Really cool site about CSS

Discussion in 'ASP .Net' started by VB Programmer, Jun 10, 2004.

  1. VB Programmer, Jun 10, 2004
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. VB Programmer

    pmb Guest

    And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.

    On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    <> wrote:

    >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    >
    >
    >Cool stuff.
    >
    >
    >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    >
    >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    >wondering.
    >
    >
    >
     
    pmb, Jun 10, 2004
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Is it really possible to get page layouts like this without using frames?
    Or do you need basic frames to place side-bar nav, header, footer elements,
    etc...?

    Interesting.

    "VB Programmer" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > http://www.csszengarden.com/
    >
    >
    > Cool stuff.
    >
    >
    > Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    >
    > Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > wondering.
    >
    >
    >
    >
     
    VB Programmer, Jun 10, 2004
    #3
  4. VB Programmer

    Colin Young Guest

    And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several years
    old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing to
    insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots of
    money and time for no real gain.

    See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the article was
    written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were considered
    obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE 5?
    Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses can't
    render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.

    Colin

    "pmb" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.
    >
    > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > >
    > >
    > >Cool stuff.
    > >
    > >
    > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > >
    > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > >wondering.
    > >
    > >
    > >

    >
     
    Colin Young, Jun 10, 2004
    #4
  5. VB Programmer

    Colin Young Guest

    Colin Young, Jun 10, 2004
    #5
  6. So, if you wanted to do a side-bar navigation, with a header and footer, you
    wouldn't uses any tables, just css? If so, how do you position it exactly
    like you want?

    Great link btw.

    "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Yep. I only use tables for tabular data. It's made my life much easier.
    >
    > Another good site is http://www.alistapart.com/
    >
    > Colin
    >
    > "VB Programmer" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > >
    > >
    > > Cool stuff.
    > >
    > >
    > > Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > >
    > > Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > wondering.
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    VB Programmer, Jun 10, 2004
    #6
  7. Actually it's money that counts.
    You can have the most perfect and advanced site that is working with IE 9.0
    ( i know it does not exist yet) but it will be a dead site since there are
    still thousands of user who is using IE 5.0

    Of course you can not bow to anyone who does not want to upgrade the system.
    But if the percentage of the people who is using IE 5.0 is high i would say
    your site must work with IE 5.0


    It's matter of your marketing team (or what ever it's called) to make the
    cutoff point (browser version).

    For my home page cutoff point is IE 6.0 since i doubt that anyone will be
    visiting it and i have IE 6.0 ( i am trying to be sarcastic).

    George.


    "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several years
    > old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing to
    > insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots of
    > money and time for no real gain.
    >
    > See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the article

    was
    > written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were considered
    > obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE 5?
    > Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses can't
    > render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.
    >
    > Colin
    >
    > "pmb" <> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    > > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    > > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.
    > >
    > > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > > <> wrote:
    > >
    > > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >Cool stuff.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > >
    > > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > >wondering.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    > >

    >
    >
     
    George Ter-Saakov, Jun 10, 2004
    #7
  8. I would like to visit your site using IE .01 alpha. I bet it would look
    GREAT!

    LOL

    "George Ter-Saakov" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Actually it's money that counts.
    > You can have the most perfect and advanced site that is working with IE

    9.0
    > ( i know it does not exist yet) but it will be a dead site since there are
    > still thousands of user who is using IE 5.0
    >
    > Of course you can not bow to anyone who does not want to upgrade the

    system.
    > But if the percentage of the people who is using IE 5.0 is high i would

    say
    > your site must work with IE 5.0
    >
    >
    > It's matter of your marketing team (or what ever it's called) to make the
    > cutoff point (browser version).
    >
    > For my home page cutoff point is IE 6.0 since i doubt that anyone will be
    > visiting it and i have IE 6.0 ( i am trying to be sarcastic).
    >
    > George.
    >
    >
    > "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several

    years
    > > old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing to
    > > insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots

    of
    > > money and time for no real gain.
    > >
    > > See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the article

