Recommend a good programming environment for beginner?

Discussion in 'Java' started by BillJosephson, Oct 18, 2006.

  1. Howdy. I'm taking a java class, and they unfortunately just have us
    using the DOS cmd liine and notepad to program. I'd like to use a good
    environment. I used to use Codewarrior. Netbeans came with the Java
    download from Sun, but it overwhelmed me, seems like I'd have to invest
    a lot in learning it. Does anybody know of a sleeker, easier to get
    used to environment?

    Alternatively, anyone know of a good, simple, easy to follow tutorial
    to get one up an running in netbeans?

    Thanks a heap....

    Bill J.
    BillJosephson, Oct 18, 2006
    #1
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  2. BillJosephson

    Danno Guest

    BillJosephson wrote:
    > Howdy. I'm taking a java class, and they unfortunately just have us
    > using the DOS cmd liine and notepad to program. I'd like to use a good
    > environment. I used to use Codewarrior. Netbeans came with the Java
    > download from Sun, but it overwhelmed me, seems like I'd have to invest
    > a lot in learning it. Does anybody know of a sleeker, easier to get
    > used to environment?
    >
    > Alternatively, anyone know of a good, simple, easy to follow tutorial
    > to get one up an running in netbeans?
    >
    > Thanks a heap....
    >
    > Bill J.


    Hell yeah Bill J! Just try Blue J: http://edu.netbeans.org/bluej/

    It's like NetBeans but without the girth. This was developed
    originally by university professors and students and is geared for
    those learning java. Give it a try. ;)

    Danno
    Danno, Oct 18, 2006
    #2
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  3. "BillJosephson" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Howdy. I'm taking a java class, and they unfortunately just have us
    > using the DOS cmd liine and notepad to program. I'd like to use a good
    > environment. I used to use Codewarrior. Netbeans came with the Java
    > download from Sun, but it overwhelmed me, seems like I'd have to invest
    > a lot in learning it. Does anybody know of a sleeker, easier to get
    > used to environment?
    >
    > Alternatively, anyone know of a good, simple, easy to follow tutorial
    > to get one up an running in netbeans?
    >
    > Thanks a heap....
    >
    > Bill J.
    >


    I can't tell from briefly glancing at your headers if you use windows or
    not.

    If you do I suggest GEL - it is the most no frills GUI environment (just be
    sure to turn off smart tabs cause they don't work)

    Sometimes it crashes - so I guess it is not perfect, but for small learner
    projects where you don't want code that you don't understand being
    autogenerated and/or hidden - it is the best out there.

    I have historically used Netbeans to make my dialogs, and then used GEL to
    implement my project. Really though, once you get the basics down (after
    about 60 hours of coding) you will want to make GUI apps and the integrated
    environments can't be beat. I actually like NetBeans when I have a
    "project" but when I have a single class/single file (usually console
    based) I use GEL all the time.

    On the other hand using the console and notepad or VI with a couple nice
    batch files is not a bad learning tool.

    --
    LTP

    :)
    Luc The Perverse, Oct 18, 2006
    #3
  4. BillJosephson

    Mark Space Guest

    > BillJosephson wrote:
    >> Alternatively, anyone know of a good, simple, easy to follow tutorial
    >> to get one up an running in netbeans?
    >>


    It might be better to stick with what the class is using, you'll be able
    to get more help from the prof and fellow students.
    Try this quick start guide:
    http://www.netbeans.org/kb/50/quickstart.html

    Then see if this tutorial is useful:
    http://www.netbeans.org/kb/50/using-netbeans/index.html

    There are more like that here:
    http://www.netbeans.org/kb/50/index.html

    Danno wrote:
    > Hell yeah Bill J! Just try Blue J: http://edu.netbeans.org/bluej/
    >
    > It's like NetBeans but without the girth. This was developed
    > originally by university professors and students and is geared for
    > those learning java. Give it a try. ;)


    As long as it's not Eclipse, it can't be all bad. ^_^ I've never tried
    this, I might check it out tho.
    Mark Space, Oct 18, 2006
    #4
  5. Danno wrote:
    > BillJosephson wrote:
    > > Howdy. I'm taking a java class, and they unfortunately just have us
    > > using the DOS cmd liine and notepad to program. I'd like to use a good
    > > environment. I used to use Codewarrior. Netbeans came with the Java
    > > download from Sun, but it overwhelmed me, seems like I'd have to invest
    > > a lot in learning it. Does anybody know of a sleeker, easier to get
    > > used to environment?
    > >
    > > Alternatively, anyone know of a good, simple, easy to follow tutorial
    > > to get one up an running in netbeans?
    > >
    > > Thanks a heap....
    > >
    > > Bill J.

