Wicked Cool Java

Discussion in 'Java' started by John A. Bailo, May 22, 2006.

  1. Just bought the book "Wicked Cool Java".

    It's great!

    It skips all the plodding step by step stuff and just talks about the
    cutting edge cool things you can do with java.

    http://www.wickedcooljava.com/
     
    John A. Bailo, May 22, 2006
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. TechBookReport, May 22, 2006
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. John A. Bailo

    Rhino Guest

    "TechBookReport" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > John A. Bailo wrote:
    >>
    >> Just bought the book "Wicked Cool Java".
    >>
    >> It's great!
    >>
    >> It skips all the plodding step by step stuff and just talks about the
    >> cutting edge cool things you can do with java.
    >>
    >> http://www.wickedcooljava.com/
    >>

    > Reviewed: http://www.techbookreport.com/tbr0230.html
    >
    > --
    > TechBookReport Java http://www.techbookreport.com/JavaIndex.html
    >


    I might be more inclined to take this review seriously if the name of the
    reviewer was supplied and if the competency of the reviewer was stated. In
    other words, the review doesn't indicate even the name of the reviewer, let
    alone the Java skills he/she possesses.

    Without that information, I have no reason to take this review any more
    seriously than a review written by a beginner or hype from the publisher.
    There are several people on this newsgroup who have, in my opinion,
    demonstrated a wide understanding of Java programming and/or OO design. Why
    not get some of them to review the books on your site? I'd be more inclined
    to take a book review seriously if it was written by Oliver Wong or Chris
    Uppal, for example, than I am by an anonymous review.

    --
    Rhino
     
    Rhino, May 22, 2006
    #3
  4. Rhino wrote:

    > There are several people on this newsgroup who have, in my opinion,
    > demonstrated a wide understanding of Java programming and/or OO design. Why
    > not get some of them to review the books on your site?


    I'm not sure if that's the right approach.

    The neat thing about Wicked Cool Java (http://www.wickedcooljava.com) is
    that it's an /advanced/ book for *beginners*.

    It's for people like me who want a minimal amount of formalism, but yet
    want to jump right into the really cool features of a product or language.

    It's not "for dummies", and it's not "for pedagogues" either.
     
    John A. Bailo, May 22, 2006
    #4
  5. John A. Bailo

    jmcgill Guest

    John A. Bailo wrote:
    > It's for people like me who want a minimal amount of formalism, but yet
    > want to jump right into the really cool features of a product or language.\


    I'll be sure and flip through it next time I'm at the book store.

    If the New England accent comes through too much beyond the title,
    I'll laugh and move on.

    Chapter 7 sounds interesting. How deep does it go?
     
    jmcgill, May 22, 2006
    #5
  6. jmcgill wrote:

    > Chapter 7 sounds interesting. How deep does it go?


    It's hardcore in that it covers a lot of ground.

    Music
    Synthesized Sound
    JMusic
    Java Speech
    RealTime APIs
    Thread Syncs


    This is more a book to kind of jar the brain and say "look, look at all
    this stuff that java can do". Then, if one or the other thing really
    catches your interest, it's up to you to drill down or use the website
    to get more.

    However, if this is your area of expertise, I would say, that you would
    find it not that interesting -- BUT, you may read another chapter and
    figure out how to mash up AI and Multimedia together!
     
    John A. Bailo, May 22, 2006
    #6
  7. John A. Bailo

    Rhino Guest

    "John A. Bailo" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Rhino wrote:
    >
    >> There are several people on this newsgroup who have, in my opinion,
    >> demonstrated a wide understanding of Java programming and/or OO design.
    >> Why not get some of them to review the books on your site?

    >
    > I'm not sure if that's the right approach.
    >
    > The neat thing about Wicked Cool Java (http://www.wickedcooljava.com) is
    > that it's an /advanced/ book for *beginners*.
    >
    > It's for people like me who want a minimal amount of formalism, but yet
    > want to jump right into the really cool features of a product or language.
    >
    > It's not "for dummies", and it's not "for pedagogues" either.


    You're missing my point. I'm delighted to hear that _you_ find the book
    useful.

