Preferred IDE

Discussion in 'ASP .Net' started by Rusty Owens, May 10, 2004.

  1. Rusty Owens

    Rusty Owens Guest

    I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    they also have Visual Studio.
    Rusty Owens, May 10, 2004
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. studio is the way to go. webmatrix is for those on a budget.

    --
    Regards,
    Alvin Bruney
    [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    "Rusty Owens" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    > for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    > asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    > wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    > they also have Visual Studio.
    Alvin Bruney [MVP], May 10, 2004
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Rusty,

    Although Alvin recommended Visual Studio, here's my two cents. I've found
    Visual Studio to be great for everything but webforms. It's HTML handling is
    terrible and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model (which,
    I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it no
    longer required in VS2005). I use Dreamweaver, and the "Code-Aside" model
    (<script runat=server src=myPage.aspx.vb>). You'll find VS.NET easier to
    use, but I think you'll have a much better end product by going wih
    something that handles HTML much better and doesn't use the Inheritance
    code-behind.

    -- Alex Papadimoulis

    ,
    "Rusty Owens" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    > for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    > asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    > wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    > they also have Visual Studio.
    Alex Papadimoulis, May 10, 2004
    #3
  4. WebMatrix is free, Visual Studio.NET is definitely not free.
    You get what you pay for.

    --
    I hope this helps,
    Steve C. Orr, MCSD, MVP
    http://Steve.Orr.net


    "Rusty Owens" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    > for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    > asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    > wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    > they also have Visual Studio.
    Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD], May 10, 2004
    #4
  5. > and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model (which,
    > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it no
    > longer required in VS2005).


    What's your source for this?

    --
    Regards,
    Alvin Bruney
    [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    "Alex Papadimoulis" <> wrote in message
    news:e%...
    > Rusty,
    >
    > Although Alvin recommended Visual Studio, here's my two cents. I've found
    > Visual Studio to be great for everything but webforms. It's HTML handling
    > is
    > terrible and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model
    > (which,
    > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it no
    > longer required in VS2005). I use Dreamweaver, and the "Code-Aside" model
    > (<script runat=server src=myPage.aspx.vb>). You'll find VS.NET easier to
    > use, but I think you'll have a much better end product by going wih
    > something that handles HTML much better and doesn't use the Inheritance
    > code-behind.
    >
    > -- Alex Papadimoulis
    >
    > ,
    > "Rusty Owens" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    >> for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    >> asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    >> wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    >> they also have Visual Studio.

    >
    >
    Alvin Bruney [MVP], May 10, 2004
    #5
  6. Code behind is no longer required; VS2005 has good support for using a
    single file for your HTML source and server code.
    Inheritance is still used in VS2005, although much of the boilerplate code
    is now hidden behind the scenes.

    --
    I hope this helps,
    Steve C. Orr, MCSD, MVP
    http://Steve.Orr.net


    "Alvin Bruney [MVP]" <vapor at steaming post office> wrote in message
    news:...
    > > and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model (which,
    > > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it no
    > > longer required in VS2005).

    >
    > What's your source for this?
    >
    > --
    > Regards,
    > Alvin Bruney
    > [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    > Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    > "Alex Papadimoulis" <> wrote in message
    > news:e%...
    > > Rusty,
    > >
    > > Although Alvin recommended Visual Studio, here's my two cents. I've

    found
    > > Visual Studio to be great for everything but webforms. It's HTML

    handling
    > > is
    > > terrible and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model
    > > (which,
    > > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it no
    > > longer required in VS2005). I use Dreamweaver, and the "Code-Aside"

    model
    > > (<script runat=server src=myPage.aspx.vb>). You'll find VS.NET easier to
    > > use, but I think you'll have a much better end product by going wih
    > > something that handles HTML much better and doesn't use the Inheritance
    > > code-behind.
    > >
    > > -- Alex Papadimoulis
    > >
    > > ,
    > > "Rusty Owens" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > >> I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    > >> for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    > >> asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    > >> wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    > >> they also have Visual Studio.

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD], May 10, 2004
    #6
  7. how is that different from today when everything can fit into the aspx page.
    I'm missing something i'm sure

    --
    Regards,
    Alvin Bruney
    [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    "Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD]" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Code behind is no longer required; VS2005 has good support for using a
    > single file for your HTML source and server code.
    > Inheritance is still used in VS2005, although much of the boilerplate code
    > is now hidden behind the scenes.
    >
    > --
    > I hope this helps,
    > Steve C. Orr, MCSD, MVP
    > http://Steve.Orr.net
    >
    >
    > "Alvin Bruney [MVP]" <vapor at steaming post office> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> > and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model (which,
    >> > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it
    >> > no
    >> > longer required in VS2005).