    >
    > Hell yeah Bill J! Just try Blue J: http://edu.netbeans.org/bluej/
    >
    > It's like NetBeans but without the girth. This was developed
    > originally by university professors and students and is geared for
    > those learning java. Give it a try. ;)
    >
    > Danno


    Thanks much!

    Bill J.
    BillJosephson, Oct 18, 2006
    #5
  6. Thanks Mark and Luc!

    Bill J.
    BillJosephson, Oct 18, 2006
    #6
  7. BillJosephson

    IchBin Guest

    BillJosephson wrote:
    > Thanks Mark and Luc!
    >
    > Bill J.
    >


    Yes Bill, what Mark and Luc said is very good. I use GEL for quick stuff
    but now a days have been hanging around Eclipse for Java and PHP.

    Netbeans BlueJ Edition is nice if migrating up to the big boys toys
    lol... You may want to look at Just BlueJ. Since you are learning the
    language this may be the better approach. It will help you learn Java
    with a OOP and OOD orientation.

    http://www.bluej.org

    --
    Thanks in Advance... http://ichbin.9999mb.com
    IchBin, Pocono Lake, Pa, USA http://weconsultants.phpnet.us
    __________________________________________________________________________

    'If there is one, Knowledge is the "Fountain of Youth"'
    -William E. Taylor, Regular Guy (1952-)
    IchBin, Oct 18, 2006
    #7
  8. TechBookReport, Oct 18, 2006
    #8
  9. BillJosephson

    John Guest

    John, Oct 18, 2006
    #9
  10. IchBin wrote:
    > BillJosephson wrote:
    > > Thanks Mark and Luc!
    > >
    > > Bill J.
    > >

    >
    > Yes Bill, what Mark and Luc said is very good. I use GEL for quick stuff
    > but now a days have been hanging around Eclipse for Java and PHP.
    >
    > Netbeans BlueJ Edition is nice if migrating up to the big boys toys
    > lol... You may want to look at Just BlueJ. Since you are learning the
    > language this may be the better approach. It will help you learn Java
    > with a OOP and OOD orientation.
    >
    > http://www.bluej.org
    >
    > --
    > Thanks in Advance... http://ichbin.9999mb.com
    > IchBin, Pocono Lake, Pa, USA http://weconsultants.phpnet.us
    > __________________________________________________________________________
    >
    > 'If there is one, Knowledge is the "Fountain of Youth"'
    > -William E. Taylor, Regular Guy (1952-)


    Many thanks. I did try BlueJ, but it wasn't much better than NetBeans.
    It just didn't make sense to me. I'm sure if I invested a little time
    to read the docs it would, and I like the idea of taking a step towards
    netbeans, but I just didn't have time and in fact submitted my
    assignments late, 50% off.

    After an hour I gave up and tried jGRASP. It was immediately
    intuitively familiar, from other IDEs, and I got the programs written
    pronto. So I'll stick with it until such time as I have time to check
    into BlueJ a bit more.

    Thanks much...
    BillJosephson, Oct 19, 2006
    #10
  11. TechBookReport wrote:
    > BillJosephson wrote:
    > > Thanks Mark and Luc!
    > >
    > > Bill J.
    > >

    > You might also want to take a look at jCreator if you're running on
    > Windows. There's a review here that explains why:
    > http://www.techbookreport.com/tbr0173.html
    >
    > jCreator: http://www.jcreator.com/
    >
    > You might also want to look at jEdit for a pure Java solution. A review
    > here: http://www.techbookreport.com/tbr0135.html
    >
    > jEdit: http://www.jedit.org
    >
    > HTH
    >
    > --
    > TechBookReport Java http://www.techbookreport.com/JavaIndex.html



    Many thanks. Seems like lots of java tools out there. I wonder if there
    are more than C tools....seems like it....

