Sudden doubling of nearly all messages

Discussion in 'Python' started by Dave Angel, Jul 21, 2012.

  1. Dave Angel

    Dave Angel Guest

    Has anybody else noticed the sudden double-posting of nearly all
    messages in the python mailing list?

    Previously, I've seen some messages double posted, and it was nearly
    always a newbie, presumably posting via some low-end gateway. But now
    i'm noticing nearly every message appears twice, identical datestamps,
    and usually one message considered a reply to the other.

    Deleting these locally is not only a pain, but if I get the wrong one,
    it messes up the threading.

    I'm using Thunderbird 14.0 on Linux 11.04, with mail configured for
    non-digest mode. I read the messages in threaded mode.

    Probably related, I've had a serious spate of messages are obvious Re:
    types, but not threaded to the original set. I'm guessing because it's
    because I earlier deleted one of a pair.

    --

    DaveA
     
    Dave Angel, Jul 21, 2012
    #1
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  2. On 21/07/2012 6:48 AM, Dave Angel wrote:
    > Has anybody else noticed the sudden double-posting of nearly all
    > messages in the python mailing list?
    >


    No.

    Colin W.
     
    Colin J. Williams, Jul 21, 2012
    #2
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  3. Dave Angel

    Rick Johnson Guest

    On Saturday, July 21, 2012 5:48:29 AM UTC-5, Dave Angel wrote:
    > Has anybody else noticed the sudden double-posting of nearly all
    > messages in the python mailing list?
    >
    > Previously, I've seen some messages double posted, and it was nearly
    > always a newbie, presumably posting via some low-end gateway. But now
    > i'm noticing nearly every message appears twice, identical datestamps,
    > and usually one message considered a reply to the other.


    It's due to the new Google Groups interface. They started forcing everyone to use the new buggy version about a week ago EVEN THOUGH the old interfaceis just fine. Another bug: If you look at the text i quoted you will see HTML character references. Usually i clean the text before posting but sometimes i forget.

    Google is starting to SUCK!

    You know, i really went out of my way to support Google for many years eventhough i knew they were spying on me. But since they were giving me "interesting software" for free, i did not mind so much. But now they have dropped great software and refuse to maintain the software they do have.

    Their online docs were a great idea, but have you ever tried to use the docs interface for anything serious? S-U-C-K-S!

    Seriously, i can see Google going the way of yahoo soon. Heck, i even use Bing as my search engine now. I MUST be a disgruntled customer if i am usingthe search engine of the evil empire!

    It was a nice run Google. We had good times and bad times. A few smiles andcries.

    LMBTFY
     
    Rick Johnson, Jul 21, 2012
    #3
  4. Dave Angel

    Rick Johnson Guest

    On Saturday, July 21, 2012 5:48:29 AM UTC-5, Dave Angel wrote:
    > Has anybody else noticed the sudden double-posting of nearly all
    > messages in the python mailing list?
    >
    > Previously, I've seen some messages double posted, and it was nearly
    > always a newbie, presumably posting via some low-end gateway. But now
    > i'm noticing nearly every message appears twice, identical datestamps,
    > and usually one message considered a reply to the other.


    It's due to the new Google Groups interface. They started forcing everyone to use the new buggy version about a week ago EVEN THOUGH the old interfaceis just fine. Another bug: If you look at the text i quoted you will see HTML character references. Usually i clean the text before posting but sometimes i forget.

    Google is starting to SUCK!

    You know, i really went out of my way to support Google for many years eventhough i knew they were spying on me. But since they were giving me "interesting software" for free, i did not mind so much. But now they have dropped great software and refuse to maintain the software they do have.

    Their online docs were a great idea, but have you ever tried to use the docs interface for anything serious? S-U-C-K-S!

    Seriously, i can see Google going the way of yahoo soon. Heck, i even use Bing as my search engine now. I MUST be a disgruntled customer if i am usingthe search engine of the evil empire!

    It was a nice run Google. We had good times and bad times. A few smiles andcries.

    LMBTFY
     
    Rick Johnson, Jul 21, 2012
    #4
  5. On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 4:16 AM, Rick Johnson
    <> wrote:
    > It was a nice run Google. We had good times and bad times. A few smiles and cries.
    >
    > LMBTFY


    So, what... you reckon Microsoft is going to be the paragon of
    righteousness against the squalor of Google's information-grubbing
    tactics? Fascinating.

