Question about XML based conversations

Discussion in 'XML' started by David, Jun 3, 2004.

  1. David

    David Guest

    Hello,

    I'm not up to speed on using XML and could use some help.
    I get the idea of XML and the various parsers/generators
    available. I'm used to the concept of TCP/UDP conversations
    and haven't seen this discussed in an XML concept. I've
    been asked to put together a medium sized XML interface
    to one of my products and need to discuss the ideas with
    someone who has worked with this before.

    I'll start by asking if all XML Conversations are presumed
    to look like simple HTTP Request-Response conversations.

    I was aware of this tendancy but when I started to think
    about my conversations between my products they don't
    usually fit into the simple request-response category.
    In several cases the request will really be for a series
    of ongoing responses, like monitoring status changes in
    a system. I'm also quite used to opening a minimal number
    of conversations between computers and queuing multiple
    request-response conversations along the same channel.
    It seems wasteful to require a new conversation for every
    request-response transaction between systems.

    Is it possible/useful to open a TCP connection between
    machines and then transmit XML messages between the systems?

    I've used SAX2 under MSXML to parse a file with multiple
    messages and can't figure out how to restart the parser
    for the second message.

    My current level is just getting up to speed on the basics
    of using XML. I'm supposed to design an interface for another
    team to use my product that feels XML is best for them. I'd
    like to figure out what is reasonable and normal before inventing
    methods that they will not want to handle.

    I'd also welcome any reading material on the subject, I've
    searched www.xml.org/.com and lots of other places and haven't
    found the magic keywords that get me to a description for solving
    the type of problem I'm trying to solve.

    Thank you for your help,

    David
     
    David, Jun 3, 2004
    #1
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  2. David

    Andy Dingley Guest

    "David" <> wrote in message news:<rOdGr40LMPU3-pn2-xksHRePlTSRO@localhost>...

    > I'll start by asking if all XML Conversations are presumed
    > to look like simple HTTP Request-Response conversations.


    I've never heard of "XML Conversations". If you're capitalising this,
    is it a proprietary technology ?

    It sounds like you're re-inventing SOAP here, which is one part of the
    big web-services picture. It's not an "XML topic", because XML is
    deliberately a very small-scope protocol and things additional to it
    like this are described separately. However your basic idea is right;
    XML documents fly about by HTTP. It isn't always HTTP, and sometimes
    it might not even be XML, but that's the mainstream.
     
    Andy Dingley, Jun 3, 2004
    #2
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  3. David

    David Guest

    On Thu, 3 Jun 2004 09:56:52 UTC, (Andy Dingley)
    wrote:

    > "David" <> wrote in message news:<rOdGr40LMPU3-pn2-xksHRePlTSRO@localhost>...
    >
    > > I'll start by asking if all XML Conversations are presumed
    > > to look like simple HTTP Request-Response conversations.

    >
    > I've never heard of "XML Conversations". If you're capitalising this,
    > is it a proprietary technology ?
    >
    > It sounds like you're re-inventing SOAP here, which is one part of the
    > big web-services picture. It's not an "XML topic", because XML is
    > deliberately a very small-scope protocol and things additional to it
    > like this are described separately. However your basic idea is right;
    > XML documents fly about by HTTP. It isn't always HTTP, and sometimes
    > it might not even be XML, but that's the mainstream.


    Thanks Andy.

    I've read about XML for years and seen various uses. One used XML
    requests in files that were later replaced by XML responses in
    similarly named files. I've never, ever seen it mentioned that XML
    is generally for use over an HTTP conversation, though I'm aware
    that is where it is used most. I'd also not considered that everything
    was required to be request-response and stateless by most uses of
    XML encoding.

    David
     
    David, Jun 4, 2004
    #3
  4. David

    Jesse Hager Guest

    Hi David,

    One thing you might want to check out is the Jabber/XMPP protocol, this
    is an open instant messaging protocol that uses continuous streams of
    XML elements for communication. Several people have used it as the
    transport protocol for other projects. It may give you some ideas on
    how to implement a non request-response protocol. Or maybe just grab
    one of the existing XMPP libraries and use it to send your own XML data :)

    The main Jabber Site:
    http://www.jabber.org

    The core XMPP protocol spec (see the XML Streams section 4):
    http://www.jabber.org/ietf/draft-ietf-xmpp-core-23.txt

    The instant messaging part is here:
    http://www.jabber.org/ietf/draft-ietf-xmpp-im-22.txt

    Hope this helps.

    --
    Jesse Hager
     
    Jesse Hager, Jun 4, 2004
    #4
  5. David

    David Guest

    On Fri, 4 Jun 2004 16:50:16 UTC, Jesse Hager
    <> wrote:

    > Hi David,
    >
    > One thing you might want to check out is the Jabber/XMPP protocol, this
    > is an open instant messaging protocol that uses continuous streams of
    > XML elements for communication. Several people have used it as the
    > transport protocol for other projects. It may give you some ideas on
    > how to implement a non request-response protocol. Or maybe just grab
    > one of the existing XMPP libraries and use it to send your own XML data :)
    >
    > The main Jabber Site:
    > http://www.jabber.org
    >
    > The core XMPP protocol spec (see the XML Streams section 4):
    > http://www.jabber.org/ietf/draft-ietf-xmpp-core-23.txt
    >
    > The instant messaging part is here:
    > http://www.jabber.org/ietf/draft-ietf-xmpp-im-22.txt
    >
    > Hope this helps.


    Thanks Jesse. That sounds like what I was thinking of.
     
    David, Jun 5, 2004
    #5
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