    I was taking issue with the book review on _TechBookReports.com_ and saying
    that the review didn't impress me because it didn't identify the reviewer,
    nor did it identify the Java skills of the developer.

    If the reviewer is anonymous because he/she is a Java newbie or because
    he/she is an employee of the publisher, I'm inclined to dismiss the review
    entirely. I think I've seen your name on this newsgroup before but not
    enough for me to get a lasting impression of you so your recommendation
    doesn't particularly wow me either - no offense!

    I'd be a lot more impressed if the person reviewing it was someone I knew to
    be unconnected with the publisher and thoroughly competent in Java. I
    suggested some people on this newsgroup whose approval of the book would
    make me a lot more likely to get this book than the word of an anonymous
    reviewer.

    Again, I'm not criticizing the book since I've never laid eyes on it and I
    mean no disrespect to you either since I don't know you.

    --
    Rhino
     
    Rhino, May 22, 2006
    #7
  8. John A. Bailo

    steve Guest

    On Tue, 23 May 2006 02:42:20 +0800, John A. Bailo wrote
    (in article <>):

    > jmcgill wrote:
    >
    >> Chapter 7 sounds interesting. How deep does it go?

    >
    > It's hardcore in that it covers a lot of ground.
    >

    A chetah covers a lot of ground, but there's nothing "hard" about a chetah.

    > Music
    > Synthesized Sound
    > JMusic
    > Java Speech
    > RealTime APIs
    > Thread Syncs
    >
    >
    > This is more a book to kind of jar the brain and say "look, look at all
    > this stuff that java can do". Then, if one or the other thing really
    > catches your interest, it's up to you to drill down or use the website
    > to get more.
    >
    > However, if this is your area of expertise, I would say, that you would
    > find it not that interesting -- BUT, you may read another chapter and
    > figure out how to mash up AI and Multimedia together!


    so does it do THE real cool stuff like:

    Serial communication RS232
    USB implementation

    or just the "gay" cool stuff like music, that you can implement in 5 lines of
    java?

    Steve
     
    steve, May 22, 2006
    #8
  9. steve wrote:

    > so does it do THE real cool stuff like:
    >
    > Serial communication RS232
    > USB implementation


    I don't see either of those in the index.

    What do you mean by USB music?

    One thing I've always wanted is do be able to pipe my Sandisk m200
    player's music via a USB cable to a sound card and out the computer's
    speakers.

    Is that possible?


    > or just...stuff...that you can implement in 5 lines of code


    Dude. Don't you know?

    The coolest things are always implemented in 5 lines of code.
     
    John A. Bailo, May 22, 2006
    #9
  10. Rhino wrote:

    > I was taking issue with the book review on _TechBookReports.com_ and saying
    > that the review didn't impress me because it didn't identify the reviewer,
    > nor did it identify the Java skills of the developer.
    >
    > If the reviewer is anonymous because he/she is a Java newbie or because
    > he/she is an employee of the publisher, I'm inclined to dismiss the review
    > entirely. I think I've seen your name on this newsgroup before but not
    > enough for me to get a lasting impression of you so your recommendation
    > doesn't particularly wow me either - no offense!


    [...]

    > Again, I'm not criticizing the book since I've never laid eyes on it and I
    > mean no disrespect to you either since I don't know you.


    You seem hung up on /knowing/ people.

    You should explore anonymity more.
     
    John A. Bailo, May 22, 2006
    #10
  11. John A. Bailo

    Rhino Guest

    "John A. Bailo" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Rhino wrote:
    >
    >> I was taking issue with the book review on _TechBookReports.com_ and
    >> saying that the review didn't impress me because it didn't identify the
    >> reviewer, nor did it identify the Java skills of the developer.
    >>
    >> If the reviewer is anonymous because he/she is a Java newbie or because
    >> he/she is an employee of the publisher, I'm inclined to dismiss the
    >> review entirely. I think I've seen your name on this newsgroup before but
    >> not enough for me to get a lasting impression of you so your
    >> recommendation doesn't particularly wow me either - no offense!