    > was
    > > written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were

    considered
    > > obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE 5?
    > > Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses

    can't
    > > render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.
    > >
    > > Colin
    > >
    > > "pmb" <> wrote in message
    > > news:p...
    > > > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    > > > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > > > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.
    > > >
    > > > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > > > <> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Cool stuff.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > > >
    > > > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > > >wondering.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    VB Programmer, Jun 10, 2004
    #8
  9. You both have good points. It really depends upon the requirements of your
    client/customer. I agree that it isn't generally fruitful to develop for
    obsolete browsers, but the customer is always right! So, I would recommend
    using CSS (and do), but if a client told me that my web app has to be
    compliant with Netscrape 4, I would have to bite the bullet and make it
    compliant with Netscrape 4.

    --
    HTH,
    Kevin Spencer
    ..Net Developer
    Microsoft MVP
    Big things are made up
    of lots of little things.

    "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several years
    > old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing to
    > insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots of
    > money and time for no real gain.
    >
    > See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the article

    was
    > written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were considered
    > obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE 5?
    > Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses can't
    > render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.
    >
    > Colin
    >
    > "pmb" <> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    > > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    > > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.
    > >
    > > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > > <> wrote:
    > >
    > > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >Cool stuff.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > >
    > > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > >wondering.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    > >

    >
    >
     
    Kevin Spencer, Jun 10, 2004
    #9
  10. VB Programmer

    Colin Young Guest

    I'd actually be inclined to walk away from the deal if they insisted on it
    looking the same in NN4. Functioning is another matter, but no amount of
    extra billable hours are worth it to me. It's lucky for those sorts of
    clients there are people like you around :)

    Colin

    "Kevin Spencer" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > You both have good points. It really depends upon the requirements of your
    > client/customer. I agree that it isn't generally fruitful to develop for
    > obsolete browsers, but the customer is always right! So, I would recommend
    > using CSS (and do), but if a client told me that my web app has to be
    > compliant with Netscrape 4, I would have to bite the bullet and make it
    > compliant with Netscrape 4.
    >
    > --
    > HTH,
    > Kevin Spencer
    > .Net Developer
    > Microsoft MVP
    > Big things are made up
    > of lots of little things.
    >
    > "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several

    years
    > > old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing to
    > > insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots

    of
    > > money and time for no real gain.
    > >
    > > See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the article

    > was
    > > written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were

    considered
    > > obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE 5?
    > > Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses

    can't
    > > render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.
    > >
    > > Colin
    > >
    > > "pmb" <> wrote in message
    > > news:p...
    > > > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    > > > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > > > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.
    > > >
    > > > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > > > <> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Cool stuff.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > > >
    > > > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > > >wondering.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    Colin Young, Jun 10, 2004
    #10
  11. VB Programmer

    Colin Young Guest

    My point is that the number of people still using IE 5 is so tiny that there
    just isn't a way to justify the effort for most sites.

    Colin

    "George Ter-Saakov" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Actually it's money that counts.
    > You can have the most perfect and advanced site that is working with IE

    9.0
    > ( i know it does not exist yet) but it will be a dead site since there are
    > still thousands of user who is using IE 5.0
    >
    > Of course you can not bow to anyone who does not want to upgrade the

    system.
    > But if the percentage of the people who is using IE 5.0 is high i would

    say
    > your site must work with IE 5.0
    >
    >
    > It's matter of your marketing team (or what ever it's called) to make the
    > cutoff point (browser version).
    >
    > For my home page cutoff point is IE 6.0 since i doubt that anyone will be
    > visiting it and i have IE 6.0 ( i am trying to be sarcastic).
    >
    > George.
    >
    >
    > "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several

    years
    > > old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing to
    > > insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots

    of
    > > money and time for no real gain.
    > >
    > > See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the article

    > was
    > > written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were

    considered
    > > obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE 5?
    > > Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses

    can't
    > > render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.
    > >
    > > Colin
    > >
    > > "pmb" <> wrote in message
    > > news:p...
    > > > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    > > > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > > > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.
    > > >
    > > > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > > > <> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Cool stuff.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > > >
    > > > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > > >wondering.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    Colin Young, Jun 10, 2004
    #11
  12. VB Programmer

    Colin Young Guest

    I don't attempt to get an exact position. Remember, the web isn't paper.
    Your design is going to get stuffed into all kinds of weird browser
    configurations. The best you can aim for is to make it readable and
    functional in all of them and look good in most of them.

