Strange applet behaviour on Windows XP

Discussion in 'Java' started by Qu0ll, Nov 13, 2007.

  1. Qu0ll

    Qu0ll Guest

    I previously posted this under a thread titled "JSE 6 Update N (Build 6) on
    XP" but I have now determined it has nothing to do with Update N per se and
    affects any version of Java 6. I find that the JVM starts up very quickly
    in the browser but the applet itself takes forever to load. It gets to
    "Applet inited" and stays there for a couple of minutes and then it's a few
    more minutes after "Applet started" before anything appears. This is with
    an applet that loads almost instantaneously under Vista or Server 2003.
    This behaviour is happening in both IE and Firefox.

    Has anyone experienced anything similar or have a solution?

    --
    And loving it,

    -Q
    _________________________________________________

    (Replace the "SixFour" with numbers to email me)
     
    Qu0ll, Nov 13, 2007
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Andrew Thompson, Nov 13, 2007
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Qu0ll

    Qu0ll Guest

    "Andrew Thompson" <u32984@uwe> wrote in message news:7b2ba8b36a510@uwe...

    > Qu0ll wrote:
    > ..
    >>Has anyone experienced anything similar or have a solution?

    >
    > WEB START.


    Not you and your bloody Web Start again! :)

    Andrew, do I need to qualify every post I make with the line "JAWS is not an
    option for me - the software must run INSIDE the browser"? I know you don't
    like applets but I do and I would very much like to know why all applets are
    misbehaving on this particular machine.

    --
    And loving it,

    -Q
    _________________________________________________

    (Replace the "SixFour" with numbers to email me)
     
    Qu0ll, Nov 14, 2007
    #3
  4. Qu0ll wrote:
    >> ..
    >>>Has anyone experienced anything similar or have a solution?

    >>
    >> WEB START.

    >
    >Not you and your bloody Web Start again! :)
    >
    >Andrew, do I need to qualify every post I make with the line "JAWS is not an
    >option for me - the software must run INSIDE the browser"?


    *Yes*!

    What? You expect me to specifically remember every
    person and the constraints of any particular project they
    are working on?

    I make scores of posts, across 3 regular, and many occasional
    groups, every week.

    Besides, what if someone *else* read your problem that
    had never heard of you. If *you* have been reading this
    forum as well as asking questions using it, you might have
    noticed a thread recently starting with 'applet' where the
    first three replies were the suggestion 'web start'. I was
    only responsible for one of those replies.

    I am not the only person who sees web start as a far
    superior way to launch applets.

    All it would take in each of your applet posts (for me to
    understand) is the single line "must be embedded in a
    web page".

    >..I know you don't
    >like applets but I do and I would very much like to know why all applets are
    >misbehaving on this particular machine.


    Try searching Sun's bug database first.

    Their own search is horridly slow, but try this alternate.
    <http://www.google.com/search?as_q=applet&as_sitesearch=bugs.sun.com>

    (Make it more specific, that is just a starting point.)

    With applets "Bug happens" - regularly.

    If it is not listed, it might be time (must be 'every other
    week') to add a new one.

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    http://www.athompson.info/andrew/

    Message posted via JavaKB.com
    http://www.javakb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/java-general/200711/1
     
    Andrew Thompson, Nov 14, 2007
    #4
  5. Qu0ll

    Qu0ll Guest

    "Andrew Thompson" <u32984@uwe> wrote in message news:7b2d8b0b14624@uwe...

    > *Yes*!
    >
    > What? You expect me to specifically remember every
    > person and the constraints of any particular project they
    > are working on?
    >
    > I make scores of posts, across 3 regular, and many occasional
    > groups, every week.
    >
    > Besides, what if someone *else* read your problem that
    > had never heard of you. If *you* have been reading this
    > forum as well as asking questions using it, you might have
    > noticed a thread recently starting with 'applet' where the
    > first three replies were the suggestion 'web start'. I was
    > only responsible for one of those replies.
    >
    > I am not the only person who sees web start as a far
    > superior way to launch applets.
    >
    > All it would take in each of your applet posts (for me to
    > understand) is the single line "must be embedded in a
    > web page".
    >
    >>..I know you don't
    >>like applets but I do and I would very much like to know why all applets
    >>are
    >>misbehaving on this particular machine.

