Re: The mac for Java programmers

Discussion in 'Java' started by Sherm Pendley, Aug 21, 2008.

  1. Sherm Pendley, Aug 21, 2008
    #1
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  2. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 11:51:57 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    said :

    > Costs considerably more?


    Aren't they about twice as much for comparable iron?
    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 21, 2008
    #2
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  3. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 11:51:57 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    said :

    >
    >Quirky spelling?

    I am warning people that the spelling is screwing so they won't
    looking under the wrong name or embarrassing themselves in public as I
    did by correcting the spelling.

    Americans have a high tolerance for variant spellings. It stems from
    the noble efforts of Noah Webster to tidy up English and make it
    easier to learn, both spell, pronounce and understand for immigrants.

    My stomach churns at Krispy Kreme, Kosy Kabins and all the atrocious
    grammar and pronunciation you hear in commercials.
    see http://mindprod.com/contact/peeves.html

    It is almost as though we have re-entered a Shakespearian age where
    one varies spelling of words for the same reason one uses synonyms.

    The invention of printing tended to stardardise the English spelling.
    Today the movement away from print to audio and video, is having the
    opposite effect.

    You'd think with spell checkers, spelling would become extremely
    standard.
    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 21, 2008
    #3
  4. Roedy Green <> writes:

    > On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 11:51:57 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    > <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    > said :
    >
    >> Costs considerably more?

    >
    > Aren't they about twice as much for comparable iron?


    No, they're not. Apple doesn't have a cheap low-end model, but the
    models that they *do* have are within the same ballpark as a Dell, HP,
    or other major brand with the same specs.

    If you actually meant this guide to be useful, you could have easily
    checked out the various brands' online stores to verify this part of
    it - the "I don't own one, so I don't know" excuse doesn't hold water
    this time.

    sherm--

    --
    My blog: http://shermspace.blogspot.com
    Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
    Sherm Pendley, Aug 21, 2008
    #4
  5. Roedy Green <> writes:

    > I am warning people that the spelling is screwing so they won't
    > looking under the wrong name or embarrassing themselves in public as I
    > did by correcting the spelling.


    If you want to help people spell it correctly, correcting the common
    mistake of writing it as "MAC" would be far more useful. I've been
    reading and writing about Macs for quite a long time now, and I've
    seen that mistake made *far* more often than the one that you're
    trying to correct.

    > Americans have a high tolerance for variant spellings. It stems from
    > the noble efforts of Noah Webster to tidy up English and make it
    > easier to learn, both spell, pronounce and understand for immigrants.
    >
    > My stomach churns at Krispy Kreme, Kosy Kabins and all the atrocious
    > grammar and pronunciation you hear in commercials.


    These examples are likely the result of the same mental process as
    that which led to "Macintosh" - you can't trademark a generic term,
    and the simplest way to create a unique name is to vary the spelling
    slightly.

    > You'd think with spell checkers, spelling would become extremely
    > standard.


    Not when the misspellings are intentional, and dictated by lawyers.

    sherm--

    --
    My blog: http://shermspace.blogspot.com
    Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
    Sherm Pendley, Aug 21, 2008
    #5
  6. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:15:45 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    said :

    >If you actually meant this guide to be useful, you could have easily
    >checked out the various brands' online stores to verify this part of
    >it - the "I don't own one, so I don't know" excuse doesn't hold water
    >this time.

    My data is not that old, but it is Canadian. I will recheck.
    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 22, 2008
    #6
  7. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:05:09 -0700, Tim Smith
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted
    someone who said :

    >
    >The Mac Pro is now: $6298
    >The Dell is now: $7245


    These are quite high end machines. New desktops in my neck of the
    woods are in the order of $600.

    What I need to do in find prices on low, medium and high end machines
    to compare.

