Question I've Been pondering

[user 1]

Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups and annoying java script seem to be
found in endless masses, how many of you browse without java script enabled?
Most of you preach the good things about Mozilla, namely it's Pop up blocker
feature. Since this is the case, there is no reason to diable java script
to stop pop ups. I guess what I'm really getting at is, it seems to me that
you missing alot more than you are gaining by disableing java script. Now,
I come from a "design" background rather than a "coding" background, but I
would think that java script for roll overs and things of the like are
permissable reasons for using java script. In the end, I know most of the
effects i'm talking about can be done with CSS, but I just want to know ( in
a non-flamable way if at all possible ) why some of you disable your java.
This is purely a learning experience for me, so no need to get all fussy .
Thanks in advance.

-g-

 

[David Dorward]

why some of you disable your java[script].

Becuase I don't trust Internet Explorer on the Internet with scripting
enabled. Its had too many security problems for my taste. (Of course MSIE
isn't my usual web browser, so usually I have JavaScript (mostly) enabled).

Although when I'm on the go, my phone doesn't have a JavaScript capable
browser installed, so I don't have much choice there.

 

[Toby A Inkster]

Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups and annoying java script seem to be
found in endless masses, how many of you browse without java script enabled?

I mainly use two browsers: Dillo (about 30% of the time) and Opera (about
69% of the time).

Dillo doesn't support JavaScript full stop. Nor CSS. Nor Java. Nor
plugins.

Opera supports all of the above, but I often disable them. For example, if
I come across a site with irritating JavaScript effects, I will disable it
(easy enough with the QuickPrefs menu - F12). It will remain disabled
until I end up at an interesting site that requires JavaScript -- perhaps
hours, perhaps days. And then it's back on again, and it may be for
several days before some effect irritates me again...

Most of you preach the good things about Mozilla, namely it's Pop up
blocker feature

Oh yes, I have the Opera pop-up blocker on almost permenantly.

 

[Sid Ismail]

: Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups and annoying java script seem to be
: found in endless masses, how many of you browse without java script enabled?


I have Javascript enabled, but hate pop-ups. Flash I detest.

Sid

 

[Tina - AffordableHOST.com]

Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups and annoying java script seem to be
found in endless masses, how many of you browse without java script enabled?

Me.

I guess what I'm really getting at is, it seems to me that
you missing alot more than you are gaining by disableing java script.

I'll take my chances. ;-) I don't like people making my computer or
browser 'do stuff' without my permission.

--Tina

 

[Tina - AffordableHOST.com]

: Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups and annoying java script seem to be
: found in endless masses, how many of you browse without java script enabled?


I have Javascript enabled, but hate pop-ups. Flash I detest.

Sid

Check out the Google Bar...its very handy and has the world's best popup
killer.

--Tina

 

[SteW]

user 1 wrote:
I guess what I'm really getting at is, it seems to me that

you missing alot more than you are gaining by disableing java script...

I use both ie6 and mozilla or mozilla-based netscape equally. ie6 has js
disabled, moz browsers are set to disallow fiddling with my browser.

Generally I have no problems. If I am buying from a site and am using
ie, or the site is *really* interesting I'll turn js on and reload if
needed.

If the site uses js dependent navigation but does not fit these criteria
I read the page I land on and hit the back button or hope that the
status bar shows a url if there is an external link that looks promising.

I just want to know ( in
a non-flamable way if at all possible ) why some of you disable your java.
This is purely a learning experience for me, so no need to get all fussy .
Thanks in advance.

Too many sites have full-screened my browser, narrowed the browser to
fit the page, created popups and generally messed with me, my browser
and desktop arrangement. I could use a popup killer, but disabling this
behaviour at source does a reasonable job and doesn't cure browser
resizing in ie.

It is a shame I feel the need to do this in explorer because client-side
scripting used responsibly can be a useful addition to html/css.

Btw, javascript is all one word, often spelt JavaScript and has nothing
to do with the java language; the names are similar only because of a
marketing decision, it was originally to be called LiveScript.

Ste W

 

[Augustus]

I guess what I'm really getting at is, it seems to me that
you missing alot more than you are gaining by disableing java script.

