HTML Tables

Discussion in 'HTML' started by MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk, Apr 11, 2005.

  1. Hi,
    I am using a table with three columns to display the main text on my site.
    If, however, I put a lot of text in one of the columns, when I try and imput
    text into one of the others it starts half way down the column. Is there
    any way to make it so all of the text is aligned at the top of the columns
    despite the amount of text in each of them?

    At the moment the text in the centre column starts at the top of the table
    but the text on the left and right starts half way down.

    Your help is very much appreciated.
    Cheers
    Tom

    --
    Free DVD rental for a whole year
    http://www.magicfreebiesuk.co.uk/dvd.html
     
    MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk, Apr 11, 2005
    #1
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  2. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    Steve Pugh Guest

    "MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk" <> wrote:

    >I am using a table with three columns to display the main text on my site.


    Doesn't sound like a table to me.

    >If, however, I put a lot of text in one of the columns, when I try and imput
    >text into one of the others it starts half way down the column. Is there
    >any way to make it so all of the text is aligned at the top of the columns
    >despite the amount of text in each of them?


    Yes. In CSS you would apply the vertical-align property, but in
    clunky, bad HTML like you seem to be using you would apply the valign
    attribute,

    >At the moment the text in the centre column starts at the top of the table
    >but the text on the left and right starts half way down.


    Let me guess. The centre column is the taller one?

    >Your help is very much appreciated.


    You're welcome.

    Steve

    --
    "My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
    I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

    Steve Pugh <> <http://steve.pugh.net/>
     
    Steve Pugh, Apr 11, 2005
    #2
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  3. "Steve Pugh" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk" <> wrote:
    >
    > >I am using a table with three columns to display the main text on my

    site.
    >
    > Doesn't sound like a table to me.
    >
    > >If, however, I put a lot of text in one of the columns, when I try and

    imput
    > >text into one of the others it starts half way down the column. Is there
    > >any way to make it so all of the text is aligned at the top of the

    columns
    > >despite the amount of text in each of them?

    >
    > Yes. In CSS you would apply the vertical-align property, but in
    > clunky, bad HTML like you seem to be using you would apply the valign
    > attribute,
    >
    > >At the moment the text in the centre column starts at the top of the

    table
    > >but the text on the left and right starts half way down.

    >
    > Let me guess. The centre column is the taller one?
    >
    > >Your help is very much appreciated.

    >
    > You're welcome.
    >
    > Steve
    >
    > --
    > "My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
    > I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor
    >
    > Steve Pugh <> <http://steve.pugh.net/>



    I put those valign attributes in but they don't seem to have made any
    difference.

    Please feel free to look at source:
    http://www.magicfreebiesuk.co.uk/testpage.html

    TIA
    Tom
     
    MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk, Apr 11, 2005
    #3
  4. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    tonnie Guest

    MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk wrote:
    > "Steve Pugh" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >>"MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk" <> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>I am using a table with three columns to display the main text on my

    >
    > site.
    >
    >>Doesn't sound like a table to me.
    >>
    >>
    >>>If, however, I put a lot of text in one of the columns, when I try and

    >
    > imput
    >
    >>>text into one of the others it starts half way down the column. Is there
    >>>any way to make it so all of the text is aligned at the top of the

    >
    > columns
    >
    >>>despite the amount of text in each of them?

    >>
    >>Yes. In CSS you would apply the vertical-align property, but in
    >>clunky, bad HTML like you seem to be using you would apply the valign
    >>attribute,
    >>
    >>
    >>>At the moment the text in the centre column starts at the top of the

    >
    > table
    >
    >>>but the text on the left and right starts half way down.

    >>
    >>Let me guess. The centre column is the taller one?
    >>
    >>
    >>>Your help is very much appreciated.

    >>
    >>You're welcome.
    >>
    >>Steve
    >>
    >>--
    >>"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
    >> I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor
    >>
    >>Steve Pugh <> <http://steve.pugh.net/>

    >
    >
    >
    > I put those valign attributes in but they don't seem to have made any
    > difference.
    >
    > Please feel free to look at source:
    > http://www.magicfreebiesuk.co.uk/testpage.html


    Not a the <p> element but on the <table> and <td> elements.

