Why gem built with hoe depends on hoe?

Discussion in 'Ruby' started by pluskid, Feb 1, 2008.

  1. pluskid

    pluskid Guest

    Hi,

    I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that
    the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically.
    I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build
    the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically
    is unreasonable, isn't it?

    Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run?
    Thanks!
    pluskid, Feb 1, 2008
    #1
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  2. pluskid

    John Joyce Guest

    On Feb 1, 2008, at 7:20 AM, pluskid wrote:

    > Hi,
    >
    > I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that
    > the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically.
    > I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build
    > the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically
    > is unreasonable, isn't it?
    >
    > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run?
    > Thanks!
    >


    Hoe's gotta eat too!
    John Joyce, Feb 1, 2008
    #2
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  3. pluskid

    Luis Lavena Guest

    On 1 feb, 11:19, pluskid <> wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that
    > the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically.
    > I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build
    > the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically
    > is unreasonable, isn't it?
    >
    > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run?
    > Thanks!


    The argument behind this is that you can "gem check -t gemname" to run
    the unit tests for a gem.

    If the user firing that command don't have 'hoe' installed, will fail
    due a missing dependency.

    There is no way to differentiate build, test and runtime environments
    for RubyGems.

    Is quite common things like this were asked (I have tracked a mail
    from 2005 AFAIK).

    Anyhow, Susan Potter just raised this issue [1].

    She is using something interally that could, adapted to mainstream,
    help everybody in the long run.

    [1] http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/rubygems-developers/2008-February/003538.html
    --
    Luis Lavena
    Luis Lavena, Feb 1, 2008
    #3
  4. pluskid

    Luis Lavena Guest

    Luis Lavena, Feb 1, 2008
    #4
  5. Yeah! I see. I think apt-get (of Debian) has done a great job
    on this topic. It just install all runtime dependencies when you
    run
    apt-get install something
    And it provides an extra command to install the dev dependecies:
    apt-get build-dep something
    I think RubyGems have no such features yet, isn't it? Maybe they
    can think about similar things. So currently I should think the
    definition of "dependency" be "dev dependency".

    2008/2/2, Luis Lavena <>:
    > On 1 feb, 11:19, pluskid <> wrote:
    > > Hi,
    > >
    > > I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that
    > > the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically.
    > > I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build
    > > the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically
    > > is unreasonable, isn't it?
    > >
    > > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run?
    > > Thanks!

    >
    > The argument behind this is that you can "gem check -t gemname" to run
    > the unit tests for a gem.
    >
    > If the user firing that command don't have 'hoe' installed, will fail
    > due a missing dependency.
    >
    > There is no way to differentiate build, test and runtime environments
    > for RubyGems.
    >
    > Is quite common things like this were asked (I have tracked a mail
    > from 2005 AFAIK).
    >
    > Anyhow, Susan Potter just raised this issue [1].
    >
    > She is using something interally that could, adapted to mainstream,
    > help everybody in the long run.
    >
    > [1] http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/rubygems-developers/2008-February/003538.html
    > --
    > Luis Lavena
    >
    >
    Chiyuan Zhang, Feb 2, 2008
    #5
  6. pluskid

    Tim Pease Guest

    On Feb 1, 2008 6:20 AM, pluskid <> wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that
    > the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically.
    > I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build
    > the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically
    > is unreasonable, isn't it?
    >
    > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run?
    > Thanks!
    >


    You should look at Mr Bones. It does the same thing as hoe, but
    without the viral dependency.

    sudo gem install bones

    <http://codeforpeople.rubyforge.org/bones>

    Blessings,
    TwP
    Tim Pease, Feb 2, 2008
    #6
  7. pluskid

    pluskid Guest

    On Feb 2, 10:51 pm, Tim Pease <> wrote:
    > On Feb 1, 2008 6:20 AM, pluskid <> wrote:
    >
    > > Hi,

    >
    > > I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that
    > > the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically.
    > > I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build
    > > the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically
    > > is unreasonable, isn't it?

    >
    > > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run?
    > > Thanks!

    >
    > You should look at Mr Bones. It does the same thing as hoe, but
    > without the viral dependency.
    >
    > sudo gem install bones
    >
    > <http://codeforpeople.rubyforge.org/bones>
    >
    > Blessings,
    > TwP

    Yeah! It looks great! Even with integrate with rspec. Hmm. I'll
    investigate it more. Thanks!
    pluskid, Feb 3, 2008
    #7
  8. I use newgem, which sits on top of hoe (and removes it from the
    deplist). It's written by Dr. Nic and works really, really well.

    I haven't tried Mr Bones. Perhaps I will on my next project...

    --Jeremy

    On Feb 3, 2008 9:49 AM, pluskid <> wrote:
    > On Feb 2, 10:51 pm, Tim Pease <> wrote:
    >
    > > On Feb 1, 2008 6:20 AM, pluskid <> wrote:
    > >
    > > > Hi,

    > >
    > > > I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that
    > > > the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically.
    > > > I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build
    > > > the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically
    > > > is unreasonable, isn't it?

    > >
    > > > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run?
    > > > Thanks!

    > >
    > > You should look at Mr Bones. It does the same thing as hoe, but
    > > without the viral dependency.
    > >
    > > sudo gem install bones
    > >
    > > <http://codeforpeople.rubyforge.org/bones>
    > >
    > > Blessings,
    > > TwP

    > Yeah! It looks great! Even with integrate with rspec. Hmm. I'll
    > investigate it more. Thanks!
    >
    >




    --
    http://www.jeremymcanally.com/

    My books:
    Ruby in Practice
    http://www.manning.com/mcanally/

    My free Ruby e-book
    http://www.humblelittlerubybook.com/

    My blogs:
    http://www.mrneighborly.com/
    http://www.rubyinpractice.com/
    Jeremy McAnally, Feb 3, 2008
    #8
  9. On Feb 2, 2008 6:51 AM, Tim Pease <> wrote:
    >
    > On Feb 1, 2008 6:20 AM, pluskid <> wrote:
    > You should look at Mr Bones. It does the same thing as hoe, but
    > without the viral dependency.
    >
    > sudo gem install bones


    On a related note, I wanted to share my own methodology. I've got a
    Monotone branch that I use as the basis of my projects, which includes
    some starting directories, a Rakefile and a gemspec.rb. As I discover
    variations and improvements, or adapt to updates of rubygems or rake,
    I update the project and propagate them automatically out to all the
    projects based on the branch. I've got a couple of tricks that I
    yionked from hoe in there, and I expect I'll take a gander at Mr Bones
    as well.

    Advantages:
    - No extra dependencies in the eventual gems.
    - Improvements to the skeleton can be propagated to projects - without
    destroying local tweaks for the projects
    - I have my own control over how I use rake, rubygems, etc.

    I suppose there's the disadvantage that it ties me to monotone. I
    suspect (but am not sure) that a similar thing could be accomplished
    with git, but probably not with subversion.

    Judson

    --
    Your subnet is currently 169.254.0.0/16. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
    Judson Lester, Feb 5, 2008
    #9
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