    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 22, 2008
    #7
  8. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:56:05 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    said :

    >If you want to help people spell it correctly, correcting the common
    >mistake of writing it as "MAC" would be far more useful. I've been
    >reading and writing about Macs for quite a long time now, and I've
    >seen that mistake made *far* more often than the one that you're
    >trying to correct.


    That is the first I have heard it was considered an error. I will add
    that.
    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 22, 2008
    #8
  9. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 07:29:22 GMT, Roedy Green
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted
    someone who said :

    >My data is not that old, but it is Canadian. I will recheck.


    For example, where I live an iMac with 20-inch monitor, 2.4 GHz Dual
    core CPU, 2 gig RAM, 320 gig hard disk
    will set you back $1600.00 CAD
    A roughly corresponding 3 GHz Dual Core PC will set you back about
    only $975.00 CAD.

    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 22, 2008
    #9
  10. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 07:29:22 GMT, Roedy Green
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted
    someone who said :

    >My data is not that old, but it is Canadian. I will recheck.


    A Mac Pro with 4 cores, 2.8 GHz, 8 gig RAM, 320 gig disk and 24-inch
    monitor will set you back $1600 CAD . A comparable 4-core 3.16 GHz PC
    costs $3100 CAD.
    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 22, 2008
    #10
  11. In article <>,
    Roedy Green <> wrote:

    > On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 07:29:22 GMT, Roedy Green
    > <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted
    > someone who said :
    >
    > >My data is not that old, but it is Canadian. I will recheck.

    >
    > For example, where I live an iMac with 20-inch monitor, 2.4 GHz Dual
    > core CPU, 2 gig RAM, 320 gig hard disk will set you back $1600.00 CAD
    > A roughly corresponding 3 GHz Dual Core PC will set you back about
    > only $975.00 CAD.


    I'm familiar with the iMac brand, but who makes this "roughly
    corresponding" model? Is their memory cheaper? How's their monitor
    quality? Does the maker of "roughly corresponding" consist of one
    company or several? Will they point fingers at each other if I have a
    problem? Is this a valid comparison?

    Sorry to ask so many questions, but if this pans out, I want to visit
    their web site before I buy another Mac! :)

    --
    John B. Matthews
    trashgod at gmail dot com
    home dot woh dot rr dot com slash jbmatthews
    John B. Matthews, Aug 22, 2008
    #11
  12. Roedy Green <> wrote:
    > On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:56:05 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    >>If you want to help people spell it correctly, correcting the common
    >>mistake of writing it as "MAC" would be far more useful. I've been
    >>reading and writing about Macs for quite a long time now, and I've
    >>seen that mistake made *far* more often than the one that you're
    >>trying to correct.

    > That is the first I have heard it was considered an error. I will add
    > that.


    New to me, too, especially in the light of their own (cute) movie clips:
    "Hello, I'm a PC. ... - Hello, I'm a mac. ..."
    Andreas Leitgeb, Aug 22, 2008
    #12
  13. Sherm Pendley

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 05:09:15 -0400, "John B. Matthews"
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    said :

    >I'm familiar with the iMac brand, but who makes this "roughly
    >corresponding" model? Is their memory cheaper? How's their monitor
    >quality? Does the maker of "roughly corresponding" consist of one
    >company or several? Will they point fingers at each other if I have a
    >problem? Is this a valid comparison?


    Obviously you must get something for the extra bucks. My point is for
    equipment with comparable specs, same amount of ram, same speed cpu,
    same size disk, same size monitor, you pay a premium for the Mac.

    I think you are paying quite a bit for the sexy styling. It is
    certainly is not for a superior keyboard or mouse. Mac monitors are
    breathtaking.

    Steve Jobs invited me, and all the computer club presidents to Silicon
    Valley for a conference to unveil the Lisa, the predecessor to the
    Mac. There they said they could manufacture a computer they sold for
    about $2500 for $200 in a totally automated factory. The reason Macs
    are expensive has little to do with the cost to make them. It is
    simply the price that optimises profit. That has always bothered me. I
    would have liked them to go for more market penetration and force
    Microsoft to clean up its act.

