[QUIZ] Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)

Discussion in 'Ruby' started by Matthew Moss, Apr 4, 2008.

  1. Matthew Moss

    Matthew Moss Guest

    Well, I finally finished the move and caught up on sleep, and I'm now
    back and ready to start quizzing again. Keep in mind that the last
    quiz presented (i.e. Food Database) was removed for a rethink, so this
    week is again quiz #159.

    The three rules of Ruby Quiz 2:

    1. Please do not post any solutions or spoiler discussion for this
    quiz until 48 hours have passed from the time on this message.

    2. Support Ruby Quiz 2 by submitting ideas as often as you can! (A
    permanent, new website is in the works for Ruby Quiz 2. Until then,
    please visit the temporary website at

    <http://matthew.moss.googlepages.com/home>.

    3. Enjoy!

    Suggestion: A [QUIZ] in the subject of emails about the problem
    helps everyone on Ruby Talk follow the discussion. Please reply to
    the original quiz message, if you can.

    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

    Quiz #159
    Guardian of Middle-earth

    I'm a Tolkien fan, and I like computer games. So when the Lord of the
    Rings MMORPG showed up, I eagerly jumped into a virtual Middle-earth.
    My name is Gwalorin, I'm a Dwarf, a Guardian of the weak, and a
    drinker of many fine ales.

    In an effort to be more effective in combat, I'd like to study my past
    combats and learn what I can from them. Perhaps there is something in
    the combat log that can show me how to be a more effective Guardian.

    *** Your task this week will be to analyze the combat log and provide
    some statistics on attack types and creatures fought. ***

    What kind of statistics? At the least, you should include average
    damage inflicted per creature, and also average damage per attack
    type. As an example, your report might look like this:

    Creature Name Average
    ------------- -------
    Brush Hunter 52
    Brush Prowler 43
    Vile Moor-web 44

    Attack Name Average
    ----------- -------
    Bash 84
    Shield-blow 58
    Sting 40


    I'm making two combat logs available (compressed in zip format):
    Guardian[1] and Hunter[2]. Unzip these to get the combat logs as text
    files.

    To give you an idea of the information available, let's take a brief
    look at some parts of the combat log.

    The Brush Hunter wounds you with Melee Common Med for
    25 points of Common.

    We're interested in my effectiveness, not that of the creatures
    fought. You may ignore all lines that show a creature hitting me.

    You wound the Brush Hunter for 30 points of Common damage.
    You wound the Brush Hunter with Bash for 104 points of Common
    damage.

    Note that there are a couple, similar forms for reporting damage that
    I've inflicted. The first form is a simple, non-named attack; the
    second form is a special, named attack (in this case, called "Bash").

    From both of these forms, four pieces of information can be extracted:

    1. The creature hit (e.g. "Brush Hunter")
    2. The attack type (e.g. "Bash", or "Basic" for non-named)
    3. The amount of damage inflicted
    4. The type of damage inflicted (e.g. "Common")

    It is from this information that you should generate your report.

    If you want to go beyond basic averages, a few other suggestions
    include:

    * Minimums, maximums and frequency of use
    * Counts of creatures killed (based on lines such as "Your mighty
    blow defeated the Brush Hunter.")
    * Variation based on damage type (while my Guardian's combat log
    shows only Common damage, my Hunter's log has more variety).



    Finally, if you really want some extra credit, incorporate the
    following information about some of the skills. A fully-featured stats
    analyzer would take these into account.

    Guardian Skills:

    * Retaliation: Only available after a parry, each use of this
    skill may be followed by one of Overwhelm, Whirling Retaliation or
    Thrust.
    * Shield-swipe: Only available after a block, each use of this
    skill may be followed by Bash. Additionally, each use of Shield-swipe
    is potentially reported twice (i.e. swipe left followed by swipe
    right). Both swipes are part of a single attack. How do you determine
    whether two Shield-swipes count as one attack with two hits, or two
    separate attacks (the first with one hit and one miss)? If I inflict
    no other damage from other attack types between two Shield-swipes,
    then the two count as a single attack.
    * Sweeping Cut: Like Shield-swipe, this is actually two attacks in
    one; use the same guidelines as Shield-swipe for determining whether
    two cuts are part of the same attack or separate attacks. In
    additionally, Sweeping Cut may hit multiple foes -- any that are in
    range and in front of the Guardian.