    Instead of this:

    <p align="center" valign="top">dhfjdfhjnf</p>

    ad a line to your <style type="text/css">

    table, td { vertical-align: top; }


    --
    Glas geschiedenis http://www.vision2form.nl/glashistorie.html
    Passie en talent http://www.vision2form.nl/young_talent.html
    Webontwerp http://www.vision2form.nl/webontwerp/index.html
    SEO gaat zo http://www.vision2form.nl/webontwerp/gevonden-worden.html
     
    tonnie, Apr 11, 2005
    #4
  5. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    Dylan Parry Guest

    MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk wrote:

    > I put those valign attributes in but they don't seem to have made any
    > difference.


    No you haven't. The valign attribute belongs to the td elements, not to
    the paragraphs.

    Looking at the rest of the code though, it is hardly a cut down example
    of your problem is it? I had to sift through tons of really awful
    looking code to find where you had gone wrong.

    --
    Dylan Parry
    http://webpageworkshop.co.uk -- FREE Web tutorials and references
     
    Dylan Parry, Apr 11, 2005
    #5
  6. On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 16:10:48 GMT, MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk
    <> wrote:

    > I am using a table with three columns to display the main text on my
    > site.


    See, that's the real problem.

    <http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=tableless+design&as_oq=tables+tableless+semantic+markup+structural&as_ugroup=alt.html%2A%2C+comp.infosystems.www.authoring%2A>

    > If, however, I put a lot of text in one of the columns, when I try and
    > imput
    > text into one of the others it starts half way down the column. Is there
    > any way to make it so all of the text is aligned at the top of the
    > columns
    > despite the amount of text in each of them?
    >


    Sorry, had you worked with correct markup I might have had a solution.


    --
    ,-- --<--@ -- PretLetters: 'woest wyf', met vele interesses: ----------.
    | weblog | http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/_private/weblog.html |
    | webontwerp | http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/webontwerp.html |
    |zweefvliegen | http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/vliegen.html |
    `-------------------------------------------------- --<--@ ------------'
     
    Barbara de Zoete, Apr 11, 2005
    #6
  7. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk wrote:

    > I put those valign attributes in but they don't seem to have made any
    > difference.


    I was going to look at your code, but I find a mess of (unnecessary)
    JavaScript, and nested tables. Totally unnecessary.

    > Please feel free to look at source:
    > http://www.magicfreebiesuk.co.uk/testpage.html


    Compare your source with that of a nice three-column template by Ben
    Meadowcroft, using no tables at all, shown here:

    http://www.benmeadowcroft.com/webdev/csstemplates/3-column-with-footer.html

    Notice how un-complex it is. Which would you rather work on? :)

    --
    -bts
    -This space intentionally left blank.
     
    Beauregard T. Shagnasty, Apr 11, 2005
    #7
  8. "Dylan Parry" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk wrote:
    >
    > > I put those valign attributes in but they don't seem to have made any
    > > difference.

    >
    > No you haven't. The valign attribute belongs to the td elements, not to
    > the paragraphs.
    >
    > Looking at the rest of the code though, it is hardly a cut down example
    > of your problem is it? I had to sift through tons of really awful
    > looking code to find where you had gone wrong.
    >
    > --
    > Dylan Parry
    > http://webpageworkshop.co.uk -- FREE Web tutorials and references


    Thanks tonnie that worked a charm. Only just starting to get to grips with
    html and css, usually try and make frontpage do all the work.
     
    MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk, Apr 11, 2005
    #8
  9. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    Sid Ismail Guest

    On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 16:10:48 GMT, "MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk"
    <> wrote:

    : Is there
    : any way to make it so all of the text is aligned at the top of the columns
    : despite the amount of text in each of them?
    :
    : At the moment the text in the centre column starts at the top of the table
    : but the text on the left and right starts half way down.


    <td valign=top> will do it, but remember that the bottom portion
    will be blank then. The default is vertical align middle.

    Sid
     
    Sid Ismail, Apr 11, 2005
    #9
  10. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    Andy Dingley Guest

    On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 17:40:34 GMT, "MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk"
    <> wrote:

    >usually try and make frontpage do all the work.