    >
    > Try searching Sun's bug database first.
    >
    > Their own search is horridly slow, but try this alternate.
    > <http://www.google.com/search?as_q=applet&as_sitesearch=bugs.sun.com>
    >
    > (Make it more specific, that is just a starting point.)
    >
    > With applets "Bug happens" - regularly.
    >
    > If it is not listed, it might be time (must be 'every other
    > week') to add a new one.


    Andrew, your point is taken; I will always indicate that Web Start is not an
    option (where relevant) when posting from now on. However, the fact that
    someone else received 3 replies to their applet-related post suggesting Web
    Start as a solution has absolutely no bearing on my situation. I saw that
    post - it wasn't relevant. I do read this group as well as ask questions.
    To me, suggesting Web Start for an applet problem is like responding to
    someone who posts with a Swing-related problem with "Have you heard of SWT?"
    or vice versa.

    --
    And loving it,

    -Q
    _________________________________________________

    (Replace the "SixFour" with numbers to email me)
     
    Qu0ll, Nov 14, 2007
    #5
  6. Qu0ll wrote:
    ...
    >To me, suggesting Web Start for an applet problem is like responding to
    >someone who posts with a Swing-related problem with "Have you heard of SWT?"
    >or vice versa.


    If SWT could fix a problem that was 'unfixable' in
    Swing I would say that myself. Are there any?

    I am more likely to point out to people that ask a question
    about *SWT*, that at least if they were asking about Swing,
    they might get some answers (see how many SWT
    threads transpire with no replies).

    The difference between 'Applet' and 'Web Start Applet'
    is much more profound though. Most of the questions
    about applets are along the lines 'how do you make
    an applet in XYZ browser do...?'. Having to account for
    the differences in the way that *browsers* interact with
    applets introduces a whole new level of problems,
    increased maintenance costs, headaches and heartaches.

    The very fact you would consider the decision between
    Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you
    have little idea just how bizarre, quixotic and problematic
    applets (in browsers) can be.

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    http://www.athompson.info/andrew/

    Message posted via JavaKB.com
    http://www.javakb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/java-general/200711/1
     
    Andrew Thompson, Nov 14, 2007
    #6
  7. Qu0ll

    Lew Guest

    Andrew Thompson wrote:
    > The very fact you would consider the decision between
    > Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you
    > have little idea just how bizarre, quixotic and problematic
    > applets (in browsers) can be.


    Not quixotic, surely. Perhaps an applet developer is quixotic, but applets
    themselves seem more like the windmill.

    --
    Lew
     
    Lew, Nov 14, 2007
    #7
  8. Lew wrote:
    >> The very fact you would consider the decision between
    >> Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you
    >> have little idea just how bizarre, quixotic and problematic
    >> applets (in browsers) can be.

    >
    >Not quixotic, surely. Perhaps an applet developer is quixotic, but applets
    >themselves seem more like the windmill.


    You are possibly correct in that applets are not Quixotic,
    though I cannot believe they are the windmill. If (water
    pumping) windmills were as problematic as applets, they'd
    have been replaced by a small dutch boy with a kite, that
    had a bucket attached to the bottom by a string.

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    http://www.athompson.info/andrew/

    Message posted via JavaKB.com
    http://www.javakb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/java-general/200711/1
     
    Andrew Thompson, Nov 14, 2007
    #8
  9. Qu0ll

    Qu0ll Guest

    "Andrew Thompson" <u32984@uwe> wrote in message news:7b304e3bfe13e@uwe...

    > The very fact you would consider the decision between
    > Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you
    > have little idea just how bizarre, quixotic and problematic
    > applets (in browsers) can be.


    Well I have encountered problems with applets and browsers but so far I see
    no real reason to abandon my quest to produce a really effective and
    powerful applet that doesn't force the user to leave the browser
    environment. Problematic they may be but I still love applets!

    --
    And loving it,

    -Q
    _________________________________________________

    (Replace the "SixFour" with numbers to email me)
     
    Qu0ll, Nov 14, 2007
    #9
  10. Qu0ll

    Lew Guest

    Andrew Thompson wrote:
    > Lew wrote:
    >>> The very fact you would consider the decision between
    >>> Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you
    >>> have little idea just how bizarre, quixotic and problematic
    >>> applets (in browsers) can be.

    >> Not quixotic, surely. Perhaps an applet developer is quixotic, but applets
    >> themselves seem more like the windmill.

