Re: hey advocated !!

Discussion in 'HTML' started by kchayka, Sep 12, 2003.

  1. kchayka

    kchayka Guest

    Richard wrote:

    > Did your basic layout for your page without tables !
    > http://1-large-world.com/div1.html
    >
    > All done with <div> tags.
    > Only took a couple of hours of hand writing the code.
    > I color coded each division just for the demo.
    > You can add the images and other stuff as needed.


    Um, no offense, but I hope nobody takes your code, unless they want to
    fix it so it works in a www context. Fixed px size boxes that contain
    text are a ghastly idea, and it never would have occurred to me to
    absolutely position _and_ float the same element. I can't imagine what
    it is supposed to accomplish.

    Perhaps you should read up on positioning and the box model
    <URL:http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/visuren.html>

    Then follow up with a little fluid design
    <URL:http://www.allmyfaqs.com/faq.pl?AnySizeDesign>

    --
    To email a reply, remove (dash)ns(dash). Mail sent to the ns
    address is automatically deleted and will not be read.
     
    kchayka, Sep 12, 2003
    #1
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  2. kchayka

    Richard Guest

    kchayka wrote:>>

    > Richard wrote:


    >> Did your basic layout for your page without tables !
    >> http://1-large-world.com/div1.html
    >>
    >> All done with <div> tags.
    >> Only took a couple of hours of hand writing the code.
    >> I color coded each division just for the demo.
    >> You can add the images and other stuff as needed.


    > Um, no offense, but I hope nobody takes your code, unless they want to
    > fix it so it works in a www context. Fixed px size boxes that contain
    > text are a ghastly idea, and it never would have occurred to me to
    > absolutely position _and_ float the same element. I can't imagine what
    > it is supposed to accomplish.


    Purely as an excercise and one possible way of how to accomplish the effect.
    My use of the elements came from ideas presented in various websites,
    including w3.org.
    It is necessary to "float" the division if you want it on the side of
    another.
    You're not floating the element.
    And if divisions are not supposed to contain text, then why do we have
    divisions at all?
    The layout shows how to work around various problems and the fact that
    nowhere in it is a table.
    As so many condemn their use, as they do frames.
    If tables and frames are not to be used, how else does one manage to put up
    a website at all?
     
    Richard, Sep 12, 2003
    #2
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  3. Hi Richard,

    [Fri, 12 Sep 2003 17:35:10 -0500/Richard]
    > As so many condemn their use, as they do frames.
    > If tables and frames are not to be used, how else does one manage to put up
    > a website at all?


    Lol. Whats the trick with static divs? Let them flow against each
    other and you will know why (layout) tables still are up to date.
    As long as IE does not suppert css-table-cell...


    regs
    michael
     
    Michael Weber, Sep 13, 2003
    #3
  4. kchayka

    kchayka Guest

    Richard wrote:

    > kchayka wrote:>>
    >
    > > Richard wrote:

    >
    > >> http://1-large-world.com/div1.html

    >
    > > Um, no offense, but I hope nobody takes your code, unless they want to
    > > fix it so it works in a www context. Fixed px size boxes that contain
    > > text are a ghastly idea, and it never would have occurred to me to
    > > absolutely position _and_ float the same element. I can't imagine what
    > > it is supposed to accomplish.

    >
    > Purely as an excercise and one possible way of how to accomplish the effect.


    But not a way that anyone hoping to create a usable site should actually
    use.

    > My use of the elements came from ideas presented in various websites,
    > including w3.org.


    Your particular combinations are strange. Wherever did you see them
    used this way at w3.org? Absolutely positioning a floated element
    doesn't make any sense. If you read the specs I pointed to, you might
    begin to understand this.

    > It is necessary to "float" the division if you want it on the side of
    > another.
    > You're not floating the element.


    Um, <div> is an element, same as <p> or any other block is.
    div.parent1 {
    position: absolute; <--
    width: 600px;
    height:25px;
    float: left; <--
    }

    One of those two properties is superfluous. I won't hazard a guess as
    to which one.

    > And if divisions are not supposed to contain text, then why do we have
    > divisions at all?


    I guess you don't know much about structural markup, either. <sigh>

    You totally missed the comment about sizing the block in px units. This
    is the main problem. The actual text size used cannot be predetermined
    so the containing block size cannot be predetermined, at least not in px
    units. You'd have much better luck with em units, as the container
    would than scale with whatever text size was actually used. Ideally,
    you should be using some combination of % and em, so the box sizes scale
    with both window and text size.

    > The layout shows how to work around various problems and the fact that
    > nowhere in it is a table.


    But you introduce the problems of a fragile, pixel-perfect layout that
    is even worse, IMO.

    > As so many condemn their use, as they do frames.
    > If tables and frames are not to be used, how else does one manage to put up
    > a website at all?


    If you are going to use CSS for positioning, I suggest you learn what
    that really does, rather than hack up something that seems to work for
    you, but will ultimately fail in the real world.

    --
    To email a reply, remove (dash)ns(dash). Mail sent to the ns
    address is automatically deleted and will not be read.
     
    kchayka, Sep 13, 2003
    #4
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