    Header, footer and side bar use 4 div tags: 1 each for the header and footer
    and one for the nav (using float: left) and one for the content (also using
    float: left). Set widths as required.

    Colin

    "VB Programmer" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > So, if you wanted to do a side-bar navigation, with a header and footer,

    you
    > wouldn't uses any tables, just css? If so, how do you position it exactly
    > like you want?
    >
    > Great link btw.
    >
    > "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Yep. I only use tables for tabular data. It's made my life much easier.
    > >
    > > Another good site is http://www.alistapart.com/
    > >
    > > Colin
    > >
    > > "VB Programmer" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > > Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > > http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > Cool stuff.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > > http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > >
    > > > Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > > wondering.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    Colin Young, Jun 10, 2004
    #12
  13. VB Programmer

    George Guest

    I agree with you here
    When customer is asking me "can we make it work on any browser" my reply is always
    "depends how much money you got" :).

    George
    My Site - Body Jewelry
    "Colin Young" <> wrote in message news:...
    I'd actually be inclined to walk away from the deal if they insisted on it
    looking the same in NN4. Functioning is another matter, but no amount of
    extra billable hours are worth it to me. It's lucky for those sorts of
    clients there are people like you around :)

    Colin

    "Kevin Spencer" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > You both have good points. It really depends upon the requirements of your
    > client/customer. I agree that it isn't generally fruitful to develop for
    > obsolete browsers, but the customer is always right! So, I would recommend
    > using CSS (and do), but if a client told me that my web app has to be
    > compliant with Netscrape 4, I would have to bite the bullet and make it
    > compliant with Netscrape 4.
    >
    > --
    > HTH,
    > Kevin Spencer
    > .Net Developer
    > Microsoft MVP
    > Big things are made up
    > of lots of little things.
    >
    > "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several

    years
    > > old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing to
    > > insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots

    of
    > > money and time for no real gain.
    > >
    > > See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the article

    > was
    > > written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were

    considered
    > > obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE 5?
    > > Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses

    can't
    > > render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.
    > >
    > > Colin
    > >
    > > "pmb" <> wrote in message
    > > news:p...
    > > > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And notice
    > > > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > > > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer 5.
    > > >
    > > > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > > > <> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Cool stuff.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > > >
    > > > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts? Just
    > > > >wondering.
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    George, Jun 10, 2004
    #13
  14. VB Programmer

    George Guest

    Haha.
    Do you just saying it just to say anything?
    Is it backed up by any data?

    http://www.cen.uiuc.edu/bstats/latest.html#IEVersions
    IE 5 - 13.3% plus Netscape another 3% plus some other browsers like Mozila or OPera and
    you will get 20% of users can not properly view use your site if you designed it with CSS.

    Is it tiny? On my site it's about 400 unique people a day.
    I know some people would kill for that amount :)


    George
    My Site - Body Jewelry
    "Colin Young" <> wrote in message news:...
    My point is that the number of people still using IE 5 is so tiny that there
    just isn't a way to justify the effort for most sites.
     
    George, Jun 10, 2004
    #14
  15. Oh, believe me, Colin. I would be inclined to wlak away from such a project
    as well! However, there are times when one has to do such things.
    Fortunately, I don't encounter those situations in my work!

    --
    HTH,
    Kevin Spencer
    ..Net Developer
    Microsoft MVP
    Big things are made up
    of lots of little things.

