What is a good visual java enviroment?

[Thomas Magma]

I'm shopping around for a good visual Java environment and need some advice
on what is a good choice. I have been programming Java (from scratch) for
the past 8 years but I might have some projects coming up that could benefit
from a visual editor. Applets and/or applications. I've heard good things
about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe. It looks like Microsoft no longer supports
J++ and wants you to port over to something called J# for the .Net
framework. J# I've heard it is only "Java like". I don't want to program in
anything that has been labeled "Java like". So I logged on to the Symantec
site to have a look at Visual Cafe, but can't even find it listed as one of
their products. Do they still make Visual Cafe or is their website just
poorly designed?

Any help or opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Thomas

 

[Larry]

I'm shopping around for a good visual Java environment and need some advice
on what is a good choice. I have been programming Java (from scratch) for
the past 8 years but I might have some projects coming up that could benefit
from a visual editor. Applets and/or applications. I've heard good things
about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe. It looks like Microsoft no longer supports
J++ and wants you to port over to something called J# for the .Net
framework. J# I've heard it is only "Java like". I don't want to program in
anything that has been labeled "Java like". So I logged on to the Symantec
site to have a look at Visual Cafe, but can't even find it listed as one of
their products. Do they still make Visual Cafe or is their website just
poorly designed?

Any help or opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Thomas

Try the Eclipse IDE. It's open source (free to use): eclipse.org

 

[Jean-Francois Briere]

Google on those:

Eclipse
NetBeans
IntelliJ IDEA

Regards

 

[Rhino]

I'm shopping around for a good visual Java environment and need some
advice on what is a good choice. I have been programming Java (from
scratch) for the past 8 years but I might have some projects coming up
that could benefit from a visual editor. Applets and/or applications. I've
heard good things about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe. It looks like
Microsoft no longer supports J++ and wants you to port over to something
called J# for the .Net framework. J# I've heard it is only "Java like". I
don't want to program in anything that has been labeled "Java like". So I
logged on to the Symantec site to have a look at Visual Cafe, but can't
even find it listed as one of their products. Do they still make Visual
Cafe or is their website just poorly designed?

Any help or opinions will be greatly appreciated.

I like Eclipse. You can find it at http://eclipse.org.

I used Visual Age Java 3.0 years back and found it usable but it was always
rather far behind in terms of supporting new versions of the JDK. When the
rest of the world was using Java 1.3, they were still only supporting Java
1.1.x.

I used JBuilder6 on a project three years ago and also found it fairly
usable. I don't remember any nasty problems with it but I think it was
fairly expensive, several hundred dollars a copy for the edition we had.

Overall though, I would strongly recommend Eclipse. The product is quite
mature, is full of features, can be extended fairly easily, has many plugins
available to do specialized tasks, and has a very extensive set of
newsgroups for support. On top of that, the price is right - free!

Another IDE that I've seen recommended by many people is NetBeans, which is
also free. (It can even be downloaded with Java 1.5.0_06 if you like.) I've
never used NetBeans though so I have no idea if I'd like it, let alone if
_you_ would!

Rhino

 

[Malte Christensen]

I'm shopping around for a good visual Java environment and need some advice
on what is a good choice. I have been programming Java (from scratch) for
the past 8 years but I might have some projects coming up that could benefit
from a visual editor. Applets and/or applications. I've heard good things
about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe. It looks like Microsoft no longer supports
J++ and wants you to port over to something called J# for the .Net
framework. J# I've heard it is only "Java like". I don't want to program in
anything that has been labeled "Java like". So I logged on to the Symantec
site to have a look at Visual Cafe, but can't even find it listed as one of
their products. Do they still make Visual Cafe or is their website just
poorly designed?

Any help or opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Thomas

Oracle JDeveloper (otn.oracle.com) is free

Cheers,

Malte

www.nmalte.dk

 

[Roedy Green]

I've heard good things
about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe.

