Re: Python 2.3.2 RPM's for Redhat 8.0 or Python source RPM andupgrade procedure?

Discussion in 'Python' started by Cliff Wells, Oct 13, 2003.

  1. Cliff Wells

    Cliff Wells Guest

    On Mon, 2003-10-06 at 19:00, Skip Montanaro wrote:
    > >> On my Mac I have four different versions of Python: /usr/bin/python
    > >> comes from Apple. /sw/bin/python comes from fink.
    > >> /usr/local/bin/python and ~/local/bin/python are my doing. I have no
    > >> trouble with any of this for a simple reason: I have my path jiggered
    > >> to see ~/local/bin before anything else, so I never run the versions
    > >> Apple or fink installed, and I don't mess with their stuff.

    >
    > Cliff> IMO, the *best* solution would be for Redhat and other vendors to
    > Cliff> keep a "system" version of Python separate for their own needs,
    > Cliff> e.g /usr/bin/python-rh could link to their 2.2 install with all
    > Cliff> of its modules.
    >
    > I think this is one of those "slippery slopes". Taken to its logical
    > conclusion, vendors would have to provide "system" versions of bash, Perl,
    > GCC, glibc, ... just to ensure that users could overwrite vendor-provided
    > tools.


    And taking things to their logical conclusion is often a slippery slope
    of its own. Programmers have a way of thinking that finds pure
    consistency more appealing than practical application. While I don't
    entirely disagree you that there is a danger, I would suggest that when
    a commonly used package (such as Python) is so central to the operation
    of vendor supplied packages that upgrading it is nearly impossible, that
    the vendor should keep their own copy. Do perl, bash, et al fall into
    this category? I don't know, but I've never had a problem upgrading
    them, while upgrading Python on Redhat is a royal pain. This suggests
    to me that perhaps Redhat should maintain their own installation of
    Python with a different name.

    > The simpler solution is to allow users to install their own copies
    > of various tools in non-system directories (/usr/local, /sw, ~/local, ...).


    But the downside of this is when a user installs some package, say
    boa-constructor and wants it to use the user-supplied version of Python,
    then they must edit the shebang line in every relevant file.

    To be certain, probably the real problem is the packaging system, which
    is unable to provide enough information to make upgrading a reasonable
    task. If rpm were able to give a list of packages that relied on
    Python, then it would be a straightforward, if tedious, process for the
    user to obtain the source rpms for said packages and rebuild them
    against a newer version of Python.


    Cliff

    --
    Someone shot nostalgia in the back, someone shot our innocence
    -Bauhaus
    Cliff Wells, Oct 13, 2003
    #1
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  2. Cliff Wells

    Paul Boddie Guest

    Re: Python 2.3.2 RPM's for Redhat 8.0 or Python source RPM and upgrade procedure?

    Cliff Wells <> wrote in message news:<>...
    >
    > And taking things to their logical conclusion is often a slippery slope
    > of its own. Programmers have a way of thinking that finds pure
    > consistency more appealing than practical application. While I don't
    > entirely disagree you that there is a danger, I would suggest that when
    > a commonly used package (such as Python) is so central to the operation
    > of vendor supplied packages that upgrading it is nearly impossible, that
    > the vendor should keep their own copy.


    With "complete" Red Hat installations weighing in at 4GB, I think Red
    Hat could easily slip their own installation of Python in there
    without anyone noticing.

    > Do perl, bash, et al fall into this category? I don't know, but I've never
    > had a problem upgrading them, while upgrading Python on Redhat is a royal
    > pain.


    I don't agree with this, but then by installing from the source
    distribution into /usr/local and by changing my PATH, I'm effectively
    maintaining Red Hat's private Python installation for them.

    Paul
    Paul Boddie, Oct 13, 2003
    #2
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