    Well stop it. Frontpage is bloody awful and that's why your page is
    nasty.
     
    Andy Dingley, Apr 11, 2005
    #10
  11. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    Steve Pugh Guest

    "MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk" <> wrote:
    >"Steve Pugh" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> "MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk" <> wrote:
    >>
    >> >If, however, I put a lot of text in one of the columns, when I try and
    >> >imput text into one of the others it starts half way down the column.
    >> >Is there any way to make it so all of the text is aligned at the top of
    >> >the columns despite the amount of text in each of them?

    >>
    >> Yes. In CSS you would apply the vertical-align property, but in
    >> clunky, bad HTML like you seem to be using you would apply the valign
    >> attribute,
    >>

    >I put those valign attributes in but they don't seem to have made any
    >difference.
    >
    >Please feel free to look at source:
    >http://www.magicfreebiesuk.co.uk/testpage.html


    The valign attribute is an attribute that can be applied to <tr> or
    <th> or <td> elements. You've tried to apply it to <p> elements.

    There is a HTML specification you can refer to -
    http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/

    Steve
    --
    "My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
    I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

    Steve Pugh <> <http://steve.pugh.net/>
     
    Steve Pugh, Apr 11, 2005
    #11
  12. Beauregard T. Shagnasty wrote:

    > Compare your source with that of a nice three-column template by Ben
    > Meadowcroft, using no tables at all, shown here:


    > http://www.benmeadowcroft.com/webdev/csstemplates/3-column-with-footer.html


    That's odd -- or at least I *think* it's odd. If I scroll to the
    bottom, the footer comes up past the bottom part of the left-column
    image, leaving that part of the image hanging below the footer like a
    piece of toilet paper stuck to your shoe. :) At least I wouldn't want
    that to happen. Or maybe it's unavoidable.

    http://www.blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/footer.gif

    --
    Blinky Linux Registered User 297263
    Who has implemented Usenet Solution #45933:
    Now killing all posts originating at Google Groups
     
    Blinky the Shark, Apr 11, 2005
    #12
  13. Blinky the Shark wrote:

    > Beauregard T. Shagnasty wrote:


    >> Compare your source with that of a nice three-column template by Ben
    >> Meadowcroft, using no tables at all, shown here:


    >> http://www.benmeadowcroft.com/webdev/csstemplates/3-column-with-footer.html


    > That's odd -- or at least I *think* it's odd. If I scroll to the
    > bottom, the footer comes up past the bottom part of the left-column
    > image, leaving that part of the image hanging below the footer like a
    > piece of toilet paper stuck to your shoe. :) At least I wouldn't want
    > that to happen. Or maybe it's unavoidable.


    > http://www.blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/footer.gif


    <piggybacking my own post> Oink!

    I should've mentioned that that's Firefox. Same effect with Konqueror, but
    not with Opera.

    --
    Blinky Linux Registered User 297263
    Who has implemented Usenet Solution #45933:
    Now killing all posts originating at Google Groups
     
    Blinky the Shark, Apr 11, 2005
    #13
  14. Blinky the Shark wrote:

    >>http://www.blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/footer.gif

    >
    > <piggybacking my own post> Oink!
    >
    > I should've mentioned that that's Firefox. Same effect with Konqueror, but
    > not with Opera.


    Must be your operating system. <g> Works fine for me in W2K, FF
    1.0.2, Opera 7.54, IE6.

    --
    -bts
    -This space intentionally left blank.
     
    Beauregard T. Shagnasty, Apr 11, 2005
    #14
  15. Beauregard T. Shagnasty wrote:

    > Blinky the Shark wrote:


    >>>http://www.blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/footer.gif


    >> <piggybacking my own post> Oink!


    >> I should've mentioned that that's Firefox. Same effect with
    >> Konqueror, but not with Opera.


    > Must be your operating system. <g> Works fine for me in W2K, FF


    2K? Hey, didn't the year 2000 mark the end of The Windows Decade, and
    the Dawning Of The Age Of Something Else? :)

    > 1.0.2, Opera 7.54, IE6.


    FF 1.0 here; maybe that's the diff.