    I was talking with one of my favourite retailer the other day and
    asked what was new. They said mainly lower prices. Retailers are
    squeezed by ever shrinking profit margins. The problem is it costs
    just as much to sell and prep a computer even when the price drops to
    half. The other news is fancy new graphics cards with astronomical
    prices.

    Even though Apple sells at a premium price, Apple oddly has an
    advantage in a price-pinched market. They don't have to pull together
    parts from many sources and hand assemble to create a machine.


    --

    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    The Java Glossary
    http://mindprod.com
    Roedy Green, Aug 22, 2008
    #13
  14. In article <>,
    Roedy Green <> wrote:

    > On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 05:09:15 -0400, "John B. Matthews"
    > <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    > said :
    >
    > >I'm familiar with the iMac brand, but who makes this "roughly
    > >corresponding" model? Is their memory cheaper? How's their monitor
    > >quality? Does the maker of "roughly corresponding" consist of one
    > >company or several? Will they point fingers at each other if I have a
    > >problem? Is this a valid comparison?

    >
    > Obviously you must get something for the extra bucks. My point is for
    > equipment with comparable specs, same amount of ram, same speed cpu,
    > same size disk, same size monitor, you pay a premium for the Mac.


    You have adduced no evidence for this conjecture. You are comparing a
    particular brand to no brand in particular. The letter may sell at a
    premium or a discount relative to the Mac. Without a specific, as-built
    order, comparable is a relative term.

    Ultimately, if you want Mac OS, you buy a Mac. If you don't want
    Windows, you have to pay for it anyway. Apple tax; Microsoft tax.

    > I think you are paying quite a bit for the sexy styling. It is
    > certainly is not for a superior keyboard or mouse. Mac monitors are
    > breathtaking.


    Not everybody's happy:

    <http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/26/apple-quietly-settles-macbook-6-bit-l
    cd-screen-lawsuit/>

    > Steve Jobs invited me, and all the computer club presidents to Silicon
    > Valley for a conference to unveil the Lisa, the predecessor to the
    > Mac. There they said they could manufacture a computer they sold for
    > about $2500 for $200 in a totally automated factory. The reason Macs
    > are expensive has little to do with the cost to make them. It is
    > simply the price that optimises profit.


    Aren't they are obligated to their shareholders? If they get too greedy,
    won't the competition clarify the matter?

    > That has always bothered me. I would have liked them to go for more
    > market penetration and force Microsoft to clean up its act.


    That would be a nice side-effect, but not a competitor's business goal.
    Microsoft is a convicted monopolist that has proven difficult to
    rehabilitate.

    > I was talking with one of my favourite retailer the other day and
    > asked what was new. They said mainly lower prices. Retailers are
    > squeezed by ever shrinking profit margins. The problem is it costs
    > just as much to sell and prep a computer even when the price drops to
    > half. The other news is fancy new graphics cards with astronomical
    > prices.
    >
    > Even though Apple sells at a premium price, Apple oddly has an
    > advantage in a price-pinched market. They don't have to pull together
    > parts from many sources and hand assemble to create a machine.


    They occasionally shrink the product line to benefit from this effect,
    but it always grows back. :)

    --
    John B. Matthews
    trashgod at gmail dot com
    home dot woh dot rr dot com slash jbmatthews
    John B. Matthews, Aug 22, 2008
    #14
  15. Sherm Pendley

    Tom Anderson Guest

    On Fri, 22 Aug 2008, Andreas Leitgeb wrote:

    > Roedy Green <> wrote:
    >> On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:56:05 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    >>> If you want to help people spell it correctly, correcting the common
    >>> mistake of writing it as "MAC" would be far more useful. I've been
    >>> reading and writing about Macs for quite a long time now, and I've
    >>> seen that mistake made *far* more often than the one that you're
    >>> trying to correct.