I surf with javascript enabled... but what you said here really makes me
ask: What is
it that you think people with javascript disabled are missing?

Sure they might miss a few rollover effects and such, but most people surf
the net
looking for content... to answer questions, to get information, etc - They
don't
go out there looking for some "cool" special effects to WOW them.

Good content will bring people to your site... good content will keep them
coming
back... Javascript won't.

Now,
I come from a "design" background rather than a "coding" background, but I
would think that java script for roll overs and things of the like are
permissable reasons for using java script.

Using javascript for things like rollovers and such is find... so long as
your site
doesn't depend on it and can operate without it.

Years ago I used to be really keen on javascript and what it can do... every
site I built used it and I used to think that people that anybody who surfed
with scripting disabled had to be crazy and they were totally missing out...

I other words, I didn't care if 5-10% of the people out there didn't have
scripting enabled... if they couldn't see my site becuz of it, then tough
luck
for them.

BUT... thinking like that is fine when the site is for you or your friends
and
is just some cute little hobby or fan site... but when it comes down to real
business (and to this business in particular... web design) can you imagine
going to a client and saying "Ok, here is your website... and your bill...
and
don't forget, 10% of the people out there on the internet won't be able to
view
your pages or order from you, but thats ok! 10% is such a small amount!"

10%... it sounds so small... so insignificant...

I have a website. I spent well over a year developing the thing and making
it as user friendly as possible. But... even though I was always so keen on
javascript, there isn't one line of it anywhere in the whole site...

Why Not? Answer: 8.8%

According to my stats, thats how many users have visited my site that have
scripting disabled.

My site gets about 125,000 orders a day... if I relied upon javascript to
present content (to display menus, or somehow work in the online ordering
system) I would be cutting out about 11,000 orders per day... or about 3.5
Million
orders per year

And suddenly it doesn't sound so small or insignificant...

 

[Michael Wilcox]

According to my stats, thats how many users have visited my site that
have scripting disabled.

Small question: How do you test to see if JS is on or not?

 

[user 1]

user 1 wrote:
I guess what I'm really getting at is, it seems to me that

I use both ie6 and mozilla or mozilla-based netscape equally. ie6 has js
disabled, moz browsers are set to disallow fiddling with my browser.

Generally I have no problems. If I am buying from a site and am using
ie, or the site is *really* interesting I'll turn js on and reload if
needed.

If the site uses js dependent navigation but does not fit these criteria
I read the page I land on and hit the back button or hope that the
status bar shows a url if there is an external link that looks promising.


Too many sites have full-screened my browser, narrowed the browser to
fit the page, created popups and generally messed with me, my browser
and desktop arrangement. I could use a popup killer, but disabling this
behaviour at source does a reasonable job and doesn't cure browser
resizing in ie.

It is a shame I feel the need to do this in explorer because client-side
scripting used responsibly can be a useful addition to html/css.

Btw, javascript is all one word, often spelt JavaScript and has nothing
to do with the java language; the names are similar only because of a
marketing decision, it was originally to be called LiveScript.

Ste W

Thanks for pointing that out Stew. These are all good answers. I"ve just
heard so many people say that they always browse without JavaScript and I
was just wondering why. Thanks to all who replied.

-g-

 

[user 1]

me

I surf with javascript enabled... but what you said here really makes me
ask: What is
it that you think people with javascript disabled are missing?

Sure they might miss a few rollover effects and such, but most people surf
the net
looking for content... to answer questions, to get information, etc - They
don't
go out there looking for some "cool" special effects to WOW them.

Good content will bring people to your site... good content will keep them
coming
back... Javascript won't.


Using javascript for things like rollovers and such is find... so long as
your site
doesn't depend on it and can operate without it.

Years ago I used to be really keen on javascript and what it can do... every
site I built used it and I used to think that people that anybody who surfed
with scripting disabled had to be crazy and they were totally missing out...

I other words, I didn't care if 5-10% of the people out there didn't have
scripting enabled... if they couldn't see my site becuz of it, then tough
luck
for them.