    >>
    >> What's your source for this?
    >>
    >> --
    >> Regards,
    >> Alvin Bruney
    >> [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    >> Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    >> "Alex Papadimoulis" <> wrote in message
    >> news:e%...
    >> > Rusty,
    >> >
    >> > Although Alvin recommended Visual Studio, here's my two cents. I've

    > found
    >> > Visual Studio to be great for everything but webforms. It's HTML

    > handling
    >> > is
    >> > terrible and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model
    >> > (which,
    >> > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it
    >> > no
    >> > longer required in VS2005). I use Dreamweaver, and the "Code-Aside"

    > model
    >> > (<script runat=server src=myPage.aspx.vb>). You'll find VS.NET easier
    >> > to
    >> > use, but I think you'll have a much better end product by going wih
    >> > something that handles HTML much better and doesn't use the Inheritance
    >> > code-behind.
    >> >
    >> > -- Alex Papadimoulis
    >> >
    >> > ,
    >> > "Rusty Owens" <> wrote in message
    >> > news:...
    >> >> I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    >> >> for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    >> >> asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    >> >> wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    >> >> they also have Visual Studio.
    >> >
    >> >

    >>
    >>

    >
    >
    Alvin Bruney [MVP], May 11, 2004
    #7
  8. Currently VS.NET pretty much forces you to use a code behind. If you want
    to do single page, it's not easy or supported well like it is in WebMatrix.
    In VS.NET 2005 this is fully supported with full intellisense.

    --
    I hope this helps,
    Steve C. Orr, MCSD, MVP
    http://Steve.Orr.net


    "Alvin Bruney [MVP]" <vapor at steaming post office> wrote in message
    news:...
    > how is that different from today when everything can fit into the aspx

    page.
    > I'm missing something i'm sure
    >
    > --
    > Regards,
    > Alvin Bruney
    > [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    > Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    > "Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD]" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Code behind is no longer required; VS2005 has good support for using a
    > > single file for your HTML source and server code.
    > > Inheritance is still used in VS2005, although much of the boilerplate

    code
    > > is now hidden behind the scenes.
    > >
    > > --
    > > I hope this helps,
    > > Steve C. Orr, MCSD, MVP
    > > http://Steve.Orr.net
    > >
    > >
    > > "Alvin Bruney [MVP]" <vapor at steaming post office> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > >> > and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model (which,
    > >> > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it
    > >> > no
    > >> > longer required in VS2005).
    > >>
    > >> What's your source for this?
    > >>
    > >> --
    > >> Regards,
    > >> Alvin Bruney
    > >> [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    > >> Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    > >> "Alex Papadimoulis" <> wrote in message
    > >> news:e%...
    > >> > Rusty,
    > >> >
    > >> > Although Alvin recommended Visual Studio, here's my two cents. I've

    > > found
    > >> > Visual Studio to be great for everything but webforms. It's HTML

    > > handling
    > >> > is
    > >> > terrible and you're forced to use the Inheritance code behind model
    > >> > (which,
    > >> > I've thought was a bad choice from day one, and am thrilled to see it
    > >> > no
    > >> > longer required in VS2005). I use Dreamweaver, and the "Code-Aside"

    > > model
    > >> > (<script runat=server src=myPage.aspx.vb>). You'll find VS.NET easier
    > >> > to
    > >> > use, but I think you'll have a much better end product by going wih
    > >> > something that handles HTML much better and doesn't use the

    Inheritance
    > >> > code-behind.
    > >> >
    > >> > -- Alex Papadimoulis
    > >> >
    > >> > ,
    > >> > "Rusty Owens" <> wrote in message
    > >> > news:...
    > >> >> I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using

    ColdFusion
    > >> >> for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE

    for
    > >> >> asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    > >> >> wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    > >> >> they also have Visual Studio.
    > >> >
    > >> >
    > >>
    > >>

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD], May 11, 2004
    #8
  9. Rusty Owens

    Matt Berther Guest

    1. Code behind has never been required.
    2. Inheritance is not used for ASP.NET classes anymore, rather partial
    classes, which introduces the idea of a code-beside model.

    --
    Matt Berther
    http://www.mattberther.com


    Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD] wrote:

    > Code behind is no longer required; VS2005 has good support for using a
    > single file for your HTML source and server code.
    > Inheritance is still used in VS2005, although much of the boilerplate code
    > is now hidden behind the scenes.
    >
    Matt Berther, May 11, 2004
    #9
  10. You're correct that code behind has never been required, but it is difficult
    to do the single file method in VS.NET.

    I believe you're wrong about inheritance not being needed in ASP.NET classes
    anymore. Underneath it all, your page is still inheriting from the Page
    class.