    >> That is the first I have heard it was considered an error. I will add
    >> that.

    >
    > New to me, too, especially in the light of their own (cute) movie clips:
    > "Hello, I'm a PC. ... - Hello, I'm a mac. ..."


    I think the point is that the capitalisation is wrong: it's Mac, not MAC.
    Mac is short for Macintosh, it's not an acronym for anything.

    tom

    --
    Mpreg is short for Male Impregnation and I cannot get enough. -- D
    Tom Anderson, Aug 22, 2008
    #15
  16. Tom Anderson <> wrote:
    > On Fri, 22 Aug 2008, Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
    >>> On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:56:05 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    >>>> If you want to help people spell it correctly, correcting the common
    >>>> mistake of writing it as "MAC" would be far more useful.

    >> New to me, too, especially in the light of their own (cute) movie clips:
    >> "Hello, I'm a PC. ... - Hello, I'm a mac. ..."


    > I think the point is that the capitalisation is wrong: it's Mac, not MAC.
    > Mac is short for Macintosh, it's not an acronym for anything.


    Ah, right.

    "MAC" in capitals is actually used for the hardware address
    of ethernet cards.
    Andreas Leitgeb, Aug 22, 2008
    #16
  17. Roedy Green <> writes:

    > On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:15:45 -0400, Sherm Pendley
    > <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    > said :
    >
    >>If you actually meant this guide to be useful, you could have easily
    >>checked out the various brands' online stores to verify this part of
    >>it - the "I don't own one, so I don't know" excuse doesn't hold water
    >>this time.

    > My data is not that old, but it is Canadian. I will recheck.


    Come to think of it - non-US prices can vary wildly. IIRC, Macs
    actually *are* horribly expensive in some European countries, because
    of a VAT or some other tax on foreign imports.

    sherm--

    --
    My blog: http://shermspace.blogspot.com
    Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
    Sherm Pendley, Aug 22, 2008
    #17
  18. Roedy Green <> writes:

    > On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 05:09:15 -0400, "John B. Matthews"
    > <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    > said :
    >
    >>I'm familiar with the iMac brand, but who makes this "roughly
    >>corresponding" model? Is their memory cheaper? How's their monitor
    >>quality? Does the maker of "roughly corresponding" consist of one
    >>company or several? Will they point fingers at each other if I have a
    >>problem? Is this a valid comparison?

    >
    > Obviously you must get something for the extra bucks. My point is for
    > equipment with comparable specs, same amount of ram, same speed cpu,
    > same size disk, same size monitor, you pay a premium for the Mac.


    You pay a hefty premium to have those parts come pre-assembled from
    Dell or HP, too. Hence the question - against what vendor are you
    comparing? A collection of parts that you have to assemble yourself is
    not comparable to what you get from Apple or HP.

    > I think you are paying quite a bit for the sexy styling.


    I'm not - Apple could package their computers in a milk crate for all
    I care. I buy them because they're *nix machines that don't require
    constant tweaking to keep them running.

    > Even though Apple sells at a premium price, Apple oddly has an
    > advantage in a price-pinched market. They don't have to pull together
    > parts from many sources and hand assemble to create a machine.


    Have you looked inside a Mac recently? Except for the case & main
    board, it's all standard parts from a variety of sources.

    sherm--

    --
    My blog: http://shermspace.blogspot.com
    Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
    Sherm Pendley, Aug 22, 2008
    #18
  19. Roedy Green <> writes:

    > On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 07:29:22 GMT, Roedy Green
    > <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted
    > someone who said :
    >
    >>My data is not that old, but it is Canadian. I will recheck.

    >
    > A Mac Pro with 4 cores


    Look again - Mac Pros all have 2 quad-core Xeons. 8 cores.

    sherm--

    --
    My blog: http://shermspace.blogspot.com
    Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
    Sherm Pendley, Aug 22, 2008
    #19
  20. Sherm Pendley, Aug 22, 2008
    #20
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