    >
    > [...]
    >
    >> Again, I'm not criticizing the book since I've never laid eyes on it and
    >> I mean no disrespect to you either since I don't know you.

    >
    > You seem hung up on /knowing/ people.
    >
    > You should explore anonymity more.


    So if I put up a web page asking for $100 and you had it to spare, you'd
    just give it to me, without knowing anything about me, even my name?

    Somehow I doubt it yet you expect me to give out $100 (or whatever "Wicked
    Cool Java" costs) just because some anonymous someone said some nice things
    about it. All I can say to that is "Don't hold your breath!"

    --
    Rhino
     
    Rhino, May 23, 2006
    #11
  12. John A. Bailo

    jmcgill Guest

    Rhino wrote:

    > Somehow I doubt it yet you expect me to give out $100 (or whatever "Wicked
    > Cool Java" costs) just because some anonymous someone said some nice things
    > about it. All I can say to that is "Don't hold your breath!"


    If several people review a book and their opinions tend to corroborate
    each other, I will tend to put the book on my list of things to consider
    buying. In this case, the controversy about the *review* is enough to
    prompt me to flip through it next time I'm at the bookstore.

    The reviews have been sufficient to let me understand that I'm at a
    level beyond the audience of the book. I don't care who wrote them.
    They were useful to me.

    I don't see where anyone asked you for $100.
     
    jmcgill, May 23, 2006
    #12
  13. Thomas Weidenfeller, May 23, 2006
    #13
  14. Rhino wrote:
    > "TechBookReport" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> John A. Bailo wrote:
    >>> Just bought the book "Wicked Cool Java".
    >>>
    >>> It's great!
    >>>
    >>> It skips all the plodding step by step stuff and just talks about the
    >>> cutting edge cool things you can do with java.
    >>>
    >>> http://www.wickedcooljava.com/
    >>>

    >> Reviewed: http://www.techbookreport.com/tbr0230.html
    >>
    >> --
    >> TechBookReport Java http://www.techbookreport.com/JavaIndex.html
    >>

    >
    > I might be more inclined to take this review seriously if the name of the
    > reviewer was supplied and if the competency of the reviewer was stated. In
    > other words, the review doesn't indicate even the name of the reviewer, let
    > alone the Java skills he/she possesses.
    >
    > Without that information, I have no reason to take this review any more
    > seriously than a review written by a beginner or hype from the publisher.
    > There are several people on this newsgroup who have, in my opinion,
    > demonstrated a wide understanding of Java programming and/or OO design. Why
    > not get some of them to review the books on your site? I'd be more inclined
    > to take a book review seriously if it was written by Oliver Wong or Chris
    > Uppal, for example, than I am by an anonymous review.
    >
    > --
    > Rhino
    >
    >

    Some of the reviews on the site are signed, it's up to the reviewer
    whether they want to put their name to a review or not. However, even if
    the reviews were signed how could you judge the competence (or
    otherwise) of the reviewer if you've never heard or him or her?

    Adding a note saying that the reviewer has x years of Java experience
    doesn't add much either. There are people with x years of experience in
    one niche area who won't have the knowledge or broader experience of
    someone with fewer years. Besides, how could anyone verify the truth?

    Just for the record, all of the reviewers on TechBookReport are active
    developers. None of them work for publishers or are authors of the books
    they are publishing. The point of the site is that the book reviews are
    independent, which is more than can be said for some of the reviews on
    Amazon, for example.

    Like all sites, TechBookReport.com depends to a large extent on
    reputation. That means that bad books are criticised, good books lauded
    and so-so books described as such. If there's a review that you bitterly
    disagree with then say so, casting doubt on the honesty of the site
    isn't helpful.

