what's wrong with REBOL?

Discussion in 'Ruby' started by Mike Henley, Sep 2, 2003.

  1. Mike Henley

    Mike Henley Guest

    I first came across rebol a while ago; it seemed interesting but then
    i was put off by its proprietary nature, although the core of the
    language is a free download.

    Recently however, i can't help but say i was totally impressed. I
    needed an open source wikiblog/wikilog, whatever you wanna call it,
    basically a hybrid of a blog and a wiki. I checked out snipsnap, which
    uses java, it was said on their site to be a clone of vanilla, a
    wikilog written with rebol. I wanted an open source thing so i could
    modify it to my needs.

    snipsnap turned out to be, even apparent on the first day of use, way
    too far from being mature and reliable, and although they said it
    doesn't require a server, it required a download of the sun java sdk,
    which, when installed, was well over 400Mbs of space on my hard drive.
    Not to mention another over 100Mbs for the JVM.

    So as i needed a mature enough solution, but liked the way snipsnap
    worked, i looked around, and on freshmeat i found vanilla, with a
    development status of 5; production/stable. I went to its site, where
    a working demo impressed with its capabilities. The site is though
    poorly documented, very poorly documented i had to use trial and error
    to work out how to install it. Anyhow, what impressed me was that the
    download, which was less than half a megabyte, installed vanilla,
    which is the wikilog, an apache server, and the rebol interpreter,
    which is the free download version. And it self-installed! It turned
    out to be a very very capable wikilog, and highly extensible. I am
    still amazed and impressed by it after a couple of days of use.

    Rebol itself seemed a very easy to read language. Sorta like ho
    readable SQL is. I might even say more readable than python or ruby,
    or at least as readable.

    I have the intention to learn it over the coming few days, at least to
    customize vanilla to my needs.

    So i ask you guys, what's wrong with Rebol? i mean other than it's
    proprietary nature. 'cos anyway, there are many commercial IDEs for
    open source languages, and if smitten enough i might even consider a
    rebol SDK. It just amazes me for how readable it is, how much it seems
    to enable to do with so little code, and the size and capability of
    the final solution.

    What's wrong with Rebol?
     
    Mike Henley, Sep 2, 2003
    #1
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  2. Mike Henley

    Hal Fulton Guest

    Mike Henley wrote:

    [snippage]

    > Rebol itself seemed a very easy to read language. Sorta like ho
    > readable SQL is. I might even say more readable than python or ruby,
    > or at least as readable.
    >
    > I have the intention to learn it over the coming few days, at least to
    > customize vanilla to my needs.
    >
    > So i ask you guys, what's wrong with Rebol? i mean other than it's
    > proprietary nature. 'cos anyway, there are many commercial IDEs for
    > open source languages, and if smitten enough i might even consider a
    > rebol SDK. It just amazes me for how readable it is, how much it seems
    > to enable to do with so little code, and the size and capability of
    > the final solution.
    >
    > What's wrong with Rebol?


    Perhaps nothing is wrong with it.

    From what I've seen of Rebol, it reminds me of a language that is
    nothing but function calls. And it has a very rich, very smart set
    of built-in functions with interfaces that are consistent with each
    other and fairly intuitive.

    My only negative comments would be:
    1. Sometimes it's a little "too" high-level for my taste, or high-level
    in the "wrong way": Currency data type, for example. Doesn't it have
    that? It just feels wrong to me somehow, but that could be a silly
    prejudice on my part.
    2. As you said, it's proprietary.
    3. It's not OOP by any stretch of the imagination. After spending 13
    years learning to think OO-ly, a strict procedural language feels like
    a step backwards. This feeling is probably enhanced by the name, which
    reminds me of COBOL or ALGOL. :)

    Having said all that, I can see where Rebol might be really useful in
    many circumstances such as quick scripts for web scraping. Though I'd
    miss Ruby's regular expressions. Does Rebol have those?

    Just my $0.01,
    Hal
     
    Hal Fulton, Sep 2, 2003
    #2
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  3. On Wed, Sep 03, 2003 at 12:32:26AM +0900, Mike Henley wrote:
    > Rebol itself seemed a very easy to read language. Sorta like ho
    > readable SQL is.


    You're not selling it very well :)

    (from someone who has beaten his brains out several times attempting to do
    joined/nested updates across multiple tables)

    > So i ask you guys, what's wrong with Rebol?


    No idea - I've never heard of it. If there's not a completely unencumbered
    implementation then I would discard it on that basis alone. If it doesn't
    have as wide a user base and library support as Ruby, then that would be a
    good reason not to use it. Otherwise, please feel free to evaluate it and
    report back to the list when you have.

    Cheers,

    Brian.
     
    Brian Candler, Sep 2, 2003
    #3
  4. Mike Henley wrote:
    > What's wrong with Rebol?


    It has exactly the same faults as php, perl, python, java, ruby or any other
    language you could mention (or crosspost to).

    It cant do everything!

    Also it is the other language that I have never managed to get my head around
    (the other is Forth - but at least I can use it!). The examples all work but
    the moment I start with a blank screen I don't know where to start.

    If you like it and it does what you want then why are you looking for
    validation of your selection from us?
     