    >
    > You are possibly correct in that applets are not Quixotic,
    > though I cannot believe they are the windmill. If (water
    > pumping) windmills were as problematic as applets, they'd
    > have been replaced by a small dutch boy with a kite, that
    > had a bucket attached to the bottom by a string.


    I meant "windmill" as in "that at which Don Quixote tilted".

    --
    Lew
     
    Lew, Nov 14, 2007
    #10
  11. Qu0ll

    Lew Guest

    Qu0ll wrote:
    > "Andrew Thompson" <u32984@uwe> wrote in message news:7b304e3bfe13e@uwe...
    >
    >> The very fact you would consider the decision between
    >> Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you
    >> have little idea just how bizarre, quixotic and problematic
    >> applets (in browsers) can be.

    >
    > Well I have encountered problems with applets and browsers but so far I
    > see no real reason to abandon my quest to produce a really effective and
    > powerful applet that doesn't force the user to leave the browser
    > environment. Problematic they may be but I still love applets!


    I cannot run applets at all from Firefox on my 64b Fedora system. I can run
    Web Start apps.

    Applets suck.

    --
    Lew
     
    Lew, Nov 14, 2007
    #11
  12. Lew wrote:
    >>>> The very fact you would consider the decision between
    >>>> Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you

    >[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
    >> have been replaced by a small dutch boy with a kite, that
    >> had a bucket attached to the bottom by a string.

    >
    >I meant "windmill" as in "that at which Don Quixote tilted".


    Yeah.. I always just pictured him 'tilting' at those style
    of Dutch windmills they show in postcards and old movies.
    The Dutch are the only ones I know to have used those
    style of windmills with the very low sweeping blades.

    ( I mean trying to 'tilt' at an Australian style windmill would
    be ludicrous, the stick would not even reach the height of
    the smallish fan blades at the top of their tall tower.)

    So ..I always just pictured Don doin' his stuff in
    Holland. (shugs) What, was he South American?
    Was 'he' a woman? ( I never actually read the story.. ;)

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    http://www.athompson.info/andrew/

    Message posted via http://www.javakb.com
     
    Andrew Thompson, Nov 14, 2007
    #12
  13. Qu0ll

    Nigel Wade Guest

    Lew wrote:

    > Qu0ll wrote:
    >> "Andrew Thompson" <u32984@uwe> wrote in message news:7b304e3bfe13e@uwe...
    >>
    >>> The very fact you would consider the decision between
    >>> Swing/SWT to be a logical parallel, suggests that you
    >>> have little idea just how bizarre, quixotic and problematic
    >>> applets (in browsers) can be.

    >>
    >> Well I have encountered problems with applets and browsers but so far I
    >> see no real reason to abandon my quest to produce a really effective and
    >> powerful applet that doesn't force the user to leave the browser
    >> environment. Problematic they may be but I still love applets!

    >
    > I cannot run applets at all from Firefox on my 64b Fedora system. I can run
    > Web Start apps.
    >
    > Applets suck.
    >


    That's not the fault of the applets. It's the fault of Sun due to their lack of
    support for 64bit Linux.

    The same is true of web start on other platforms.

    --
    Nigel Wade, System Administrator, Space Plasma Physics Group,
    University of Leicester, Leicester, LE1 7RH, UK
    E-mail :
    Phone : +44 (0)116 2523548, Fax : +44 (0)116 2523555
     
    Nigel Wade, Nov 14, 2007
    #13
  14. Qu0ll

    Lew Guest

    Lew wrote:
    >> I meant "windmill" as in "that at which Don Quixote tilted".


    Andrew Thompson wrote:
    > Yeah.. I always just pictured him 'tilting' at those style
    > of Dutch windmills they show in postcards and old movies.
    > The Dutch are the only ones I know to have used those
    > style of windmills with the very low sweeping blades.


    All over Europe in Renaissance times they were like that.

    > ( I mean trying to 'tilt' at an Australian style windmill would


    a.k.a. a modern windmill.

    > be ludicrous, the stick would not even reach the height of
    > the smallish fan blades at the top of their tall tower.)
    >
    > So ..I always just pictured Don doin' his stuff in


    The Don. His name wasn't "Don", that was his title.

    It's similar to "Lord" as in "Lord Byron".

    > Holland. (shugs) What, was he South American?


    Spanish, 16th c.

