Truth Seeker

Discussion in 'Java' started by Happy Man, Mar 11, 2007.

  1. Happy Man

    Happy Man Guest

    Truth Seeker

    http://www.thisistruth.org/truth.php?f=TruthSeeker


    No one is compelled to accept the truth, but it is certainly a shame
    upon the human intellect when a man is not even interested in
    findingout what the truth is!


    Islam teaches that our Creator has given human beings the faculty of
    reason. Therefore, it is incumbent upon them to reason things out
    objectively and systematically for themselves to ponder, to question
    and to reflect.


    Nobody should press you to make a hasty decision to accept any of the
    teachings of Islam, for Islam teaches that human beings should be
    given the freedom to choose. Even when a person is faced with the
    truth, there is no compulsion upon him to embrace it.


    But before you begin to form an opinion about Islam, ask yourself
    whether your existing knowledge about it is thorough enough. Ask
    yourself whether that knowledge has been obtained through third party
    sources who themselves have probably been exposed to only random
    glimpses of Islamic writings and have yet to reason out on Islam
    objectively and systematically themselves.


    Is it fair enough that one should form an opinion about the taste of
    a
    particular dish just by a mere hearsay from others who may themselves
    have not necessarily tasted the dish yet?


    Similarly you should find out for yourself about Islam from reliable
    sources and not only taste it, but rather digest it very well before
    you form an opinion of it. That would be an intellectual approach to
    the truth.


    In making your next move to the truth, Islam continually reassures
    you
    that your rights to freedom of choice and freedom to use that God-
    given faculty of thought and reason will be respected, for everyone
    has that individual will. No one else can take away that will and
    force you to submit to the true way of your Creator, you have to find
    out and make that decision yourself!


    May your intellectual journey towards the truth be a pleasant and
    fruitful one... Amen
     
    Happy Man, Mar 11, 2007
    #1
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  2. Happy Man

    Lew Guest

    Happy Man wrote:
    > Truth Seeker


    Proselytizer:
    ,,,
    > May your intellectual journey towards the truth be a pleasant and
    > fruitful one... Amen


    May your proselytizing not appear in Java newsgroups.

    If you have something to say relevant to the newsgroup, post it. If not, keep
    your multiposted spam to yourself. You're just about as annoying as a Christian.

    A-frickin-men.

    -- Lew
     
    Lew, Mar 11, 2007
    #2
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  3. Lew wrote:
    > Happy Man wrote:
    >> Truth Seeker

    >
    > Proselytizer:
    > ,,,
    >> May your intellectual journey towards the truth be a pleasant and
    >> fruitful one... Amen

    >
    > May your proselytizing not appear in Java newsgroups.
    >
    > If you have something to say relevant to the newsgroup, post it. If not,
    > keep your multiposted spam to yourself. You're just about as annoying as
    > a Christian.
    >
    > A-frickin-men.
    >
    > -- Lew


    And you are as annoying as someone who hates Christians. Being the bigot
    you are I presume you think 1 instance of something is representative of
    the group as a whole. That's a sad way to live your life.
     
    Brandon McCombs, Mar 11, 2007
    #3
  4. Happy Man

    Lew Guest

    Brandon McCombs wrote:
    > And you are as annoying as someone who hates Christians. Being the bigot
    > you are I presume you think 1 instance of something is representative of
    > the group as a whole. That's a sad way to live your life.


    You sure have a lot of judgments to make. I love Christians, many of them,
    just so you know. You know nothing about me to make your haughty
    pronouncements about my character.

    "Judgment is mine, saith the Lord."

    "By their works shall ye know them."

    -- Lew
     
    Lew, Mar 11, 2007
    #4
  5. Lew <> wrote:
    > You know nothing about me to make your haughty
    > pronouncements about my character.
    > "By their works shall ye know them."


    Some of your work was this phrase:
    "You're just about as annoying as a *whoever*."
    written to a spammer. This implies that you consider
    *whoever* to be (per se) more annoying than spammers.
    If this isn't an insult against *whoever*, then what is?

    So, you *were* known from some of your works.

    I guess, you meant it such that it would be an ultimate
    insult for the spammer in the spammer's mindset.
    Always be aware, that comparing two entities might turn
    out to be an insult thrown at both. From what I've
    read from you in the past, it would really surprise me
    if that was your intention.
     
    Andreas Leitgeb, Mar 12, 2007
    #5
  6. Happy Man

    Lew Guest

    Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
    > Lew <> wrote:
    >> You know nothing about me to make your haughty
    >> pronouncements about my character.
    >> "By their works shall ye know them."

    >
    > Some of your work was this phrase:
    > "You're just about as annoying as a *whoever*."
    > written to a spammer. This implies that you consider
    > *whoever* to be (per se) more annoying than spammers.
    > If this isn't an insult against *whoever*, then what is?
    >
    > So, you *were* known from some of your works.
    >
    > I guess, you meant it such that it would be an ultimate
    > insult for the spammer in the spammer's mindset.
    > Always be aware, that comparing two entities might turn
    > out to be an insult thrown at both. From what I've
    > read from you in the past, it would really surprise me
    > if that was your intention.


    I love lots of people that I find annoying, myself included.