    Peter Hickman, Sep 2, 2003
    #4
  5. Mike Henley

    Ben Giddings Guest

    Guys, please don't respond to stuff like this: note where it was posted:

    Newsgroups:
    comp.lang.php,comp.lang.perl,comp.lang.python,comp.lang.java,comp.lang.ruby

    If someone has a serious question, they shouldn't be cross-posting to 5
    newsgroups. My guess is that it is spam-marketing.

    Ben
     
    Ben Giddings, Sep 2, 2003
    #5
  6. Mike Henley

    Robert Feldt Guest

    Mike Henley <> skrev den Wed, 3 Sep 2003 00:32:26 +0900:

    > What's wrong with Rebol?
    >

    I'm not sure anything is wrong with it. In fact there
    was a thread some time back ([ruby-talk:23713]) where
    listing some nice things about it that we should
    make sure Ruby also has. I guess that some/most of it
    are in ruby nowadays.

    http://www.ruby-talk.org/cgi-bin/scat.rb/ruby/ruby-talk/23713

    Regards,

    Robert
     
    Robert Feldt, Sep 2, 2003
    #6
  7. Hi,

    In message "what's wrong with REBOL?"
    on 03/09/03, Mike Henley <> writes:

    |What's wrong with Rebol?

    Short answer: nothing.
    Longer answer: we are just different.
    Longest answer: <left blank for your homework>

    matz.
     
    Yukihiro Matsumoto, Sep 2, 2003
    #7
  8. Mike Henley

    Terry Reedy Guest

    "Mike Henley" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > So as i needed a mature enough solution, but liked the way snipsnap
    > worked, i looked around, and on freshmeat i found vanilla, with a
    > development status of 5; production/stable. I went to its site,

    where
    > a working demo impressed with its capabilities. The site is though
    > poorly documented, very poorly documented i had to use trial and

    error
    > to work out how to install it.


    If you learned something that might help others, consider contributing
    a writeup if you think (or find out) that site maintainers would
    consider adding it.

    > What's wrong with Rebol?


    It is not Python ;-) and I don't know what unmet need it would fill
    for me. But your experience moved it up a bit on the list of
    languages I might look at someday.

    Terry J. Reedy
     
    Terry Reedy, Sep 2, 2003
    #8
  9. Mike Henley wrote:

    >I first came across rebol a while ago; it seemed interesting but then
    >i was put off by its proprietary nature, although the core of the
    >language is a free download.
    >
    >Recently however, i can't help but say i was totally impressed. I
    >needed an open source wikiblog/wikilog, whatever you wanna call it,
    >basically a hybrid of a blog and a wiki. I checked out snipsnap, which
    >uses java, it was said on their site to be a clone of vanilla, a
    >wikilog written with rebol. I wanted an open source thing so i could
    >modify it to my needs.
    >
    >snipsnap turned out to be, even apparent on the first day of use, way
    >too far from being mature and reliable, and although they said it
    >doesn't require a server, it required a download of the sun java sdk,
    >which, when installed, was well over 400Mbs of space on my hard drive.
    >Not to mention another over 100Mbs for the JVM.
    >
    >So as i needed a mature enough solution, but liked the way snipsnap
    >worked, i looked around, and on freshmeat i found vanilla, with a
    >development status of 5; production/stable. I went to its site, where
    >a working demo impressed with its capabilities. The site is though
    >poorly documented, very poorly documented i had to use trial and error
    >to work out how to install it. Anyhow, what impressed me was that the
    >download, which was less than half a megabyte, installed vanilla,
    >which is the wikilog, an apache server, and the rebol interpreter,
    >which is the free download version. And it self-installed! It turned
    >out to be a very very capable wikilog, and highly extensible. I am
    >still amazed and impressed by it after a couple of days of use.
    >
    >Rebol itself seemed a very easy to read language. Sorta like ho
    >readable SQL is. I might even say more readable than python or ruby,
    >or at least as readable.
    >
    >I have the intention to learn it over the coming few days, at least to
    >customize vanilla to my needs.
    >
    >So i ask you guys, what's wrong with Rebol? i mean other than it's
    >proprietary nature. 'cos anyway, there are many commercial IDEs for
    >open source languages, and if smitten enough i might even consider a
    >rebol SDK. It just amazes me for how readable it is, how much it seems
    >to enable to do with so little code, and the size and capability of
    >the final solution.
    >
    >What's wrong with Rebol?
    >
    >


    Very Intelligent SPAM ! (at least better than the nigerians =)



    ## LEts code what i want to say (easier for a non english advanced coder )
    ## Contributions are very appreciated.

    class RubyTalk << MailList

    Include Positiveness

    def initialize(thread)
    @thread = thread
    forget rules if friday
    end

    def ruby_vs(language)

    if language =~ /perl|pyhton/

    redirect to previous discussions/links

    else

    what can we learn from that language ?

    end

    end

    def troll

    what can we learn from that troll ?

    end

    def no_good_english
    think this
    imagine your self in the ruby-talk/jp
    ...same for us
    end

    def nigerian_spam

    send to your friends

    end

    end

    newthread=RubyTalk.new( what's wrong with REBOL?)
    => what can we learn from REBOL ?
    # too high level language
    => How good is a too high level language ?
    => RE: what's wrong with ruby?

    Man invented language to satisfy his deep need to complain.-- Lily Tomlin
    what's wrong with REBOL? .. funny =)
     
    Bermejo, Rodrigo, Sep 2, 2003
    #9
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