    Thanks....
    BillJosephson, Oct 19, 2006
    #11
  12. BillJosephson

    IchBin Guest

    BillJosephson wrote:
    > IchBin wrote:
    >> BillJosephson wrote:
    >>> Thanks Mark and Luc!
    >>>
    >>> Bill J.
    >>>

    >> Yes Bill, what Mark and Luc said is very good. I use GEL for quick stuff
    >> but now a days have been hanging around Eclipse for Java and PHP.
    >>
    >> Netbeans BlueJ Edition is nice if migrating up to the big boys toys
    >> lol... You may want to look at Just BlueJ. Since you are learning the
    >> language this may be the better approach. It will help you learn Java
    >> with a OOP and OOD orientation.
    >>
    >> http://www.bluej.org
    >>
    >> --
    >> Thanks in Advance... http://ichbin.9999mb.com
    >> IchBin, Pocono Lake, Pa, USA http://weconsultants.phpnet.us
    >> __________________________________________________________________________
    >>
    >> 'If there is one, Knowledge is the "Fountain of Youth"'
    >> -William E. Taylor, Regular Guy (1952-)

    >
    > Many thanks. I did try BlueJ, but it wasn't much better than NetBeans.
    > It just didn't make sense to me. I'm sure if I invested a little time
    > to read the docs it would, and I like the idea of taking a step towards
    > netbeans, but I just didn't have time and in fact submitted my
    > assignments late, 50% off.
    >
    > After an hour I gave up and tried jGRASP. It was immediately
    > intuitively familiar, from other IDEs, and I got the programs written
    > pronto. So I'll stick with it until such time as I have time to check
    > into BlueJ a bit more.
    >
    > Thanks much...
    >


    You are right, JGRASP is more intuitive. I normally do recommend JGRASP
    but was caught up on the Netbeans thing. They are both from academia
    so you can't go wrong. JGRASP has the older IDE feel from days gone by...

    --
    Thanks in Advance... http://ichbin.9999mb.com
    IchBin, Pocono Lake, Pa, USA http://weconsultants.phpnet.us
    ______________________________________________________________
    'If there is one, Knowledge is the "Fountain of Youth"'
    -William E. Taylor, Regular Guy (1952-)
    IchBin, Oct 19, 2006
    #12
  13. BillJosephson

    crazzybugger Guest

    Dudes.........
    you are missing the point!!! netbeans is no way considered
    to be user friendly. JCreator is an excellent editor for
    beginners.........(but its windows based :( ) . Anyway Eclipse is the
    best of the best of the best . you cant beat this IDE . really once you
    get to know what is a workspace and what is a package.........you are
    on cloud 9 with eclipse....Besides it looks so much better on linux
    than netbeans !!!
    either go for JCreator or eclipse .Dont bother yourself with netbeans.
    Netbeans (i use it for just the matissa thing which rocks! )
    crazzybugger, Oct 19, 2006
    #13
  14. BillJosephson

    crazzybugger Guest

    Dudes.........
    you are missing the point!!! netbeans is no way considered
    to be user friendly. JCreator is an excellent editor for
    beginners.........(but its windows based :( ) . Anyway Eclipse is the
    best of the best of the best . you cant beat this IDE . really once you
    get to know what is a workspace and what is a package.........you are
    on cloud 9 with eclipse....Besides it looks so much better on linux
    than netbeans !!!
    either go for JCreator or eclipse .Dont bother yourself with netbeans.
    Netbeans (i use it for just the matissa thing which rocks! )
    crazzybugger, Oct 19, 2006
    #14
  15. crazzybugger wrote:
    > Dudes.........
    > you are missing the point!!! netbeans is no way considered
    > to be user friendly. JCreator is an excellent editor for
    > beginners.........(but its windows based :( ) . Anyway Eclipse is the
    > best of the best of the best . you cant beat this IDE . really once you
    > get to know what is a workspace and what is a package.........you are
    > on cloud 9 with eclipse....Besides it looks so much better on linux
    > than netbeans !!!
    > either go for JCreator or eclipse .Dont bother yourself with netbeans.
    > Netbeans (i use it for just the matissa thing which rocks! )



    What's the matissa thing?

    Does eclipse have the power of netbeans?

    Thanks, dude....
    BillJosephson, Oct 20, 2006
    #15
  16. BillJosephson

    IchBin Guest

    BillJosephson wrote:
    > crazzybugger wrote:
    >> Dudes.........
    >> you are missing the point!!! netbeans is no way considered
    >> to be user friendly. JCreator is an excellent editor for
    >> beginners.........(but its windows based :( ) . Anyway Eclipse is the
    >> best of the best of the best . you cant beat this IDE . really once you
    >> get to know what is a workspace and what is a package.........you are
    >> on cloud 9 with eclipse....Besides it looks so much better on linux
    >> than netbeans !!!
    >> either go for JCreator or eclipse .Dont bother yourself with netbeans.
    >> Netbeans (i use it for just the matissa thing which rocks! )

    >
    >
    > What's the matissa thing?
    >
    > Does eclipse have the power of netbeans?
    >
    > Thanks, dude....
    >

    Yes, its call the Visual Editor (VE) project.

