WFL, work flow language

Discussion in 'Java' started by Roedy Green, May 26, 2004.

  1. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    Years ago, Burroughs had an Algol-like scripting language called WFL,
    Work Flow Language. You compiled it. It had proper ifs, loops etc.,
    none of this mickey mouse goto stuff you put up with in Microsoft BAT
    language.

    I was thinking perhaps something similar is needed for Java.

    Java bangs into portability problems as soon as you involve any BAT
    files or other scripts. You want to do ALL this stuff with Java itself
    to keep it completely portable.

    I can think of several possible approaches:

    1. writing a platform independent scripting language in Java.

    2. Using Java itself as the scripting language, augmented with various
    classes to make common tasks such as copying files easier. It might
    work by constructing Java programs that are compiled on the fly.

    3. implementing some well known scripting language in Java.

    4. Using JPython as the scripting language, which use the JVM.
    --
    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    Coaching, problem solving, economical contract programming.
    See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jgloss.html for The Java Glossary.
    Roedy Green, May 26, 2004
    #1
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  2. Roedy Green

    Murray Guest

    > 2. Using Java itself as the scripting language, augmented with various
    > classes to make common tasks such as copying files easier. It might
    > work by constructing Java programs that are compiled on the fly.
    >
    > 3. implementing some well known scripting language in Java.
    >
    > 4. Using JPython as the scripting language, which use the JVM.


    Are you familiar with Groovy? Worth checking out if you haven't already

    http://groovy.codehaus.org/

    Recently submitted as a JSR: http://www.jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=241
    Murray, May 26, 2004
    #2
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  3. Roedy Green

    John Davison Guest

    Roedy Green wrote:

    > Years ago, Burroughs had an Algol-like scripting language called WFL,
    > Work Flow Language. You compiled it. It had proper ifs, loops etc.,
    > none of this mickey mouse goto stuff you put up with in Microsoft BAT
    > language.
    >
    > I was thinking perhaps something similar is needed for Java.
    >
    > Java bangs into portability problems as soon as you involve any BAT
    > files or other scripts. You want to do ALL this stuff with Java itself
    > to keep it completely portable.
    >
    > I can think of several possible approaches:
    >
    > 1. writing a platform independent scripting language in Java.
    >
    > 2. Using Java itself as the scripting language, augmented with various
    > classes to make common tasks such as copying files easier. It might
    > work by constructing Java programs that are compiled on the fly.
    >
    > 3. implementing some well known scripting language in Java.
    >
    > 4. Using JPython as the scripting language, which use the JVM.


    Well, you could always use a scripting language that already *is*
    portable, like Perl. I don't know why anyone would use .bat files these
    days, unless that's all they knew.

    Perhaps I'm reading this wrong, but it sounds to me like you want to
    reinvent a wheel that is already around in different shapes, sizes and
    colors.

    - john
    John Davison, May 26, 2004
    #3
  4. Roedy Green wrote:


    > Java bangs into portability problems as soon as you involve any BAT
    > files or other scripts. You want to do ALL this stuff with Java itself
    > to keep it completely portable.
    >
    > I can think of several possible approaches:
    >
    > 1. writing a platform independent scripting language in Java.
    >
    > 2. Using Java itself as the scripting language, augmented with various
    > classes to make common tasks such as copying files easier. It might
    > work by constructing Java programs that are compiled on the fly.


    I don't know WFL and I have only once used BeanShell so I can't compare
    those two but I think BeanShell comes close to "Using Java itself as the
    scripting language". Maybe you already know about it but if not here is
    a link
    http://www.beanshell.org

    > 3. implementing some well known scripting language in Java.


    As you already know about JPython you already know about existing Python
    implementations in Java. Other scripting languages are also already
    implemented, for instance the Rhino engine from Mozilla.org implements
    JavaScript. jedit has a plugin called SuperScript which lists support
    for NetRexx, Perl, Ruby (and others) so there seem to be Java
    implementations for those languages as well although I haven't used that
    plugin myself.