    Pan
    --
    TechBookReport Java http://www.techbookreport.com/JavaIndex.html
     
    TechBookReport, May 23, 2006
    #14
  15. John A. Bailo

    Rhino Guest

    "TechBookReport" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Rhino wrote:
    >> "TechBookReport" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>> John A. Bailo wrote:
    >>>> Just bought the book "Wicked Cool Java".
    >>>>
    >>>> It's great!
    >>>>
    >>>> It skips all the plodding step by step stuff and just talks about the
    >>>> cutting edge cool things you can do with java.
    >>>>
    >>>> http://www.wickedcooljava.com/
    >>>>
    >>> Reviewed: http://www.techbookreport.com/tbr0230.html
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> TechBookReport Java http://www.techbookreport.com/JavaIndex.html
    >>>

    >>
    >> I might be more inclined to take this review seriously if the name of the
    >> reviewer was supplied and if the competency of the reviewer was stated.
    >> In other words, the review doesn't indicate even the name of the
    >> reviewer, let alone the Java skills he/she possesses.
    >>
    >> Without that information, I have no reason to take this review any more
    >> seriously than a review written by a beginner or hype from the publisher.
    >> There are several people on this newsgroup who have, in my opinion,
    >> demonstrated a wide understanding of Java programming and/or OO design.
    >> Why not get some of them to review the books on your site? I'd be more
    >> inclined to take a book review seriously if it was written by Oliver Wong
    >> or Chris Uppal, for example, than I am by an anonymous review.
    >>
    >> --
    >> Rhino

    > Some of the reviews on the site are signed, it's up to the reviewer
    > whether they want to put their name to a review or not. However, even if
    > the reviews were signed how could you judge the competence (or otherwise)
    > of the reviewer if you've never heard or him or her?
    >


    Obviously, I _can't_ judge the competence of someone I've never heard of.

    However, if a name _is_ given, there is at least a chance I _have_ heard of
    them. If no reviewer name is given, there is no chance whatever of judging
    competence; in that case, the review could have been written by the
    proverbial one million monkeys with one million typewriters for all I know.

    > Adding a note saying that the reviewer has x years of Java experience
    > doesn't add much either. There are people with x years of experience in
    > one niche area who won't have the knowledge or broader experience of
    > someone with fewer years. Besides, how could anyone verify the truth?
    >

    It may not add much but it adds _something_. If someone claims to have 5
    years or 10 years experience, the review seems more credible than saying 5
    minutes or 10 days experience.

    I agree that depth vs. breadth is an issue, as is the verifiability of any
    information given. Anyone can exaggerate their abilities and experience.

    However, a name might be recognized, particularly if it was a name known
    within the Java community, such as Bruce Echols. An unknown name could be
    researched if the person reading the review had serious doubts about that
    person's reliability.

    > Just for the record, all of the reviewers on TechBookReport are active
    > developers. None of them work for publishers or are authors of the books
    > they are publishing. The point of the site is that the book reviews are
    > independent, which is more than can be said for some of the reviews on
    > Amazon, for example.
    >


    That is good to know. Is that fact posted anywhere at the website? I didn't
    see it in the Wicked Cool Java page.

    > Like all sites, TechBookReport.com depends to a large extent on
    > reputation. That means that bad books are criticised, good books lauded
    > and so-so books described as such.


    And that's great. I have no problem with that.

    > If there's a review that you bitterly disagree with then say so, casting
    > doubt on the honesty of the site isn't helpful.
    >


    I was not disagreeing with the review of Wicked Cool Java. I have never read
    that book and therefore have no opinions about it.

    If you think I was casting doubt on the honesty of the site, you
    misunderstood me.

    I did not say anyone was being dishonest. I simply said that the reviewer
    was not identified by name or skill level and that an anonymous review was
    not something I found terribly persuasive. I am relieved to find that the
    reviewer is, apparently, an active developer with no vested interest in
    promoting (or trashing) the book, but I didn't know that until you mentioned
    it just now.

    Personally, I would be more likely to take the reviews at the site seriously
    if all reviewers were identified and if some sort of information was
    available about each reviewer's experience. That does not mean that your
    current approach is dishonest, just that it isn't optimal for _my_ needs. I
    was merely trying to give some personal feedback on what I deem a
    less-than-ideal approach.

