Re: Is Perl dying or not?

Discussion in 'Perl Misc' started by domestuff@gmail.com, Apr 23, 2013.

  1. Guest

    On Friday, October 19, 2012 10:43:53 PM UTC-4, Ignoramus7380 wrote:

    <SNIP>

    >
    >
    > So this is not some kind of "perl suxxx" troll. Rather, I want to ask
    >
    > if perl will continue to be a viable ecosystem. I have a lot invested
    >
    > in and relying on perl and I have a vested interest in having perl to
    >
    > be a great platform.
    >


    <SNIP>

    IMHO, perl is proof that there is such a thing as a language that is too flexible. There are a LOT of free perl scripts on the Internet that are pretty terribly written, and so at first glance, some people get an impression of perl that it is kindof kludgy. The truth is that it has been adopted by people with so many different programming backgrounds, that perl tends to have dialects within itself.

    Many got tired of trying to bend their minds around this and ran to python for structure. Many never automated their way around perls particularly verbose object oriented syntax, and ran to Ruby.

    In practice, perl is very good for writing tools that make writing perl clean and fast. But you have to get past the fact that you _should_ write perllike perl, and NOT like BASIC, C, Java, etc. etc. etc. even though that iswhat brought you to perl in the first place.

    The hardest thing about perl, is learning what good perl design is, becauseit is so easy to misbehave and get away with it.

    My 2 cents.
     
    , Apr 23, 2013
    #1
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  2. Justin C Guest

    On 2013-04-23, <> wrote:

    [snip]
    >
    > My 2 cents.


    This thread has passed on, it is no more, it has ceased to be.
    It has expired and gone to meet its maker. It is bereft of life,
    it rests in peace. It has kicked the bucket and shuffled off
    its mortal coil. If you hadn't ressurected it it would be off
    with the choir invisible. This is an ex-thread. It died sometime
    last year.


    Justin.

    --
    Justin C, by the sea.
     
    Justin C, Apr 23, 2013
    #2
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  3. writes:
    > On Friday, October 19, 2012 10:43:53 PM UTC-4, Ignoramus7380 wrote:


    [...]

    >> So this is not some kind of "perl suxxx" troll. Rather, I want to ask
    >> if perl will continue to be a viable ecosystem. I have a lot invested
    >> in and relying on perl and I have a vested interest in having perl to
    >> be a great platform.


    [...]

    > IMHO, perl is proof that there is such a thing as a language that is
    > too flexible. There are a LOT of free perl scripts on the Internet
    > that are pretty terribly written, and so at first glance, some
    > people get an impression of perl that it is kindof kludgy. The truth
    > is that it has been adopted by people with so many different
    > programming backgrounds, that perl tends to have dialects within
    > itself.


    A splendid non-sequitur: There is a real lot of 'terribly written'
    code in any programming language 'on the internet': What precisely
    constitutes 'terribly written' is very much a matter of opinion (and
    'opinion' doesn't necessarily mean 'reasoned opinion' here) and there
    are a lot more bad programmers than good programmers, as with anything
    else (=> Sturgeon's relevation). Even if there was more 'terribly
    written free Perl code' on the internet, that would - at best - be a
    hint (not a proof) that Perl is a lot easier to use than less
    frequently abused languages. Also, all programming languages have
    'dialects within themselves', just like all other languages.

    > Many got tired of trying to bend their minds around this and ran to
    > python for structure.


    What's this supposed to mean?

    > Many never automated their way around perls
    > particularly verbose object oriented syntax, and ran to Ruby.


    Or this?

    I've been using Perl extensively since about 1995 without encountering
    any 'particularly verbose object oriented syntax' which had warranted
    'automating around it'. In fact, I've been using objects based on
    anonymous arrays and manual slot allocation until fairly recently and
    the only reason why I wrote (and published) some code to automate that
    was to demonstrate how little is actually needed to turn the existing
    'Perl OO' facilities into a complete OO-system, in contrast to
    'everything anybody else ever came up with plus two kitchen sinks to be
    on the safe side' approaches a la "Der Elch ist los!".

    > In practice, perl is very good for writing tools that make writing
    > perl clean and fast.


    What does this mean?

    > But you have to get past the fact that you _should_ write perl like
    > perl, and NOT like BASIC, C, Java, etc. etc. etc. even though that
    > is what brought you to perl in the first place.


    Anything perl can compile and which has the intended effect upon
    execution is 'Perl written like perl': Like any language, it can
    accomodate different styles of writing: The mere fact that a text
    someone else wrote reminds you of a different text written in another
    lanuage is not an indicator of any particular quality. And people can
    have different reasoned opinions on 'style issues': Eg, to me, a
    'regex' is something delimited by forward-slashes and the occasional
    forward slash inside a regex needs to be quoted. That's the way all
    other tools I regularly use offering such features work and -
    conveniently for me - Perl (can) work(s) in the same way.

    Other people are convinced that 'avoiding the occasional quoted
    delimiter' is sufficiently important that each regex should utilize a
    (set of) delimiter character(s) which has been individually chosen to
    avoid the need to quote anything. To me, this just looks needlessly
    noisy ("What's the delimiter this time ???") and since it won't teach
    awk, ed and sed new tricks, anyway, why bother with that?

    > The hardest thing about perl, is learning what good perl design is,
    > because it is so easy to misbehave and get away with it.


    You seem to be fixated on syntactical issues to a degree I really
    don't understand ...
     
    Rainer Weikusat, Apr 23, 2013
    #3
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