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Message: [QUOTE="sln, post: 4863116"] Actually, this is not why it's not clever, since you can pass length '$h{$a}' to force string context But, this is true. Too many examples to show why. Floating point, exponential, etc. It loses it's context in what length() is for... really strings. The above won't work in value context, numeric by nature with <=>. On the other hand, 'exists $h{$b}' is NOT meant to be interpreted as numeric, but as a string, since 0 can equal 0. But '' is less than '1' in a compare, but equal length numerically. The two don't mix. $xa = exists $h{$a}; string context, returns '1' for true, '' for false ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Haven't tried this one, %75 of my theory works, this is the %25 haven't tried. My confidence is %100 the non-existent will decend to the bottom. Hope I cleared some stuff up. I know people will find this knowledge in the archives someday. -sln [/QUOTE]