    Sure, call me to account for calling Christians "annoying" (and I really mean
    only those who insist on pitching their beliefs to me - which my own mother
    does to me, and it annoys me, but I love my mother). It is mindless
    proselytizing and narrow intolerance that get to me, and those are human
    failings that many religions give free rein, nay, nurture. So, yes, many
    Christian sects encourage their flock of sheep to be proselytizers and
    judgmental, as do many sects of other religions. It is that behavior that is
    annoying.

    Is anyone going to try to claim that there are /not/ so-called "Christians"
    running around trying to push their beliefs on the rest? It is those to whom I
    referred, and yes, I apologize to all the non-proselytizing, non-judgmental,
    non-annoying followers of Christ who may have felt included in my contempt.
    But don't try to disingenuously claim that that behavior is not extant, nor
    that it is untypical of many "Christian" sects.

    To leap from my statement to "you bigot" and the other judgments is not only
    unsupported, it violates the very precepts Jesus taught. That is exactly the
    sort of hypocrisy that so many fundamentalists of many religions evince, and
    yes, it is bloody, frickin /annoying/! (A very gentle term, really, for
    hypocrisy.)

    But only wear that shoe if it fits, people. And "judge not lest ye be judged."

    Quite frankly, Happy Man shows much more Christ-like gentleness and sincerity
    than most Christians do, or the first responder to my post on this thread did.

    -- Lew
     
    Lew, Mar 12, 2007
    #6
  7. Lew <> wrote:
    > Sure, call me to account for calling Christians "annoying" (and I really mean
    > only those who insist on pitching their beliefs to me - which my own mother
    > does to me, and it annoys me, but I love my mother).


    As you perhaps noticed, I made my point substituting "Christians"
    with "*whoever*", so it wasn't about how christians really are, but
    how un-nice it was of you to idly throw insults at a group, of which
    only a (relatively) very small number of individuals might actually
    deserve it.

    If *all* Christians were like that, you wouldn't get to write this,
    because every five seconds, one of them would ring your doorbell :)
    (Neither would I get to comment on it for just the same reason)
     
    Andreas Leitgeb, Mar 13, 2007
    #7
  8. Happy Man

    Lew Guest

    Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
    > Lew <> wrote:
    >> Sure, call me to account for calling Christians "annoying" (and I really mean
    >> only those who insist on pitching their beliefs to me - which my own mother
    >> does to me, and it annoys me, but I love my mother).

    >
    > As you perhaps noticed, I made my point substituting "Christians"
    > with "*whoever*", so it wasn't about how christians really are, but
    > how un-nice it was of you to idly throw insults at a group, of which
    > only a (relatively) very small number of individuals might actually
    > deserve it.
    > If *all* Christians were like that, you wouldn't get to write this,
    > because every five seconds, one of them would ring your doorbell :)
    > (Neither would I get to comment on it for just the same reason)


    All right. Point taken. I should have said that the proselytizing was as
    annoying as most Christians'.

    Who are only reacting to an institutionalized policy of proselytization into
    which they are indoctrinated as a regular part of their dogma.

    And for which behavior Christian sects are infamous.

    But I never made the claim that it applied to all Christians; you added that,
    not me.

    These observations do not apply to "whomever" but specifically to Christian
    sects. I reject the substitution of "whomever" since my comment was specific
    to Christianity (as an organized religion).

    I reject the accusation of bigotry because the comment was based on experience
    and observation, and because I do not apply it to all followers of Christ.

    I accept the criticism for making my comment too general.

    Maybe if my doorbell had not been rung, or my person accosted, so often by
    these annoying proselytes I would have had no cause for complaint. I cannot
    tell you how many times I have been asked if I have "accepted the Lord Jesus
    Christ as my personal savior". Maybe it's because I have lived in urban areas
    that I got more overwhelmed by this than you have been.

    It is an observed fact that Christian sects encourage their membership to
    proselytize, and that many of their followers do so. I cannot believe you seek
    to imply otherwise. This behavior exists, and it annoys me.

    I never claimed it was universal. That is a calumny perpetrated by those whose
    feelings were tromped by my accusation. I claimed that Christians engage in
    this behavior, not that all Christians do. I stand by that claim. Furthermore,
    I claim that it is a distinguishing feature of Christianity, historically and
    contemporaneously, to proselytize. It is an inherent part of the dogma (mental
    oppression) perpetrated by many Christian sects. It is anything but bigotry;
    it is a grounded assessment supportable by objective evidence.

    So stop disingenuously pretending it isn't so.

    If other Christians feel upset by this, then encourage the ones who give you a
    bad name to stop their annoying behavior.

    -- Lew
     
    Lew, Mar 13, 2007
    #8
  9. Happy Man

    Lew Guest

    Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
    > As you perhaps noticed, I made my point substituting "Christians"
    > with "*whoever*", so it wasn't about how christians really are, but
    > how un-nice it was of you to idly throw insults at a group, of which
    > only a (relatively) very small number of individuals might actually
    > deserve it.


    It's nearly universal amongst those sects that proselytize. Anyone who puts
    money in the collection plate for a church that sports missionaries is
    culpable. That is not a relatively "very small" number but nearly everyone in
    those sects.

    Proselytization by proxy is still proselytization. So you pay someone else to
    accost me and don't do it personally? How does that excuse you?

    -- Lew
     
    Lew, Mar 13, 2007
    #9
  10. Lew <> wrote:
    > I accept the criticism for making my comment too general.

    ok, then let's end it here, and continue talking about Java.
     
    Andreas Leitgeb, Mar 13, 2007
    #10
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