    > Was 'he' a woman? ( I never actually read the story.. ;)


    A knight of the old order who had pain adapting to the modern world, with the
    death of chivalry and honor.

    <http://www.gutenberg.org/browse/authors/c#a505>

    English translation:
    <http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/996>
    also EText numbers 7094, 5921, 5946 and others.

    5921 and 5946 are from an edition illustrated by Gustave Doré.

    --
    Lew
     
    Lew, Nov 14, 2007
    #14
  15. Qu0ll

    Lew Guest

    > Lew wrote:
    >> Applets suck.


    Nigel Wade wrote:
    > That's not the fault of the applets. It's the fault of Sun due to their lack of
    > support for 64bit Linux.
    >
    > The same is true of web start on other platforms.


    This is true even when I try to run applets in 32b mode. I run JWS in 32b
    mode just fine.

    The problem here is due to how Firefox relates to Fedora, not the 64b issue.

    --
    Lew
     
    Lew, Nov 14, 2007
    #15
  16. Nigel Wade wrote:
    ...
    >> Applets suck.

    >
    >That's not the fault of the applets.


    That is not really the point.

    >..It's the fault of Sun due to their lack of
    >support for 64bit Linux.


    What about ..
    - Sun's lack of support to get Java cleared for the latest XP
    security so trusted applets can again acces the local
    file-system?
    - Sun's lack of support for fixing the bug where some OS/FF
    combos. will cause a page reload on 'scroll-up'?
    - that applets take 'forever to load on' ..what was at the top
    of this thread - IE/XP?
    - ...and so on

    The real issue here, is Sun's support for applets at all.

    I think Sun now consider applets to have been a bad
    idea, and would deprecate them if they dared, but their
    lack of active support to fix the plethora of open applet
    bugs also says 'web start' to me.

    >The same is true of web start on other platforms.


    Huh? What is the 'same' with web start?

    It comes on different platforms? It is not suported
    on all platforms? It also has bugs/quirks? (I'd say
    'yes' to all three of the above. But I am not sure
    what you are refering to.)

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    http://www.athompson.info/andrew/

    Message posted via JavaKB.com
    http://www.javakb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/java-general/200711/1
     
    Andrew Thompson, Nov 14, 2007
    #16
  17. Qu0ll

    Nigel Wade Guest

    Lew wrote:

    >> Lew wrote:
    >>> Applets suck.

    >
    > Nigel Wade wrote:
    >> That's not the fault of the applets. It's the fault of Sun due to their lack

    of
    >> support for 64bit Linux.
    >>
    >> The same is true of web start on other platforms.

    >
    > This is true even when I try to run applets in 32b mode. I run JWS in 32b
    > mode just fine.
    >
    > The problem here is due to how Firefox relates to Fedora, not the 64b issue.
    >


    Really?

    I don't use Fedora, but I have two Sun servers here running 64bit RHEL4. I have
    installed 32bit Firefox (direct from Mozilla, not a RH package) and can use the
    Sun Java plugin to run applets. The first thing I do with RHEL (and Fedora when
    I used to run it) is throw away all the gcj and other non-Sun "java" which RH
    bundle. I don't mess with "alternatives", jpackage and all that nonsense as I
    don't consider there to be any alternative to the Sun Java platform.

    --
    Nigel Wade, System Administrator, Space Plasma Physics Group,
    University of Leicester, Leicester, LE1 7RH, UK
    E-mail :
    Phone : +44 (0)116 2523548, Fax : +44 (0)116 2523555
     
    Nigel Wade, Nov 14, 2007
    #17
  18. Qu0ll

    Nigel Wade Guest

    Andrew Thompson wrote:

    > Nigel Wade wrote:
    > ..
    >>> Applets suck.

    >>
    >>That's not the fault of the applets.

    >
    > That is not really the point.


    It probably is in this instance.

    >
    >>..It's the fault of Sun due to their lack of
    >>support for 64bit Linux.

    >
    > What about ..
    > - Sun's lack of support to get Java cleared for the latest XP
    > security so trusted applets can again acces the local
    > file-system?
    > - Sun's lack of support for fixing the bug where some OS/FF
    > combos. will cause a page reload on 'scroll-up'?
    > - that applets take 'forever to load on' ..what was at the top
    > of this thread - IE/XP?
    > - ...and so on


    What about them?

    That is not why the applets won't work in a 64bit web browser on Linux.