BUT... thinking like that is fine when the site is for you or your friends
and
is just some cute little hobby or fan site... but when it comes down to real
business (and to this business in particular... web design) can you imagine
going to a client and saying "Ok, here is your website... and your bill...
and
don't forget, 10% of the people out there on the internet won't be able to
view
your pages or order from you, but thats ok! 10% is such a small amount!"

10%... it sounds so small... so insignificant...

I have a website. I spent well over a year developing the thing and making
it as user friendly as possible. But... even though I was always so keen on
javascript, there isn't one line of it anywhere in the whole site...

Why Not? Answer: 8.8%

According to my stats, thats how many users have visited my site that have
scripting disabled.

My site gets about 125,000 orders a day... if I relied upon javascript to
present content (to display menus, or somehow work in the online ordering
system) I would be cutting out about 11,000 orders per day... or about 3.5
Million
orders per year

And suddenly it doesn't sound so small or insignificant...

That was a great answer. Any you make total sense. Thank you.

-g-

 

[Toby A Inkster]

Small question: How do you test to see if JS is on or not?

On your front page, but not on any others include '<script
type="text/javascript" src="counter.js"> </script>'.

counter.js is an empty file.

At the end of the month count the number of hits to your front page, and
the number of hits to counter.js.

 

[Matthias Gutfeldt]

Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups and annoying java script seem to be
found in endless masses, how many of you browse without java script enabled?

The stats I've seen indicate between 5%-10% visitors with disabled
javascript.

In the end, I know most of the
effects i'm talking about can be done with CSS, but I just want to know ( in
a non-flamable way if at all possible ) why some of you disable your java.

We don't really matter all that much, unless your site caters to
webdesigners. You should ask your website visitors instead.


Matthias

 

[Chris Morris]

to stop pop ups. I guess what I'm really getting at is, it seems to me that
you missing alot more than you are gaining by disableing java script. Now,

There are three types of Javascript in my opinion.

1) Necessary JS. Alternative content to this is possible, but
necessarily less usable or of a lower quality. Very, very rare.
I'll re-enable JS for it on the few occasions I come across it.

2) Decorative JS. Nice to look at, doesn't add anything one way or
the other to the content. I don't really care if I see this or
not, so JS stays off. There may be people on the web who are
impressed by this sort of thing. Feel free to include it for them
(if you have some spare time that couldn't be spent on improving
content / accessibility / usability / layout), provided it's not
essential to view the site.

3) Unnecessary JS. Used to duplicate some better way of doing things
(navigation, usually), or to mess with my browser, etc. I don't
want to deal with this, if the site relies on it I go elsewhere.
JS stays off.

 

[Davmagic com]

From: (e-mail address removed) (user 1)

Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups
and annoying java script seem to be found
in endless masses, how many of you >browse without java script enabled?

I use MSNTV for most of my "unofficial" browsing (about 90%) and it does
not provide JS disabling (altho it does have a notorious bug that
disables JS occasionally) ...for serious web design I use IE6+, NN7+
Mozilla1.4 and Opera7.1 and do not disable JS!!!

I instead have a Firewall and Adware installed which both help block 99%
of all Pop-ups to my machine... I can live with that and continue to
Enjoy the advantages of JS on webpages...

You can find those programs here: http://davmagic.com/PAGES41.html#misc

Web Design-Magic-Painting-Junking-Games
INFO 2000 For You
http://www.davmagic.com
See how your webpages look on a MSN-TV Browser:
Download it here: http://developer.msntv.com/Tools/msntvvwr.asp

 

[Isofarro]

The stats I've seen indicate between 5%-10% visitors with disabled
javascript.

I have seen a few stats above 10%, even as high as 15%.

 

[Matthias Gutfeldt]

I have seen a few stats above 10%, even as high as 15%.

And I've seen stats close to 100%... it depends on the site, obviously.


Matthias

 

[JT]

user 1 wrote:
Ok, so in todays internet, where pop ups and annoying java script seem to
be found in endless masses, how many of you browse without java script
enabled?
The stats I've seen indicate between 5%-10% visitors with disabled
javascript.
I have seen a few stats above 10%, even as high as 15%.

I belong to three clubs with membership in excess of 700 in each. The %
disabled javascipt stats for the last four weeks are:-

Club 1 = 0% - Club 2 = 2% - Club 3 = 1%