specfic features, and so on. It even
    works around known bugs and other issues in specific browsers.



    --
    Chad Z. Hower (a.k.a. Kudzu) - http://www.hower.org/Kudzu/
    "Programming is an art form that fights back"
     
    Chad Z. Hower aka Kudzu, Feb 19, 2004
    #3
  4. "Chris Jackson" <chrisjATmvpsDOTorgNOSPAM> wrote in
    news::
    > A grid layout simply uses absolute positioning to achieve its results,
    > and most browsers will support this. the downside of this is that you


    Not the older ones he mentioned. At least not in a compatible or reliable
    way. IE2 for instance didnt even support frames.

    And NS4 just has its own way of doing everything becuase of how browsers were
    evovling on their own before HTML4 was a standard.

    > become very unresponsive to a user's settings for the size of their
    > browser window or for their DPI, as positions are set in pixels
    > regardless of how big or small those pixels are and how many are showing
    > in the user's window. For that reason, I always use the flow layout.


    Yes, thats another issue. With Intraweb (mentioned in previous message) it
    takes care of all this too. You can dock regions or controls to sides and
    anchor controls too. This takes care of all screen size issues automatically
    for you.

    You can see a demo of what I mean here:
    http://www.atozed.com/intraweb/features/AnchorsAligns.iwp

    (You will need flash to see the movie. Its not very big. Im on dialup and I
    just looked, it came down pretty fast).



    --
    Chad Z. Hower (a.k.a. Kudzu) - http://www.hower.org/Kudzu/
    "Programming is an art form that fights back"
     
    Chad Z. Hower aka Kudzu, Feb 19, 2004
    #4
  5. We are migrating to absolute positioning using external CSS. The reason? To
    separate layout design from presentation logic and content. This will enable
    our programmers to ignore layout/design issues, and our graphic designers to
    ignore logic/content. We expect it will increase productivity immensely, by
    removing unnecessary layout code from the programmer's canvas, and
    compartmentalizing the development process.

    --
    HTH,
    Kevin Spencer
    ..Net Developer
    Microsoft MVP
    Big things are made up
    of lots of little things.

    "Chris Jackson" <chrisjATmvpsDOTorgNOSPAM> wrote in message
    news:...
    > A grid layout simply uses absolute positioning to achieve its results, and
    > most browsers will support this. the downside of this is that you become
    > very unresponsive to a user's settings for the size of their browser

    window
    > or for their DPI, as positions are set in pixels regardless of how big or
    > small those pixels are and how many are showing in the user's window. For
    > that reason, I always use the flow layout.
    >
    > --
    > Chris Jackson
    > Software Engineer
    > Microsoft MVP - Windows Client
    > Windows XP Associate Expert
    > --
    > More people read the newsgroups than read my email.
    > Reply to the newsgroup for a faster response.
    > (Control-G using Outlook Express)
    > --
    >
    > "NWx" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Hi,
    > >
    > > I develop an ASP.NET app which should be used from Internet, so I don't
    > > have
    > > control over what browsers will be used.
    > >
    > > I don't want to target every possible users, so I don't really mind is
    > > some
    > > user with a very ancient browser (Netscape 3 or 4, or IE 3) won't be

    able
    > > to
    > > view the site properly.
    > > However, I want that modern browsers (IE 5+, Netscape 6, Mozilla, Opera,
    > > and
    > > possible other browsers with new versions) to be able to access the site
    > > and
    > > render it as good as possible.
    > >
    > > My question is if I should use Grid layout, or use Flow layout, and

    design
    > > my site using tables?
    > >
    > > Does new browsers (well, most of them) handle grid layout OK?
    > >
    > > Any suggestions, advices or opinions regarding this are welcome.
    > >
    > > Best regards
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    Kevin Spencer, Feb 19, 2004
    #5
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