    Oh, and make sure you get yourself a new email address Rick, can't
    have you connected with *Google* mail now can we.

    Use whichever service you like, but don't seriously expect anything
    that you don't pay money for to be perfectly featured AND not spy on
    you.

    ChrisA
     
    Chris Angelico, Jul 21, 2012
    #5
  6. On Sat, Jul 21, 2012 at 2:25 PM, Chris Angelico <> wrote:
    > On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 4:16 AM, Rick Johnson
    > <> wrote:
    >> It was a nice run Google. We had good times and bad times. A few smiles and cries.
    >>
    >> LMBTFY

    >
    > So, what... you reckon Microsoft is going to be the paragon of
    > righteousness against the squalor of Google's information-grubbing
    > tactics? Fascinating.


    It's happened before. The example that made me really realize this was
    when my university, the University of Toronto, was considering both
    Microsoft and Google as mail providers for students last year. They
    chose Microsoft, to a mass of student responses to the effect of "but
    Microsoft is Evil!". It turns out that they ended up choosing
    Microsoft because they gave stronger privacy guarantees.

    People hold grudges against MS too strongly, and they believe too much
    in Google's righteousness. They are both big companies that don't
    necessarily care about you.

    -- Devin
     
    Devin Jeanpierre, Jul 22, 2012
    #6
  7. On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 9:07 AM, Devin Jeanpierre
    <> wrote:
    > People hold grudges against MS too strongly, and they believe too much
    > in Google's righteousness. They are both big companies that don't
    > necessarily care about you.


    Just to clarify, I'm not advocating the "Google is perfect" stance
    either; in both cases you're looking at a huge company and a
    zero-dollar service. That means you're completely at their mercy in
    terms of feature support, and you're most likely going to have your
    information harvested as a means of spamming you with ads.

    And as you can see from the headers, I use gmail too. I'm fully aware
    that they're scanning my emails to target the ads I see; it doesn't
    bother me. I have another email address at a domain that I own, with
    the mail server being an actual computer that I own, and Google's
    welcome to read through all my mailing list posts.

    It'd be no different if python.org provided their own free-to-use
    webmail service. I'd be assuming you guys are targeting me with ads,
    and it wouldn't bother me. :)

    ChrisA
     
    Chris Angelico, Jul 22, 2012
    #7
  8. On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 06:48:29 -0400, Dave Angel wrote:

    > Has anybody else noticed the sudden double-posting of nearly all
    > messages in the python mailing list?


    No I have not.

    It sounds like a problem with your Usenet provider. Remember that this
    news group is a mirror of the mailing list so you
    can check the mail archives to see if the problem is there. It is also
    mirrored by gmane (I *think* it is gmane.comp.python.general).


    > Previously, I've seen some messages double posted, and it was nearly
    > always a newbie, presumably posting via some low-end gateway.


    Some people also annoyingly send to both the newsgroup *and* the mailing
    list, not realising -- or not caring -- that they are the same thing.



    --
    Steven
     
    Steven D'Aprano, Jul 22, 2012
    #8
  9. On Sun, 22 Jul 2012 04:25:21 +1000, Chris Angelico wrote:

    > Use whichever service you like, but don't seriously expect anything that
    > you don't pay money for to be perfectly featured AND not spy on you.



    http://duckduckgo.com/privacy.html



    --
    Steven
     
    Steven D'Aprano, Jul 22, 2012
    #9
  10. On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 19:07:28 -0400, Devin Jeanpierre wrote:


    > People hold grudges against MS too strongly, and they believe too much
    > in Google's righteousness. They are both big companies that don't
    > necessarily care about you.


    +10000

    Google's motto "Don't be evil" should really be, "Don't be evil unless
    there's a lot of money in it".

    I personally know a couple of people working for Google, and their famed
    geek-friendly work environment is not all it is cracked up to be either.

    I think the IT world is better now than it was 10 years ago, because an
    industry dominated by three big, competing entities who hate each other
    (Microsoft, Apple, Google) is better than a monopoly of one (Microsoft).
    But we, the users and consumers, should never make the mistake of
    thinking that *any* of the three have our best interests at heart.


