Re: The Bible in html/css...

Discussion in 'HTML' started by Doug Miller, Mar 19, 2011.

  1. Doug Miller

    Doug Miller Guest

    In article <>, freedomfighter <> wrote:
    >It's there a way to create a typical Bible like 2 columns page -
    >template with text flowing from left column to the right one?
    >
    >I want to make a Bible in html and I can't find any good example or any
    >template.


    http://lmgtfy.com/?q=html two column text
     
    Doug Miller, Mar 19, 2011
    #1
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  2. Doug Miller

    Gus Richter Guest

    On 3/19/2011 7:58 AM, freedomfighter wrote:
    > On 19/03/2011 21:20, Doug Miller wrote:
    >> In article<>,
    >> freedomfighter<> wrote:
    >>> It's there a way to create a typical Bible like 2 columns page -
    >>> template with text flowing from left column to the right one?
    >>>
    >>> I want to make a Bible in html and I can't find any good example or any
    >>> template.

    >>
    >> http://lmgtfy.com/?q=html two column text

    >
    >
    > Many thanks...
    >
    > Looks like I was unable to explain my question. I think, I have found
    > the answer in that link.
    >
    > So is the java script which does what I want do achieve.
    >
    > http://randysimons.nl/125,english/129,multi-column-text/
    >
    > http://randysimons.com/overige/multicolumn/
    >
    > Looks like css2.1 can't do it as yet but with just one script I can
    > achieve my goal.
    >
    > Many many thanks for your help and God bless you.



    If you choose Javascript method, do be it, but if you wish to explore
    the CSS method, read on.

    Read this first:

    <http://randysimons.nl/125,english/129,multi-column-text/#paragraaf_1>

    Go see a working example of Multicolumns viewanble by Firefox, Chrome
    and Safari:

    <http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/roc/archives/2011/03/investigating_p.html>
    For Safari you might have to use:
    <http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/roc/archives/2011/03/>

    Opera support is reported to be within the next two releases.

    Specification for multi-column layouts in CSS:

    <http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-multicol/>

    See the working example source for vendor specific prefixes.

    --
    Gus
     
    Gus Richter, Mar 19, 2011
    #2
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  3. Gus Richter wrote:

    > On 3/19/2011 7:58 AM, freedomfighter wrote:


    >> http://randysimons.nl/125,english/129,multi-column-text/

    [...]
    > If you choose Javascript method, do be it, but if you wish to explore
    > the CSS method, read on.


    The approaches need not be mutually exclusive. You might use CSS3
    Multi-column layout _and_ try to soup up some Javascript code that
    "columnizes" text _if_ the browser does not support the CSS way. This isn't
    trivial because browsers support CSS3 Multi-column under different names.

    The Javascript method described on the cited page is defective, because it
    mostly leaves the last line of each column too short (when the paragraph
    continues in the next column). There's probably no easy way to fix this.
    Besides, when the page is printed, the columnization seems to get lost
    (perhaps intentionally).

    I'm afraid the Web isn't quite ready for columns yet - except in the old
    boring but working sense that you can _statically_ divide your content into
    columns.

    And how often do people actually want to read web pages the same way as they
    read newspapers, reading a narrow column down to its bottom, then moving to
    the start of the next column, etc.? In printed versions of pages, that might
    make sense. But why should we try hard to create such rendering on a media
    where it is neither necessary nor useful? It's easier to just scroll down if
    needed.

    --
    Yucca, http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/
     
    Jukka K. Korpela, Mar 19, 2011
    #3
  4. Doug Miller

    Doug Miller Guest

    In article <Is2hp.24681$>, "Jukka K. Korpela" <> wrote:

    >And how often do people actually want to read web pages the same way as they
    >read newspapers, reading a narrow column down to its bottom, then moving to
    >the start of the next column, etc.? In printed versions of pages, that might
    >make sense. But why should we try hard to create such rendering on a media
    >where it is neither necessary nor useful? It's easier to just scroll down if
    >needed.


    Well, maybe. It depends on the amount of content. It's certainly easier to
    read text in two narrow columns than in one wide column -- as long as it all
    fits on one screen. But if there's enough text to require scrolling, then the
    two-column format requires scrolling down to reach the end of the first
    column, then scrolling back up to find the top of the second one. That's a
    nuisance, and I'd rather have a single column.
     
    Doug Miller, Mar 19, 2011
    #4
  5. Doug Miller

    Gus Richter Guest

    On 3/19/2011 9:46 AM, Jukka K. Korpela wrote:
    > Gus Richter wrote:
    >
    >> On 3/19/2011 7:58 AM, freedomfighter wrote:

    >
    >>> http://randysimons.nl/125,english/129,multi-column-text/

    > [...]
    >> If you choose Javascript method, so be it, but if you wish to explore
    >> the CSS method, read on.