    --
    I hope this helps,
    Steve C. Orr, MCSD, MVP
    http://Steve.Orr.net


    "Matt Berther" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > 1. Code behind has never been required.
    > 2. Inheritance is not used for ASP.NET classes anymore, rather partial
    > classes, which introduces the idea of a code-beside model.
    >
    > --
    > Matt Berther
    > http://www.mattberther.com
    >
    >
    > Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD] wrote:
    >
    > > Code behind is no longer required; VS2005 has good support for using a
    > > single file for your HTML source and server code.
    > > Inheritance is still used in VS2005, although much of the boilerplate

    code
    > > is now hidden behind the scenes.
    > >
    Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD], May 11, 2004
    #10
  11. Rusty Owens

    Matt Berther Guest

    Yes, you are right that it still inherits from Page. I thought your
    statement was directed at the fact that your .ASPX is a subclass of your
    code-behind class.

    --
    Matt Berther
    http://www.mattberther.com

    Steve C. Orr [MVP, MCSD] wrote:
    > You're correct that code behind has never been required, but it is difficult
    > to do the single file method in VS.NET.
    >
    > I believe you're wrong about inheritance not being needed in ASP.NET classes
    > anymore. Underneath it all, your page is still inheriting from the Page
    > class.
    >
    Matt Berther, May 11, 2004
    #11
  12. After all this feedback... here is my 2 cents.

    I've been working with VS2002 since beta, and now I'm on VS2003. My opinion is
    that while HTML editor from VS.NET is not has good as Dreamweaver for example,
    the fact is that coding in VS is much better. I code mostly in vb.net and its
    amazing the productivity that you get from using vs.net.

    The ideal solution for me would be to have Dreamweaver as HTML editor and VS2003
    for coding. But that is just too time consuming and does not worth the trouble
    in my point of view.

    Things said, I've got used to the limitations of the vs.net html editor and I
    only use code-behind currently. Sometimes I still go to dreamweaver where I do
    some HTML de design and then just copy+past the HTML into vs.net.

    At the end of the day, VS.NET is not that bad. Could be much better on the HTML
    side, thats true, but still its a highly productive dev enviroment.


    Cumprimentos / Regards

    Joao Cardoso (MVP dotNET)
    =======================================================
    Visite os grupos de discussão portugueses:
    microsoft.public.pt.vsnet
    microsoft.public.pt.dotnet
    microsoft.public.pt.*

    [LusoCoders]- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lusocoders/
    [PontoNetPT]- http://www.pontonetpt.com
    .n.o-s.p-a.m - www.acinet.pt
    =======================================================
    Joao S Cardoso [MVP], May 11, 2004
    #12
  13. Rusty Owens

    Samuel Hon Guest

    Quite happy using Notepad. Its not fast, and its not particularly clever (if at all)

    I do have VS, but dont use it

    (Rusty Owens) wrote in message news:<>...
    > I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    > for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    > asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    > wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    > they also have Visual Studio.
    Samuel Hon, May 11, 2004
    #13
  14. why don't you use visual studio? Don't get defensive. This is a genuine
    question. I'd like to know what are the main reasons for sticking with
    notepad over the benefits of studio.

    --
    Regards,
    Alvin Bruney
    [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    "Samuel Hon" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Quite happy using Notepad. Its not fast, and its not particularly clever
    > (if at all)
    >
    > I do have VS, but dont use it
    >
    > (Rusty Owens) wrote in message
    > news:<>...
    >> I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    >> for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    >> asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    >> wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    >> they also have Visual Studio.
    Alvin Bruney [MVP], May 11, 2004
    #14
  15. Rusty Owens

    Samuel Hon Guest

    Hi Alvin

    I started using VS when I was learning .NET and wrote a few initial
    web projects in it. I should mention that I normally use .NET for web
    apps and VB6 for desktop apps.

    The main reason I use Notepad is because I'm not doing project based
    apps. I've built an assembly which does most of the work. Most of the
    webpages are relatively simple but the few which req a built more
    substance have a simple codebehind page (using src).

    The main thing I miss about VS is the Intellitype. Its a pain having
    to find which assembly a class belongs to eg PagedDataSource.

    Sam

    "Alvin Bruney [MVP]" <vapor at steaming post office> wrote in message news:<>...
    > why don't you use visual studio? Don't get defensive. This is a genuine
    > question. I'd like to know what are the main reasons for sticking with
    > notepad over the benefits of studio.
    >
    > --
    > Regards,
    > Alvin Bruney
    > [ASP.NET MVP http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx]
    > Got tidbits? Get it here... http://tinyurl.com/27cok
    > "Samuel Hon" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Quite happy using Notepad. Its not fast, and its not particularly clever
    > > (if at all)
    > >
    > > I do have VS, but dont use it
    > >
    > > (Rusty Owens) wrote in message
    > > news:<>...
    > >> I am new to .NET. I have been doing web development using ColdFusion
    > >> for 5 years. I am trying to determine if there is a standard IDE for
    > >> asp.net. I have downloaded Webmatrix from Microsoft but I am
    > >> wondering if it is more of a project than an accepted standard since
    > >> they also have Visual Studio.
    Samuel Hon, May 12, 2004
    #15
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