These are long ago dead. See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/ide.html

 

[Tim Terry]

I'm shopping around for a good visual Java environment and need some advice
on what is a good choice. I have been programming Java (from scratch) for
the past 8 years but I might have some projects coming up that could benefit
from a visual editor. Applets and/or applications. I've heard good things
about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe. It looks like Microsoft no longer supports
J++ and wants you to port over to something called J# for the .Net
framework. J# I've heard it is only "Java like". I don't want to program in
anything that has been labeled "Java like". So I logged on to the Symantec
site to have a look at Visual Cafe, but can't even find it listed as one of
their products. Do they still make Visual Cafe or is their website just
poorly designed?

Any help or opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Thomas

just shop around, try all that you google for and pick the one you like.

Tim

 

[Luc The Perverse]

I like Eclipse. You can find it at http://eclipse.org.

I like Gel http://www.gexperts.com/ because it is simple, compact, no frills
and starts up fast

 

[Thomas Magma]

I think I'll try the Eclipse Visual Editor. Looks like it's gaining
strength and might even be around tomorrow. Unless someone has anything bad
to say about it.

Thanks for the pointers.

Thomas

 

[David Segall]

I'm shopping around for a good visual Java environment and need some advice
on what is a good choice. I have been programming Java (from scratch) for
the past 8 years but I might have some projects coming up that could benefit
from a visual editor. Applets and/or applications. I've heard good things
about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe. It looks like Microsoft no longer supports
J++ and wants you to port over to something called J# for the .Net
framework. J# I've heard it is only "Java like". I don't want to program in
anything that has been labeled "Java like". So I logged on to the Symantec
site to have a look at Visual Cafe, but can't even find it listed as one of
their products. Do they still make Visual Cafe or is their website just
poorly designed?

Any help or opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Thomas

I have posted what I believe to be a complete list of Java IDE's that
include a visual editor here:
<http://profectus.com.au/ee_JavaIDE.html>. Netbeans seems to have
stolen the lead in visual editing with Matisse
<http://www.netbeans.org/kb/articles/matisse.html> which is included
in the 2nd Beta of NetBeans 5.

 

[Chris Uppal]

I think I'll try the Eclipse Visual Editor. Looks like it's gaining
strength and might even be around tomorrow. Unless someone has anything
bad to say about it.

I find it very badly designed. Cluttered, confusing, counter-intuitive, and --
what's perhaps worst of all -- underpowered. it has /lots/ of bells and
whistles, but almost no fundamentally good design. Tinsel piled on tinsel.

But don't let that put you off. For one thing, it is nevertheless the IDE I
usually use myself. For another thing many people /do/ like it (possibly
because they have never used a good IDE). My point is only that if you try it
and find it as irritating as I do, then you shouldn't blame yourself, and also
shouldn't assume that there is necessarily anything better out there[*].

([*] I have heard good things said about both IntelliJ and the Oracle IDE. I
tried IntelliJ for a few hours, and at least it does seem to have been
/designed/ rather than /assembled/, but beyond that I can't comment on either
of them.)

-- chris

 

[David Segall]

I think I'll try the Eclipse Visual Editor. Looks like it's gaining
strength and might even be around tomorrow. Unless someone has anything
bad to say about it.

I find it very badly designed. Cluttered, confusing, counter-intuitive, and --
what's perhaps worst of all -- underpowered. it has /lots/ of bells and
whistles, but almost no fundamentally good design. Tinsel piled on tinsel.

But don't let that put you off. For one thing, it is nevertheless the IDE I
usually use myself. For another thing many people /do/ like it (possibly
because they have never used a good IDE). My point is only that if you try it
and find it as irritating as I do, then you shouldn't blame yourself, and also
shouldn't assume that there is necessarily anything better out there[*].

Of course you should assume there is something better out there! One
of the greatest advantages of programming in Java is the rich choice
of tools. If you are not comfortable with one, why not try another?

([*] I have heard good things said about both IntelliJ and the Oracle IDE. I
tried IntelliJ for a few hours, and at least it does seem to have been
/designed/ rather than /assembled/, but beyond that I can't comment on either
of them.)