    Hunter Skills:

    * Agile Rejoinder: Only available after a parry.
    * Blindside and Swift Bow: Both skills are like Shield-swipe
    above, allowing for two hits in one attack against one opponent.
    * Rain of Arrows: Hits multiple targets in close proximity.
    * Swift Bow: Another two attacks in one, against one opponent.
    * Quick Shot vs. Quick Shot: Elvish Arrow (and similar): These are
    both the same skill, the latter with Light Oil applied to the arrows
    (inflicts Light damage). A comparison of the same skill with and
    without using Light Oil would be interesting.


    [1] Guardian's combat log: http://www.splatbang.com/files/guardian.zip
    [2] Hunter's combat log: http://www.splatbang.com/files/hunter.zip
    Matthew Moss, Apr 4, 2008
    #1
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  2. Matthew Moss

    Alex Shulgin Guest

    Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)

    On Apr 4, 6:47 pm, Matthew Moss <> wrote:
    >
    > Quiz #159
    > Guardian of Middle-earth
    >

    [snip]
    >
    > *** Your task this week will be to analyze the combat log and provide
    > some statistics on attack types and creatures fought. ***
    >
    > What kind of statistics? At the least, you should include average
    > damage inflicted per creature, and also average damage per attack
    > type. As an example, your report might look like this:


    Pardon me if I appear to be speaking for the others, but to me this is
    one of the distracting `features' of the quiz lately--vague problem
    formulation. Personally, I have just too much of this stuff at
    work. :)

    To me, the appeal of the quiz is that problems are clearly formulated
    and can be solved in reasonable time. Also, put it one way or the
    other--the quiz is like a challenge, and it's always interesting to
    see how your solution compares to what others have come up with. When
    the problem statement is that vague, it's not very likely that anyone
    can reasonably compare his solution with any other one...

    Please come back to short, clearly stated quizzies, and I believe most
    of us will participate with great enthusiasm! :)

    --
    Hope this helps,
    Alex
    Alex Shulgin, Apr 9, 2008
    #2
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  3. Matthew Moss

    Matthew Moss Guest

    Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)


    > > What kind of statistics? At the least, you should include average
    > > damage inflicted per creature, and also average damage per attack
    > > type. As an example, your report might look like this:

    >
    > Pardon me if I appear to be speaking for the others, but to me this is
    > one of the distracting `features' of the quiz lately--vague problem
    > formulation. Personally, I have just too much of this stuff at
    > work. :)


    "Average damage per attack type" and "average damage inflicted per
    creature" is vague?
    Matthew Moss, Apr 9, 2008
    #3
  4. Matthew Moss

    Alex Shulgin Guest

    Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)

    On Apr 10, 1:14 am, Matthew Moss <> wrote:
    > > > What kind of statistics? At the least, you should include average
    > > > damage inflicted per creature, and also average damage per attack
    > > > type. As an example, your report might look like this:

    >
    > > Pardon me if I appear to be speaking for the others, but to me this is
    > > one of the distracting `features' of the quiz lately--vague problem
    > > formulation. Personally, I have just too much of this stuff at
    > > work. :)

    >
    > "Average damage per attack type" and "average damage inflicted per
    > creature" is vague?


    Well, not really. :)

    But there's also "at the least" and "your report _might_ look like
    this" and then you go into great detail no one would really get if
    he's not a Lord of the Rings MMORPG fan too, IMHO.

    As a quiz solver, it's much more rewarding being creative in actually
    _solving_ the quiz rather than detailing/improving the quiz problem
    statement, I believe.

    --
    Kindest regards,
    Alex
    Alex Shulgin, Apr 10, 2008
    #4
  5. Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)

    On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 04:25:11 +0900, Alex Shulgin <>
    wrote:
    > On Apr 4, 6:47 pm, Matthew Moss <> wrote:
    >>
    >> Quiz #159
    >> Guardian of Middle-earth
    >>

    > [snip]
    >>
    >> *** Your task this week will be to analyze the combat log and provide
    >> some statistics on attack types and creatures fought. ***
    >>
    >> What kind of statistics? At the least, you should include average
    >> damage inflicted per creature, and also average damage per attack
    >> type. As an example, your report might look like this:

    >
    > Pardon me if I appear to be speaking for the others, but to me this is
    > one of the distracting `features' of the quiz lately--vague problem
    > formulation. Personally, I have just too much of this stuff at
    > work. :)
    >
    > To me, the appeal of the quiz is that problems are clearly formulated
    > and can be solved in reasonable time. Also, put it one way or the
    > other--the quiz is like a challenge, and it's always interesting to
    > see how your solution compares to what others have come up with. When
    > the problem statement is that vague, it's not very likely that anyone
    > can reasonably compare his solution with any other one...
    >
    > Please come back to short, clearly stated quizzies, and I believe most
    > of us will participate with great enthusiasm! :)


    I fully agree with what Alex wrote.