    >
    > The approaches need not be mutually exclusive. You might use CSS3
    > Multi-column layout _and_ try to soup up some Javascript code that
    > "columnizes" text _if_ the browser does not support the CSS way. This
    > isn't trivial because browsers support CSS3 Multi-column under different
    > names.
    >
    > The Javascript method described on the cited page is defective, because
    > it mostly leaves the last line of each column too short (when the
    > paragraph continues in the next column). There's probably no easy way to
    > fix this. Besides, when the page is printed, the columnization seems to
    > get lost (perhaps intentionally).
    >
    > I'm afraid the Web isn't quite ready for columns yet - except in the old
    > boring but working sense that you can _statically_ divide your content
    > into columns.
    >
    > And how often do people actually want to read web pages the same way as
    > they read newspapers, reading a narrow column down to its bottom, then
    > moving to the start of the next column, etc.? In printed versions of
    > pages, that might make sense. But why should we try hard to create such
    > rendering on a media where it is neither necessary nor useful? It's
    > easier to just scroll down if needed.



    The OP wishes to use multi-columns with a Bible. The columns are
    typically very narrow and with the wide screens mostly in use today, it
    would look odd to have a single narrow column requiring constant
    scrolling. Assuming that the desire is to not change the Bible from the
    narrow column to a very wide one due to aesthetic reasons. Considering
    that the paragraphs are short very often and therefore could take up
    only one line per paragraph making it reasonable to use multi-columns
    and keep the columns narrow. Scrolling up to the top of the second
    column may not be necessary since the column height can be specified and
    geared to the viewport.

    Different uses will certainly have different requirements. Depending on
    the quality of work required, multi-columns by itself may not be
    sufficient for the OP due to the lack of special considerations such as
    widows, orphans and other considerations. Multi-columns is simply as
    described and nothing beyond at this time. Pagination and some of the
    items mentioned, are not possible although there is always hope for
    somewhere in the very far future.

    --
    Gus
     
    Gus Richter, Mar 19, 2011
    #5
  6. Doug Miller

    dorayme Guest

    In article <>,
    Ed Mullen <> wrote:

    > Columns are, in most cases, idiotic on the Web.
    >
    > I read 3 or 4 newspapers every day. In my hands. Nice logical layout.
    > Web? My eyes can't scan a whole page at once. Especially if it doesn't
    > fit onto a single page (screen) like the paper I hold in my hands.
    >
    > It's a totally stupid and broken paradigm. It'll never work as this
    > discussion seems to be suggesting.


    If an essay or article has natural sections and they are not too
    long, it should be able to be arranged to have those sections in
    columns and not higher than can be seen when there are at least
    two of them, the more there are the shorter they will be.
    Scrolling always needing to be only one way as one reads. But it
    is probably hard work to achieve and would not suit all articles.

    --
    dorayme
     
    dorayme, Mar 20, 2011
    #6
  7. Doug Miller

    Gus Richter Guest

    On 3/19/2011 4:00 PM, Gus Richter wrote:
    >
    > Different uses will certainly have different requirements. Depending on
    > the quality of work required, multi-columns by itself may not be
    > sufficient for the OP due to the lack of special considerations such as
    > widows, orphans and other considerations. Multi-columns is simply as
    > described and nothing beyond at this time. Pagination and some of the
    > items mentioned, are not possible although there is always hope for
    > somewhere in the very far future.



    Addendum: Not so far perhaps. Some properties mentioned here are
    supported, partially supported or not at all yet by the major browsers.
    Once fully supported, pagination, widows and orphans can be successfully
    handled.

    CSS2.1 - Paged Media
    <http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/page.html>

    CSS3 - Column Breaks
    <http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-multicol/#column-breaks>

    Paged Media - Mozilla
    <https://developer.mozilla.org/en/CSS/Paged_Media>
    Mozilla reports the status of the browsers on each individual property.
    Unknown as to how current it may be.

    --
    Gus
     
    Gus Richter, Mar 20, 2011
    #7
  8. On Mar 19, 10:52 pm, Ed Mullen <> wrote:
    > Doug Miller wrote:
    >
    > Columns are, in most cases, idiotic on the Web.
    >
    > I read 3 or 4 newspapers every day.  In my hands. Nice logical layout.
    > Web?  My eyes can't scan a whole page at once.  Especially if it doesn't
    > fit onto a single page (screen) like the paper I hold in my hands.
    >
    > It's a totally stupid and broken paradigm.  It'll never work as this
    > discussion seems to be suggesting.
    >
    > --
    > Ed Mullenhttp://edmullen.net/
    > "Harmony of aim, not identity of conclusion, is the secret of
    > sympathetic life." - Ralph Waldo Emerson


    Columns could be useful for printed output.

    www.richardfisher.com
     
    Helpful person, Mar 21, 2011
    #8
  9. On Mar 21, 2:38 pm, Sherm Pendley <> wrote:
    >
    > *Especially* so IMHO, given that paper can't be easily resized like a
    > browser window can be.
    >
    > sherm--
    >
    > --
    > Sherm Pendley
    >                                    <http://camelbones.sourceforge.net>
    > Cocoa Developer


    I resize it all the time. I'm often tearing up paper printed from a
    web site that didn't bother to write the CCS for printing.

    http://www.richardfisher.com
     
    Helpful person, Mar 21, 2011
    #9
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