    "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I'd actually be inclined to walk away from the deal if they insisted on it
    > looking the same in NN4. Functioning is another matter, but no amount of
    > extra billable hours are worth it to me. It's lucky for those sorts of
    > clients there are people like you around :)
    >
    > Colin
    >
    > "Kevin Spencer" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > You both have good points. It really depends upon the requirements of

    your
    > > client/customer. I agree that it isn't generally fruitful to develop for
    > > obsolete browsers, but the customer is always right! So, I would

    recommend
    > > using CSS (and do), but if a client told me that my web app has to be
    > > compliant with Netscrape 4, I would have to bite the bullet and make it
    > > compliant with Netscrape 4.
    > >
    > > --
    > > HTH,
    > > Kevin Spencer
    > > .Net Developer
    > > Microsoft MVP
    > > Big things are made up
    > > of lots of little things.
    > >
    > > "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > > And why should we be continuing to support browsers that are several

    > years
    > > > old and don't provide compliance with accepted standards? Continuing

    to
    > > > insist on support for old, outdated browsers just ends of costing lots

    > of
    > > > money and time for no real gain.
    > > >
    > > > See http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/ and note that the

    article
    > > was
    > > > written in 2001 and even back then non-compliant browsers were

    > considered
    > > > obsolete. It's now 3 years later and you're still concerned about IE

    5?
    > > > Please. Just because some brain-dead browser that hardly anyone uses

    > can't
    > > > render the page properly is no reason to call it an issue.
    > > >
    > > > Colin
    > > >
    > > > "pmb" <> wrote in message
    > > > news:p...
    > > > > And take a look at that SAME site, with different browsers! And

    notice
    > > > > the difference! The main issue with that kind of layout is that they
    > > > > are poorly rendered in old browsers, for example Internet Explorer

    5.
    > > > >
    > > > > On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 11:43:48 -0400, "VB Programmer"
    > > > > <> wrote:
    > > > >
    > > > > >Take a look at the SAME site, with different CSS style sheets:
    > > > > >http://www.csszengarden.com/
    > > > > >
    > > > > >
    > > > > >Cool stuff.
    > > > > >
    > > > > >
    > > > > >Interesting article on CSS vs Tables:
    > > > > >http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/index.html
    > > > > >
    > > > > >Are any of you using purely CSS and no tables for page layouts?

    Just
    > > > > >wondering.
    > > > > >
    > > > > >
    > > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    Kevin Spencer, Jun 11, 2004
    #15
  16. VB Programmer

    Colin Young Guest

    No, I'm not just saying it. My sites get under 5% of users using all
    browsers other than IE6, and most of that 5% are using Netscape 6. Well
    under 1% of our users use a non-compliant browser. The thing to keep in mind
    with the IE 5 stats is that on the Mac, the latest version of IE is 5, and
    it provides pretty decent standards supports (much better than IE5 on
    Windows ever did).

    If I design my site using CSS, Mozilla will actually provide better support
    than IE. Opera also provides excellent support for CSS. Text-only browsers
    will also work better with a CSS sight. If you don't believe me, I challenge
    you to install Lynx and view a site that uses tables and a site that uses
    CSS for layout.

    To justify the development effort, you need to look at what you are trying
    to do with your site. It's often a simple financial matter. If the cost to
    make the site work for the tiny percentage of users with out of date
    browsers exceeds the increase in revenue you'll get from those users, it
    isn't worth it. And, when you consider that if they haven't upgraded their
    browsers, they may be less likely to be buying or researching products on
    the internet, it's likely not worth it.

    You have to do the analysis on your own project and determine what the
    acceptable trade-offs are. Too often site specs demand down-level
    compatibility without considering the costs involved.

    Colin

    "George" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    Haha.
    Do you just saying it just to say anything?
    Is it backed up by any data?

    http://www.cen.uiuc.edu/bstats/latest.html#IEVersions
    IE 5 - 13.3% plus Netscape another 3% plus some other browsers like Mozila
    or OPera and
    you will get 20% of users can not properly view use your site if you
    designed it with CSS.

    Is it tiny? On my site it's about 400 unique people a day.
    I know some people would kill for that amount :)


    George
    My Site - Body Jewelry
    "Colin Young" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    My point is that the number of people still using IE 5 is so tiny that there
    just isn't a way to justify the effort for most sites.
     
    Colin Young, Jun 11, 2004
    #16
    1. Advertising

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