Web developer survey. (Research project concern with Web Standards.)

Discussion in 'HTML' started by David Wilding, Apr 1, 2004.

  1. Hi

    I am a student of Leeds Metropolitan University (West Yorkshire,
    England) conducting a research project concerned with 'Web Standards'.
    As part of my primary research I am conducting a survey aimed at
    professional web developers/designers based in either the UK or the
    USA.

    The questionnaire is 10 questions in length.
    It will take approximately 3 minutes to complete.
    No previous knowledge of 'Web Standards' is required.
    The questionnaire is completely anonymous.

    The questionnaire can be found at:
    http://www.davewilding.co.uk/qindex.asp

    The results of the completed study will be available on-line at
    http://www.davewilding.co.uk in a couple of months.
    Your participation would be greatly appreciated!

    Thanks in advance.
    Dave Wilding

    Comments, questions or queries:
     
    David Wilding, Apr 1, 2004
    #1
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  2. David Wilding wrote:

    > The questionnaire can be found at:
    > http://www.davewilding.co.uk/qindex.asp


    Question 5

    The Web Standards Project states that: “most of the Web (is) a
    Balkanized mess of non—valid mark-up, unstructured documents yoked to
    outdated presentational hacks, and incompatible code fragments that
    leave many millions of web users frustrated and disenfranchised."


    I selected "Disagree"

    Whilst I agree that "most of the Web (is) a Balkanized mess of non—valid
    mark-up, unstructured documents yoked to outdated presentational hacks,
    and incompatible code fragments"

    I do not agree

    "that leave many millions of web users frustrated and disenfranchised."

    Most people don't notice or don't care. Most sites that are badly coded
    are designed for IE in which it works fine. And since 9x% of people use
    IE, they dont notice the effects.
     
    Weyoun the gowd damn Dominion Vorta who certainly , Apr 1, 2004
    #2
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  3. Weyoun the gowd damn Dominion Vorta who certainly didn't dance wrote:

    > I do not agree
    >
    > "that leave many millions of web users frustrated and disenfranchised."
    >
    > Most people don't notice or don't care. Most sites that are badly coded
    > are designed for IE in which it works fine. And since 9x% of people use
    > IE, they dont notice the effects.


    Say 90% of people use IE/win (which I think is an over-estimate
    personally). That means that 10% don't.

    Say that there are 500 million web users out there (which is probably an
    under-estimate). Then there are about 50 million people out there who
    don't use IE/win.

    Say 25% of *those* people run into a site that is so badly broken that it
    *requires* IE/win (also probably an under-estimate). Then this justifies
    the statement:

    "that leave many millions of web users frustrated and disenfranchised."

    --
    Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
    Contact Me - http://www.goddamn.co.uk/tobyink/?page=132
     
    Toby A Inkster, Apr 2, 2004
    #3
  4. David Wilding

    Whitecrest Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > Say 90% of people use IE/win (which I think is an over-estimate
    > personally). That means that 10% don't....


    The flaw in that argument is that you are making the assumption that a
    page that works in IE does not work in anything else. Well that is
    untrue. Working in IE, and working in any other browser are not
    mutually exclusive. It is a design issue.

    In a perfect world you are correct, you need to design for the
    standards, but this is far from a perfect world. You should design for
    reality, and the reality is that about 90% of the people that come to
    your site will be using IE. So above all else, good code, bad code, it
    makes no difference, but it had better work right in IE EVEN if that is
    at the expense of the other 10%

    --
    Whitecrest Entertainment
    www.whitecrestent.com
     
    Whitecrest, Apr 2, 2004
    #4
  5. Whitecrest wrote:

    > In article <>,
    > says...
    >
    >> Say 90% of people use IE/win (which I think is an over-estimate
    >> personally). That means that 10% don't....

    >
    > The flaw in that argument is that you are making the assumption that a
    > page that works in IE does not work in anything else.


    Didn't you read the third paragraph of my post? I allowed for 75% of those
    people using non-IE browsers to blissfully continue using the web without
    running into any major obstacles.

    --
    Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
    Contact Me - http://www.goddamn.co.uk/tobyink/?page=132
     
    Toby A Inkster, Apr 2, 2004
    #5
  6. David Wilding

    Ben Measures Guest

    Whitecrest wrote:
    > In a perfect world you are correct, you need to design for the
    > standards, but this is far from a perfect world. You should design for
    > reality, and the reality is that about 90% of the people that come to
    > your site will be using IE. So above all else, good code, bad code, it
    > makes no difference, but it had better work right in IE EVEN if that is
    > at the expense of the other 10%


    I do hope you're saying,
    "code to the standards, yeah, but _make sure_ that it works right in IE,
    the most used browser, and forget about making other broken browsers work"

    and *not*,
    "forget the standards, make it look nice in IE, nevermind about other
    browsers"
    which seems to be your implication.

    If you code it to the standards as set out in w3.org, you can be assured
    of it looking respectable for future browsers. After all, you can't
    predict what the next generation IE will support, other than assuming
    general w3 compliance. It's hard enough making IE 5.x and IE 6.x display
    the same without trying to second-guess what IE 7.x will look like
    (if/when it ever comes out).

    --
    Ben Measures
    Software programming, Internet design/programming, Gaming freak.

    http://ben.measures.org.uk - when I find time
     
    Ben Measures, Apr 3, 2004
    #6
  7. David Wilding

    Whitecrest Guest

    In article <gtBbc.15354$>,
    says...
    > I do hope you're saying,
    > "code to the standards, yeah, but _make sure_ that it works right in IE,
    > the most used browser, and forget about making other broken browsers work"


    Shoot for the standards, but make sure it works in IE.

    > If you code it to the standards as set out in w3.org, you can be assured
    > of it looking respectable for future browsers.


    Code for what is, not what might be.
    --
    Whitecrest Entertainment
    www.whitecrestent.com
     
    Whitecrest, Apr 3, 2004
    #7
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