    --
    Thanks in Advance... http://ichbinquotations.awardspace.com
    IchBin, Pocono Lake, Pa, USA http://weconsultants.phpnet.us
    ______________________________________________________________________
    'If there is one, Knowledge is the "Fountain of Youth"'
    -William E. Taylor, Regular Guy (1952-)
    IchBin, Oct 20, 2006
    #16
  17. BillJosephson

    crazzybugger Guest

    avoid these netbeans stereo types....... as a beginner you are better
    off with eclipse....netbeans has so many bugs (null pointer exception ,
    overflow exception ) to name a few . !
    crazzybugger, Oct 20, 2006
    #17
  18. BillJosephson wrote:
    > What's the matissa thing?


    A very nice GUI editor (aka "form" designer) for particular tasks, which
    is part of NetBeans.

    May I provide some general suggestions? Instead of listening to the
    fanboys ("the best of the best" ha, ha, ha)

    a) you accept the fact the there is no such thing as "the best" tool,
    IDE, computer language, etc.

    b) many depends on individual preferences, the task at hand, experience,
    education, requirements, etc. And, yes, even it seems many depends on
    the mental health and sanity of the user

    c) Which, as a consequence, means you, and only you can decide what is
    "the best" in your particular circumstances, with your particular
    background.

    d) In other words: Try them. Try them all, or at least try as much as
    you can get your hands on

    e) Select at least two you like best and use them. Two, or more, so you
    don't get dependent on a certain IDE. So you aren't helpless, don't look
    stupid, and don't have to whine should you have to work in an
    environment where your "best" tool is not available. So you can look
    beyond your own nose and don't have to utter nonsense like "the best of
    the best oft the ..."

    f) Learn to use the command line tools, too. For the same reason as
    above. In fact, I in general suggest to first master the command line
    tools and all the basics around them before starting with an IDE.

    > Does eclipse have the power of netbeans?


    Power? Another meaningless term in this discussion. It depends on what
    you need.

    > Thanks, dude....


    You are aware that many people here don't like to be called "dude"?

    /Thomas
    --
    The comp.lang.java.gui FAQ:
    http://gd.tuwien.ac.at/faqs/faqs-hierarchy/comp/comp.lang.java.gui/
    ftp://ftp.cs.uu.nl/pub/NEWS.ANSWERS/computer-lang/java/gui/faq
    Thomas Weidenfeller, Oct 20, 2006
    #18
  19. BillJosephson

    crazzybugger Guest


    > May I provide some general suggestions? Instead of listening to the
    > fanboys ("the best of the best" ha, ha, ha)
    >
    > a) you accept the fact the there is no such thing as "the best" tool,
    > IDE, computer language, etc.
    > b) many depends on individual preferences, the task at hand, experience,
    > education, requirements, etc. And, yes, even it seems many depends on
    > the mental health and sanity of the user
    > c) Which, as a consequence, means you, and only you can decide what is
    > "the best" in your particular circumstances, with your particular
    > background.
    >
    > d) In other words: Try them. Try them all, or at least try as much as
    > you can get your hands on



    > e) Select at least two you like best and use them. Two, or more, so you
    > don't get dependent on a certain IDE. So you aren't helpless, don't look
    > stupid, and don't have to whine should you have to work in an
    > environment where your "best" tool is not available. So you can look
    > beyond your own nose and don't have to utter nonsense like "the best of
    > the best oft the ..."



    > f) Learn to use the command line tools, too. For the same reason as
    > above. In fact, I in general suggest to first master the command line
    > tools and all the basics around them before starting with an IDE.
    >
    > > Does eclipse have the power of netbeans?

    >
    > Power? Another meaningless term in this discussion. It depends on what
    > you need.


    Each and every word of yours is right.............. I
    agree totally . As you said beginners should first know how to use the
    command line options before going for IDE. this is the suggested to the
    person who started this topic . do try out the command line option and
    then switch over.......... As you say , it avoids people from getting
    dependent on IDEs when they are not available .The command line is
    always there for you!
    crazzybugger, Oct 20, 2006
    #19
  20. BillJosephson

    crazzybugger Guest

    I was carried off with the eclipse topic ! your suggestions make more
    sense and are logical......!!! Eclipse is good though :)
    crazzybugger, Oct 20, 2006
    #20
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