    --
    Steven
     
    Steven D'Aprano, Jul 22, 2012
    #10
  11. Dave Angel

    Dave Angel Guest

    On 07/21/2012 08:13 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
    > On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 06:48:29 -0400, Dave Angel wrote:
    >
    >> Has anybody else noticed the sudden double-posting of nearly all
    >> messages in the python mailing list?

    > No I have not.
    >
    > It sounds like a problem with your Usenet provider. Remember that this
    > news group is a mirror of the mailing list so you
    > can check the mail archives to see if the problem is there. It is also
    > mirrored by gmane (I *think* it is gmane.comp.python.general).
    >


    I don't have a usenet provider, I use the straight email, collected as
    regular email, by Thunderbird. I thought for a while that perhaps my
    imap provider had hiccupped, and just reloaded all the same messages.
    But it happened in several sessions, and for the messages I checked, the
    emails were *NOT* identical.

    >> Previously, I've seen some messages double posted, and it was nearly
    >> always a newbie, presumably posting via some low-end gateway.

    > Some people also annoyingly send to both the newsgroup *and* the mailing
    > list, not realising -- or not caring -- that they are the same thing.
    >
    >
    >

    That may be because many other messages (including this one from you)
    list the newsgroup in the headers, so a reply-all generates it as one of
    the recipients. The only reason I don't fall into that trap is that I
    have Thunderbird configured to *not* send to any newsgroup.



    --

    DaveA
     
    Dave Angel, Jul 22, 2012
    #11
  12. On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 10:20 AM, Steven D'Aprano
    <> wrote:
    > On Sun, 22 Jul 2012 04:25:21 +1000, Chris Angelico wrote:
    >
    >> Use whichever service you like, but don't seriously expect anything that
    >> you don't pay money for to be perfectly featured AND not spy on you.

    >
    > http://duckduckgo.com/privacy.html


    They go for privacy at the cost of everything else, and that's fine.
    But you still can't depend on its featureset. With a mailing list /
    newsgroup reader, there's a whole lot of little things that you'd
    probably like, but you can't depend on it; such things cost money, and
    most companies that give you stuff that cost money without charging
    you money are going to be selling ad space, ergo the temptation to
    harvest information about you.

    But as I said, I don't care. Google doesn't get any information about
    me that I'm not willing for them to get. Let 'em show me ads. And
    sometimes they're even useful!

    ChrisA
     
    Chris Angelico, Jul 22, 2012
    #12
  13. Dave Angel

    Rick Johnson Guest

    On Saturday, July 21, 2012 6:16:24 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote:

    > Just to clarify, I'm not advocating the

    [...snip...]

    Well. Well. Backpedaling AND brown-nosing in a single post. Nice!
     
    Rick Johnson, Jul 22, 2012
    #13
  14. Dave Angel

    Rick Johnson Guest

    On Saturday, July 21, 2012 6:16:24 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote:

    > Just to clarify, I'm not advocating the

    [...snip...]

    Well. Well. Backpedaling AND brown-nosing in a single post. Nice!
     
    Rick Johnson, Jul 22, 2012
    #14
  15. On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 11:33 AM, Rick Johnson
    <> wrote:
    > On Saturday, July 21, 2012 6:16:24 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote:
    >
    >> Just to clarify, I'm not advocating the

    > [...snip...]
    >
    > Well. Well. Backpedaling AND brown-nosing in a single post. Nice!


    Absolutely. Haven't you noticed that I'm one of those mad people who
    goes everywhere in reverse? My backpedal is saying the exact same
    thing as my frontpedal!

    Curiouser and curiouser...

    ChrisA
     
    Chris Angelico, Jul 22, 2012
    #15
  16. Dave Angel

    Rotwang Guest

    On 21/07/2012 19:16, Rick Johnson wrote:
    > [...]
    >
    > It's due to the new Google Groups interface. They started forcing everyone to use the new buggy version about a week ago EVEN THOUGH the old interface is just fine.


    I disagree - the old interface was dreadful and needed fixing.

    The new one is much worse, obviously.

    --
    I have made a thing that superficially resembles music:

    http://soundcloud.com/eroneity/we-berated-our-own-crapiness
     
    Rotwang, Jul 22, 2012
    #16
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