    Obviously, it is up to you to decide whether I am just an individual with an
    eccentric view about how a book review site should operate or someone whose
    views might well be widespread across your target audience. If you decide
    that I am just an eccentric, you will probably not change anything, unless
    perhaps you perceive eccentrics as an important new audience. On the other
    hand, if you decide I am the tip of the iceberg and represent a strong
    undercurrent within the Java community, you may decide to do things
    differently. That's your call.

    In any case, I have shared my views with you and consider the matter at an
    end.

    --
    Rhino
     
    Rhino, May 23, 2006
    #15
  16. John A. Bailo

    jmcgill Guest

    You've written more about the "reviewer" controversy than the reviewers
    wrote about the book.
     
    jmcgill, May 23, 2006
    #16
  17. John A. Bailo

    Luke Webber Guest

    Thomas Weidenfeller wrote:
    > steve wrote:
    >> so does it do THE real cool stuff like:
    >>
    >> Serial communication RS232
    >> USB implementation

    >
    > It mostly demonstrates the usage of special-purpose third-party
    > free-software libraries. Some of these libraries do hard things, but non
    > of them solves everyday problems like USB access or fixes the RS232
    > problem.


    What RS232 problem? The JavaComm API does RS232 and serial comms. But
    it's /not/ cool. I did RS232 comms programming for more years than I
    care to recall, and "cool" lasted maybe a week. These days especially,
    there is nothing the least bit cool about it.

    Luke
     
    Luke Webber, May 24, 2006
    #17
  18. John A. Bailo

    jmcgill Guest

    Luke Webber wrote:
    > What RS232 problem? The JavaComm API does RS232 and serial comms. But
    > it's /not/ cool. I did RS232 comms programming for more years than I
    > care to recall, and "cool" lasted maybe a week. These days especially,
    > there is nothing the least bit cool about it.


    I wrote serial drivers twelve to fourteen years ago, and today, I
    honestly cannot tell you how I did it. I'm totally serious, I was doing
    things in C and x86 asm that I literally do not know how to do today.
    Some of the systems I worked on were pretty cool, but definitely not the
    code or the process of writing it. I don't remember anything about it,
    and except when something reminds me (like this message thread), I
    actually forget I had that job altogether.
     
    jmcgill, May 24, 2006
    #18
  19. Luke Webber wrote:
    > What RS232 problem? The JavaComm API does RS232 and serial comms.


    E.g. that JavaComm was not maintained for years.

    E.g. that JavaComm for Windows was recently withdrawn by Sun.

    E.g. that JavaComm never made it into the standard edition.

    E.g. that JavaComm is difficult to deploy via WebStart.

    E.g. that JavaComm does not provide access to more esoteric tty options.

    These problems.

    /Thomas
    --
    The comp.lang.java.gui FAQ:
    ftp://ftp.cs.uu.nl/pub/NEWS.ANSWERS/computer-lang/java/gui/faq
    http://www.uni-giessen.de/faq/archiv/computer-lang.java.gui.faq/
     
    Thomas Weidenfeller, May 24, 2006
    #19
  20. Rhino wrote:
    > "TechBookReport" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Rhino wrote:
    >>> "TechBookReport" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:...
    >>>> John A. Bailo wrote:
    >>>>> Just bought the book "Wicked Cool Java".
    >>>>>
    >>>>> It's great!
    >>>>>
    >>>>> It skips all the plodding step by step stuff and just talks about the
    >>>>> cutting edge cool things you can do with java.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> http://www.wickedcooljava.com/
    >>>>>
    >>>> Reviewed: http://www.techbookreport.com/tbr0230.html
    >>>>
    >>>> --
    >>>> TechBookReport Java http://www.techbookreport.com/JavaIndex.html
    >>>>
    >>> I might be more inclined to take this review seriously if the name of the
    >>> reviewer was supplied and if the competency of the reviewer was stated.
    >>> In other words, the review doesn't indicate even the name of the
    >>> reviewer, let alone the Java skills he/she possesses.
    >>>
    >>> Without that information, I have no reason to take this review any more
    >>> seriously than a review written by a beginner or hype from the publisher.
    >>> There are several people on this newsgroup who have, in my opinion,
    >>> demonstrated a wide understanding of Java programming and/or OO design.
    >>> Why not get some of them to review the books on your site? I'd be more
    >>> inclined to take a book review seriously if it was written by Oliver Wong
    >>> or Chris Uppal, for example, than I am by an anonymous review.
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> Rhino