    >
    > The real issue here, is Sun's support for applets at all.


    No, the real (and only) issue *here* is why applets won't run in a 64bit
    browser.

    >
    > I think Sun now consider applets to have been a bad
    > idea, and would deprecate them if they dared, but their
    > lack of active support to fix the plethora of open applet
    > bugs also says 'web start' to me.


    But not for those users who cannot use Web Start because it's not supported on
    their platform.

    >
    >>The same is true of web start on other platforms.

    >
    > Huh? What is the 'same' with web start?


    >
    > It comes on different platforms? It is not suported
    > on all platforms? It also has bugs/quirks? (I'd say
    > 'yes' to all three of the above. But I am not sure
    > what you are refering to.)
    >


    The lack of support on different platforms. Did I mention anything else?

    --
    Nigel Wade, System Administrator, Space Plasma Physics Group,
    University of Leicester, Leicester, LE1 7RH, UK
    E-mail :
    Phone : +44 (0)116 2523548, Fax : +44 (0)116 2523555
     
    Nigel Wade, Nov 14, 2007
    #18
  19. Qu0ll

    Lew Guest

    Lew wrote:
    >> The problem here is due to how Firefox relates to Fedora, not the 64b issue.


    Nigel Wade wrote:
    > Really?


    As best I can tell. I'm actually baffled by it.

    > I don't use Fedora, but I have two Sun servers here running 64bit RHEL4. I have
    > installed 32bit Firefox (direct from Mozilla, not a RH package) and can use the
    > Sun Java plugin to run applets. The first thing I do with RHEL (and Fedora when
    > I used to run it) is throw away all the gcj and other non-Sun "java" which RH
    > bundle. I don't mess with "alternatives", jpackage and all that nonsense as I
    > don't consider there to be any alternative to the Sun Java platform.


    I use 'alternatives' because I have 32b Java, 64b Java, Java 5 and an IBM Java
    on the same machine. It also helps during upgrades that I can keep one
    version back just in case.

    I just don't know how to get Firefox to recognize the plugin. I've followed
    various HOW-TOs to no avail.

    Eh, bien, I just use Windows when I want to view applets.

    --
    Lew
     
    Lew, Nov 14, 2007
    #19
  20. Lew wrote:
    > Lew wrote:
    >>> The problem here is due to how Firefox relates to Fedora, not the 64b
    >>> issue.

    >
    > Nigel Wade wrote:
    >> Really?

    >
    > As best I can tell. I'm actually baffled by it.
    >
    >> I don't use Fedora, but I have two Sun servers here running 64bit
    >> RHEL4. I have
    >> installed 32bit Firefox (direct from Mozilla, not a RH package) and
    >> can use the
    >> Sun Java plugin to run applets. The first thing I do with RHEL (and
    >> Fedora when
    >> I used to run it) is throw away all the gcj and other non-Sun "java"
    >> which RH
    >> bundle. I don't mess with "alternatives", jpackage and all that
    >> nonsense as I
    >> don't consider there to be any alternative to the Sun Java platform.

    >
    > I use 'alternatives' because I have 32b Java, 64b Java, Java 5 and an
    > IBM Java on the same machine. It also helps during upgrades that I can
    > keep one version back just in case.
    >
    > I just don't know how to get Firefox to recognize the plugin. I've
    > followed various HOW-TOs to no avail.
    >
    > Eh, bien, I just use Windows when I want to view applets.
    >


    Lew, are you running F8? Did you do the Xinerama fix? Are you using FF
    2.0.0.9?

    If all this has been discussed please disregard this post.

    --

    Knute Johnson
    email s/nospam/knute/
     
    Knute Johnson, Nov 14, 2007
    #20
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. Chris Berg
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    477
    Chris Berg
    Oct 31, 2005
  2. Trung Chinh Nguyen
    Replies:
    5
    Views:
    468
    Trung Chinh Nguyen
    Jul 30, 2006
  3. Lukasz
    Replies:
    10
    Views:
    766
    Andrew Thompson
    Aug 11, 2006
  4. Norbert
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    352
    Norbert
    Dec 1, 2006
  5. Charles Lowe

    Strange read behaviour on windows

    Charles Lowe, Oct 16, 2006, in forum: Ruby
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    127
    Charles Lowe
    Oct 16, 2006
Loading...

Share This Page