Oh! So there is something better out there?

 

[Chris Uppal]

David Segall wrote:

[me:]

My point is only
that if you try it and find it as irritating as I do, then you
shouldn't blame yourself, and also shouldn't assume that there is
necessarily anything better out there[*].

Of course you should assume there is something better out there! One
of the greatest advantages of programming in Java is the rich choice
of tools.

You are clearly an optimist ;-)

Actually, all I said or meant was that the OP shouldn't /assume/ that there
would be something better. There might be, there might not. It would be a
waste of time to keep trying /everything/ that came along in the hope that
someday something good would turn up. Learned helplessness can be a useful
tactic if it allows you to concentrate on making best use of the tools
available (however crap they may be).

([*] I have heard good things said about both IntelliJ and the Oracle
IDE. I tried IntelliJ for a few hours, and at least it does seem to
have been /designed/ rather than /assembled/, but beyond that I can't
comment on either of them.)

Oh! So there is something better out there?

Not to /my/ knowledge, no (hearsay isn't knowledge). But then -- as I said --
my knowledge isn't complete...

-- chris

 

[gevatron]

If you are looking for a tool that will let you build Applets and
Applications visually with a good visual editor and a good code editor
have a look at the Free Oracle JDeveloper:
http://otn.oracle.com/jdev

You can see a demo of the development experience for Swing applications
here:
www.oracle.com/technology/products/jdev/tips/muench/screencasts/simplejgoodies/binding_demo.html?_template=/ocom/ocom_item_templates/print

 

[David Segall]

David Segall wrote:

[me:]

My point is only
that if you try it and find it as irritating as I do, then you
shouldn't blame yourself, and also shouldn't assume that there is
necessarily anything better out there[*].

Of course you should assume there is something better out there! One
of the greatest advantages of programming in Java is the rich choice
of tools.

You are clearly an optimist ;-)

Actually, all I said or meant was that the OP shouldn't /assume/ that there
would be something better. There might be, there might not. It would be a
waste of time to keep trying /everything/ that came along in the hope that
someday something good would turn up. Learned helplessness can be a useful
tactic if it allows you to concentrate on making best use of the tools
available (however crap they may be).

([*] I have heard good things said about both IntelliJ and the Oracle
IDE. I tried IntelliJ for a few hours, and at least it does seem to
have been /designed/ rather than /assembled/, but beyond that I can't
comment on either of them.)

Oh! So there is something better out there?

Not to /my/ knowledge, no (hearsay isn't knowledge). But then -- as I said --
my knowledge isn't complete...

I think your impression of "designed" rather than "assembled"
indicates it really was better if only for you. However, I agree that
someone could waste a lot of time searching for the ideal development
environment, IDE or otherwise. My "optimism" is based on my experience
with NetBeans 5 Beta 2. It continues to impress me by knowing
considerably more about Java and related technologies than I do. It
intervenes in a most helpful way to correct my code. Of course, this
could confuse a beginner or irritate an expert; hence my advice to
keep looking for a "suitable" development environment.

 

[shotwave]

I'm shopping around for a good visual Java environment and need some advice
on what is a good choice. I have been programming Java (from scratch) for
the past 8 years but I might have some projects coming up that could benefit
from a visual editor. Applets and/or applications. I've heard good things
about Visual J++ and Visual Cafe. It looks like Microsoft no longer supports
J++ and wants you to port over to something called J# for the .Net
framework. J# I've heard it is only "Java like". I don't want to program in
anything that has been labeled "Java like". So I logged on to the Symantec
site to have a look at Visual Cafe, but can't even find it listed as one of
their products. Do they still make Visual Cafe or is their website just
poorly designed?

Any help or opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Thomas

I prefer <a href="http://www.jetbrains.com/idea/">IntelliJ IDEA</a>. It
has convenient interface, powerful refactoring actions and wide
community that developing plugins for the tool. IDEA is often compared
to Eclipse, however I thnik that it is much more stable and
user=friendly than the last one.