    --
    Blinky Linux Registered User 297263
    Who has implemented Usenet Solution #45933:
    Now killing all posts originating at Google Groups
     
    Blinky the Shark, Apr 11, 2005
    #15
  16. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    dorayme Guest

    > From: "Beauregard T. Shagnasty" <>

    snip

    > Compare your source with that of a nice three-column template by Ben
    > Meadowcroft, using no tables at all, shown here:
    >
    > http://www.benmeadowcroft.com/webdev/csstemplates/3-column-with-footer.html
    >
    > Notice how un-complex it is. Which would you rather work on? :)



    You are right but it is a pity that it breaks in some otherwise good
    browsers like IE 5 and Mozilla 1.3 on a Mac... It breaks horribly in IE but
    in Mozilla, only when one reduces the window size (a practice I personally
    find useful quite regularly), it is an irritation that is worrying me - I am
    not meaning to criticise you unduly. Recently, in frustration, I reverted a
    site I had made to the simplest 2 columns, 1 row table as a wrapper. It
    stabilised everything like magic! And I did what I hope is the kosher thing
    within these two simple cells. Just one table (with simple css valign and
    width settings, margins none) stopped all the breaking at small window
    sizes. Just could not figure things without - not so that I could trust it
    at least...

    dorayme
     
    dorayme, Apr 12, 2005
    #16
  17. On 2005-04-11 12:10:48 -0400, "MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk"
    <> said:

    > Hi,
    > I am using a table with three columns to display the main text on my site.


    Tables are for tabular data.
     
    William Hamby, Apr 12, 2005
    #17
  18. dorayme wrote:

    > You are right but it is a pity that it breaks in some otherwise
    > good browsers like IE 5 and Mozilla 1.3 on a Mac... It breaks
    > horribly in IE but in Mozilla, only when one reduces the window
    > size (a practice I personally find useful quite regularly), it is
    > an irritation that is worrying me


    Sorry, I don't have a Mac. Can you post a screen shot of Mac IE? Works
    fine in Win IE.

    > - I am not meaning to criticise you unduly.


    Not my template. <g> Write to Ben and tell him...

    --
    -bts
    -This space intentionally left blank.
     
    Beauregard T. Shagnasty, Apr 12, 2005
    #18
  19. MagicFreebiesUK.co.uk

    dorayme Guest

    > From: "Beauregard T. Shagnasty" <>

    >
    > dorayme wrote:
    >
    >> You are right but it is a pity that it breaks in some otherwise
    >> good browsers like IE 5 and Mozilla 1.3 on a Mac... It breaks
    >> horribly in IE but in Mozilla, only when one reduces the window
    >> size (a practice I personally find useful quite regularly), it is
    >> an irritation that is worrying me

    >
    > Sorry, I don't have a Mac. Can you post a screen shot of Mac IE? Works
    > fine in Win IE.
    >
    >> - I am not meaning to criticise you unduly.

    >
    > Not my template. <g> Write to Ben and tell him...



    Here are a couple of screen shots

    http://dorayme.150m.com/pics/inIEMac.jpg

    and

    http://dorayme.150m.com/pics/inMozilla1.3Mac.jpg


    dorayme
     
    dorayme, Apr 12, 2005
    #19
  20. dorayme wrote:
    >> From: "Beauregard T. Shagnasty" <>

    >
    >> Sorry, I don't have a Mac. Can you post a screen shot of Mac IE?
    >> Works fine in Win IE.

    >
    > Here are a couple of screen shots
    >
    > http://dorayme.150m.com/pics/inIEMac.jpg
    >
    > and
    >
    > http://dorayme.150m.com/pics/inMozilla1.3Mac.jpg


    Ok, thanks. I see what you mean now. Actually, it's the same in
    Windoze with IE or Moz or Firefox. You've narrowed the browser to
    somewhere around 250px wide. <g> Most all sites will fail that narrow.

    Ben's template does work fairly well at around 500px though, about all
    one can hope for with a 3-column design.

    Here's a grid for measuring windows. ;-)
    http://home.rochester.rr.com/bshagnasty/bgridmarginset.html

    --
    -bts
    -This space intentionally left blank.
     
    Beauregard T. Shagnasty, Apr 13, 2005
    #20
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