    >> Some of the reviews on the site are signed, it's up to the reviewer
    >> whether they want to put their name to a review or not. However, even if
    >> the reviews were signed how could you judge the competence (or otherwise)
    >> of the reviewer if you've never heard or him or her?
    >>

    >
    > Obviously, I _can't_ judge the competence of someone I've never heard of.
    >
    > However, if a name _is_ given, there is at least a chance I _have_ heard of
    > them. If no reviewer name is given, there is no chance whatever of judging
    > competence; in that case, the review could have been written by the
    > proverbial one million monkeys with one million typewriters for all I know.
    >
    >> Adding a note saying that the reviewer has x years of Java experience
    >> doesn't add much either. There are people with x years of experience in
    >> one niche area who won't have the knowledge or broader experience of
    >> someone with fewer years. Besides, how could anyone verify the truth?
    >>

    > It may not add much but it adds _something_. If someone claims to have 5
    > years or 10 years experience, the review seems more credible than saying 5
    > minutes or 10 days experience.
    >
    > I agree that depth vs. breadth is an issue, as is the verifiability of any
    > information given. Anyone can exaggerate their abilities and experience.
    >
    > However, a name might be recognized, particularly if it was a name known
    > within the Java community, such as Bruce Echols. An unknown name could be
    > researched if the person reading the review had serious doubts about that
    > person's reliability.
    >
    >> Just for the record, all of the reviewers on TechBookReport are active
    >> developers. None of them work for publishers or are authors of the books
    >> they are publishing. The point of the site is that the book reviews are
    >> independent, which is more than can be said for some of the reviews on
    >> Amazon, for example.
    >>

    >
    > That is good to know. Is that fact posted anywhere at the website? I didn't
    > see it in the Wicked Cool Java page.
    >
    >> Like all sites, TechBookReport.com depends to a large extent on
    >> reputation. That means that bad books are criticised, good books lauded
    >> and so-so books described as such.

    >
    > And that's great. I have no problem with that.
    >
    >> If there's a review that you bitterly disagree with then say so, casting
    >> doubt on the honesty of the site isn't helpful.
    >>

    >
    > I was not disagreeing with the review of Wicked Cool Java. I have never read
    > that book and therefore have no opinions about it.
    >
    > If you think I was casting doubt on the honesty of the site, you
    > misunderstood me.
    >
    > I did not say anyone was being dishonest. I simply said that the reviewer
    > was not identified by name or skill level and that an anonymous review was
    > not something I found terribly persuasive. I am relieved to find that the
    > reviewer is, apparently, an active developer with no vested interest in
    > promoting (or trashing) the book, but I didn't know that until you mentioned
    > it just now.
    >
    > Personally, I would be more likely to take the reviews at the site seriously
    > if all reviewers were identified and if some sort of information was
    > available about each reviewer's experience. That does not mean that your
    > current approach is dishonest, just that it isn't optimal for _my_ needs. I
    > was merely trying to give some personal feedback on what I deem a
    > less-than-ideal approach.
    >
    > Obviously, it is up to you to decide whether I am just an individual with an
    > eccentric view about how a book review site should operate or someone whose
    > views might well be widespread across your target audience. If you decide
    > that I am just an eccentric, you will probably not change anything, unless
    > perhaps you perceive eccentrics as an important new audience. On the other
    > hand, if you decide I am the tip of the iceberg and represent a strong
    > undercurrent within the Java community, you may decide to do things
    > differently. That's your call.
    >
    > In any case, I have shared my views with you and consider the matter at an
    > end.
    >
    > --
    > Rhino
    >
    >

    It's OK, no offence was taken. You made a fair comment and I responded
    to it. End of story.


    Pan

    --
    TechBookReport Java http://www.techbookreport.com/JavaIndex.html
     
    TechBookReport, May 24, 2006
    #20
    1. Advertising

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