tables it is

T

Travis Newbury

For all the conversations that have taken place in these forums, and all
the comments about tables are for tabular data only, I use them whenever
it suits my purpose or if I'm fed up with trying to get my CSS to work
in IE.

My mantra in this group for the last 7 years has been to use what ever
technology you need to produce a website that is most productive for
your needs. This can range from plain text to fancy video integrated
flash to what ever. It can be different for every website.
 
R

rf

SAZ said:
For all the conversations that have taken place in these forums, and all
the comments about tables are for tabular data only, I use them whenever
it suits my purpose or if I'm fed up with trying to get my CSS to work
in IE.

Such was not the case here. The issue was a misuse of unordered list
elements and list item elements. Did you look at the prior page? I happened
to have it still open in a browser so could save a copy:
http://barefile.com.au/test/richard/
 
S

SAZ

Such was not the case here. The issue was a misuse of unordered list
elements and list item elements. Did you look at the prior page? I happened
to have it still open in a browser so could save a copy:
http://barefile.com.au/test/richard/

I'm not talking about a specific conversation, but many table
conversations over the past 8 years I've been watching this group. I
can't count how many times "tabular data" was mentioned as the only
proper use for a table.
 
R

richard

I'm not talking about a specific conversation, but many table
conversations over the past 8 years I've been watching this group. I
can't count how many times "tabular data" was mentioned as the only
proper use for a table.

Precisely. While in the real world of paper, tables are used for tabular
data. Hence the name.
In the HTML world, tables is/are merely a tool to use for what ever reason
you need one.

As I mentioned in my post about that screwed up page, that IE got it right,
I do not believe it was the fault of the coding. More than that it is the
fault of the browser and how it interprets the code.

In the early stages of the internet, what else was there? I too am totally
sick and tired of hearing that tables are for tabular data.
 
R

richard

Such was not the case here. The issue was a misuse of unordered list
elements and list item elements. Did you look at the prior page? I happened
to have it still open in a browser so could save a copy:
http://barefile.com.au/test/richard/

Had you used IE you would have seen it properly.
Now I'm going to have to get my attorney Ornery Taiters to work and sue
your ass off for intellectual theft, you dirty scoundrel you.
 
J

Jonathan N. Little

rf said:
Such was not the case here. The issue was a misuse of unordered list
elements and list item elements. Did you look at the prior page? I happened
to have it still open in a browser so could save a copy:
http://barefile.com.au/test/richard/

Exactly! Just to show that it is possible, confined outer DIV to force
the wrap...


<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd">
<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta http-equiv="content-language" content="en-us">
<title>template</title>

<style type="text/css">
div.questionaire {
padding: 1em; width: 20em; background: #eee; border: 1px solid #000;
}
div.questionaire ul {
list-style: none; margin: 1em; padding: 0;
}
div.questionaire input {
width: 2em; margin-left: -3em; margin-right: .75em;
}

div.questionaire li {
margin: 0 0 1em 3em; padding: .25em; border: 1px solid red;
background: #ffd;
}

</style>

</head>
<body>
<form>
<div class="questionaire">
<p>Who is an amateur operator as defined in Part 97?</p>
<ul>
<li><input name="pick" value="A" type="submit"> A person named in an
amateur operator/primary license grant in the FCC ULS database</li>
<li><input name="pick" value="B" type="submit"> A person who has passed
a written license examination.</li>
<li><input name="pick" value="C" type="submit"> The person named on the
FCC Form 605 application</li>
<li><input name="pick" value="D" type="submit"> A person holding a
Resticted Operating Permit</li>
</ul>
</div>
</form>
</body>
</html>
 
R

rf

richard said:
Had you used IE you would have seen it properly.

Only because of your errors. You are running the browsers in quirks mode,
which everybody else knows is not the thing to do. With quirks mode IE
carefully reproduces all the bugs back to release 5. The fact that you saw
something that looked slightly like you might have wanted it to look is
merely the serendipitous side effect of a known set of bugs. Do you really
want to base all your future coding efforts on the side effect of known
bugs?

When I put in a valid doctype that triggers standards mode IE does the right
thing and displays the page almost exactly as FF does, because from what you
have told the browsers that is how it *should* look. Have another look at
the above URL. Using IE.
Now I'm going to have to get my attorney Ornery Taiters to work and sue
your ass off for intellectual theft, you dirty scoundrel you.

ROFL.

To be sued for intellectual theft I would have had to have stolen something
of intellectual worth.

You are still missing a form element and those buttons still should be radio
buttons and not submit buttons. And your name/value pairs are duplicated in
each section. Just anticipating your next set of questions :)
 
R

richard

Exactly! Just to show that it is possible, confined outer DIV to force
the wrap...

Most interesting. thanks.
I did find out though that one reason why it wasn't working as expected is
because I had "display:inline" in the css. It is a tad better to use
"float:left" instead, which allows the use of width.
And firefox 3.5 seems to like that.

Any particular reason for placing the whole thing in a form tag?
 
R

rf

richard said:
Most interesting. thanks.
I did find out though that one reason why it wasn't working as expected is
because I had "display:inline" in the css. It is a tad better to use
"float:left" instead, which allows the use of width.
And firefox 3.5 seems to like that.

Any particular reason for placing the whole thing in a form tag?

How else is anything going to get submitted to your server?
 
R

richard

How else is anything going to get submitted to your server?

I understand the form and submission. I am questioning the placement.
At this point, I am only assuming that by doing so, this acts as a "catch
all" thing so that which ever button is clicked, that is the value to be
passed correct? Instead of each button being a seperate form.
 
D

dorayme

richard said:
In the HTML world, tables is/are merely a tool to use for what ever reason
you need one.

I would say "are" but also I would say they are not.
 
R

rf

richard said:
I understand the form and submission.

But you also need to consider what happens at the server end, that is how
your PHP code is structured.
I am questioning the placement.
At this point, I am only assuming that by doing so, this acts as a "catch
all" thing so that which ever button is clicked, that is the value to be
passed correct? Instead of each button being a seperate form.

You *could* have a seperate for for each button.

Sometimes I have several forms on the page. It makes the server side code
(PHP) a little simpler in many cases as each form can point to a different
PHP file and that form handler only has to worry about the input fields on
that particular form.

Also the fields on the other forms don't need to be transmitted. Note,
however, that any changes made to the input fields on one form will be
discarded if another form is submitted. This will become apparent if you
ever decide to make those buttons radio buttons. Then you *will* need
exactly one form, to submit all the radio buttons.

In your case you have only a bunch of submit buttons and only one of them
will ever be succesful and they are probably all handled by the same PHP
process, so one form is indicated for the entire page.
 
J

Jan C. Faerber

why can't php do the same thing?
User has JS off. Code won't work.
Can't turn off php so easily.

Yeah - only you need the code to modulate <table>s into
<style type="text/css">...
php will be better - it's true!
 

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