    On top of that I would like to add that it is crucial for my participation
    that I can create a working solution within a couple of hours of starting
    to read the challenge.

    Any time requirement above two hours greatly diminishes the chance that I
    will find the time to finish a solution within the 48 hour timelimit.
    Weekends are family time, and time for participating in full day
    activities, so ruby quizzes are solved in the late evenings or early
    mornings.

    The earlier quizzes were attractive because the challenges was so unlike
    what I do at work. Parsing simple file formats, doing basic statistics on
    their content and trying to figure out "what the customer wants" from
    reading vague jargon filled texts is something people pay me to do at work.


    Please get the quiz back to the purely artifical simplistic world of CS ;-)

    Kristian
    Kristian Elof Sørensen, Apr 10, 2008
    #5
  6. Matthew Moss

    Todd Benson Guest

    Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)

    On Thu, Apr 10, 2008 at 5:32 AM, Kristian Elof S=F8rensen <> wr=
    ote:
    > I fully agree with what Alex wrote.


    I'm not so sure. I think maybe just the way it was worded turned me
    off, but I wouldn't call it overly "vague". I think it's a perfectly
    fine quiz.

    The paragraph that threw me off a little was:

    "We're interested in my effectiveness, not that of the creatures
    fought. You may ignore all lines that show a creature hitting me."

    I was, at first, thinking effectiveness would take into account
    defense as well as offense.

    Todd
    Todd Benson, Apr 10, 2008
    #6
  7. Matthew Moss

    ThoML Guest

    Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)

    > "Average damage per attack type" and "average damage inflicted per
    > creature" is vague?


    It's probably more difficult than it looks like at first sight to find
    the right balance between being too vague and telling to much. In this
    quiz, "average damage" was a little bit of a downer for me since it
    clearly stated what has to be done -- and which IMHO didn't sound like
    too much fun but rather like something I have done quite a few times
    before.

    I also think it would be better to avoid any statements about extra
    credits (unless you ask for a demonstration of very advanced
    wizardry).

    I liked the LOTR setting though. I think it's a good idea to wrap up
    CS problems so that they sound like fun. Nevertheless, there still has
    to be a problem that's intriguing enough to make people want to solve
    it. As the weather is getting warmer on the Northern hemisphere ...
    okay, this means it's getting colder on the Southern one. Well, time
    is precious.

    I was rather surprised to see the number 159 again. IMHO Erik V's
    solution for the original #159 quiz would have well been worth a short
    review/mention.

    I look forward to reading about the next quiz.
    ThoML, Apr 10, 2008
    #7
  8. Matthew Moss

    Matthew Moss Guest

    Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)


    > On top of that I would like to add that it is crucial for my participation
    > that I can create a working solution within a couple of hours of starting
    > to read the challenge.


    I had a basic solution working in 10 minutes.

    I suppose that a lot of the extra wording of the quiz was my attempt
    to head off questions. Instead of keeping the quiz description short
    and allowing discussion, I've attempted to try and answer everything
    about the quiz in the initial description, which makes it look much
    more involved than it needs to be. And really, I shouldn't be
    attempting to head off questions... half the fun is the discussion
    that follows.

    Okay, I think what I'll do is take this same quiz and rewrite it for
    tomorrow, and we'll try it again. (This will be easier to rewrite than
    the Food Database quiz, which I'm still considering how to break
    down.)
    Matthew Moss, Apr 10, 2008
    #8
  9. Matthew Moss

    Matthew Moss Guest

    Re: Guardian of Middle-earth (#159)


    > The paragraph that threw me off a little was:
    >
    > "We're interested in my effectiveness, not that of the creatures
    > fought. You may ignore all lines that show a creature hitting me."
    >
    > I was, at first, thinking effectiveness would take into account
    > defense as well as offense.


    Initially, my thought was that there wasn't really any good
    information there, but I think I agree with you... no reason that
    information couldn't be collected as well.
    Matthew Moss, Apr 10, 2008
    #9
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