    --

    Martin Honnen
    http://JavaScript.FAQTs.com/
    Martin Honnen, May 26, 2004
    #4
  5. John Davison schrieb:
    > Well, you could always use a scripting language that already *is*
    > portable, like Perl. I don't know why anyone would use .bat files these
    > days, unless that's all they knew.


    Because they don't require any additionally software installation. I might
    assume that Perl is installed on a *nix box, but I is surely not installed
    on a wide base of Windows boxes....

    Thomas
    Thomas Kellerer, May 26, 2004
    #5
  6. Roedy Green

    Roedy Green Guest

    On Wed, 26 May 2004 08:34:54 -0400, John Davison
    <> wrote or quoted :

    >Perhaps I'm reading this wrong, but it sounds to me like you want to
    >reinvent a wheel that is already around in different shapes, sizes and
    >colors.


    Perl's syntax it too disgusting, even worse than bat language. It has
    got the portable right, but I'm after something with a more Javaeseque
    syntax.

    Whatever it is has to be embraced by sun, so you can guarantee it is
    available an each decent size platform, and that there is a platform
    independent way of accessing it.

    --
    Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
    Coaching, problem solving, economical contract programming.
    See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jgloss.html for The Java Glossary.
    Roedy Green, May 26, 2004
    #6
  7. On Wed, 26 May 2004 19:29:41 GMT, Roedy Green wrote:

    > Perl's syntax it too disgusting, even worse than bat language.


    What have you got against bat language?
    Is it something about sonar in general?
    What are your thoughts on dolphin and
    porpoise language then? ;-)

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
    http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
    http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology
    Andrew Thompson, May 26, 2004
    #7
  8. Roedy Green

    Bryce Guest

    On Wed, 26 May 2004 09:32:08 GMT, Roedy Green
    <> wrote:

    >Years ago, Burroughs had an Algol-like scripting language called WFL,
    >Work Flow Language. You compiled it. It had proper ifs, loops etc.,
    >none of this mickey mouse goto stuff you put up with in Microsoft BAT
    >language.
    >
    >I was thinking perhaps something similar is needed for Java.
    >
    >Java bangs into portability problems as soon as you involve any BAT
    >files or other scripts. You want to do ALL this stuff with Java itself
    >to keep it completely portable.
    >
    >I can think of several possible approaches:
    >
    >1. writing a platform independent scripting language in Java.
    >
    >2. Using Java itself as the scripting language, augmented with various
    >classes to make common tasks such as copying files easier. It might
    >work by constructing Java programs that are compiled on the fly.
    >
    >3. implementing some well known scripting language in Java.
    >
    >4. Using JPython as the scripting language, which use the JVM.


    Aren't there some standard Workflow related languages?

    XML - Process Definition Language (PDL)
    http://www.wfmc.org/

    ebXML
    www.ebxml.org



    --
    now with more cowbell
    Bryce, May 26, 2004
    #8
  9. Thomas Kellerer <> wrote:
    > John Davison schrieb:
    >> Well, you could always use a scripting language that already *is*
    >> portable, like Perl. I don't know why anyone would use .bat files these
    >> days, unless that's all they knew.

    >
    > Because they don't require any additionally software installation. I might
    > assume that Perl is installed on a *nix box, but I is surely not installed
    > on a wide base of Windows boxes....


    But it's easy to get and doesn't cost anything. So there shouldn't be a big
    problem getting it. ActiveState has, for several years, published a great
    Perl interpreter for Windows. Its homepage is:

    http://activestate.com/Products/ActivePerl/

    **SJS (not associated with ActiveState, just a satisfied customer)

    --
    JustThe.net Internet & New Media Services, Apple Valley, CA PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
    Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / 888.480.4NET (4638) /
    Domain Names, $9.95/yr, 24x7 service: http://DomainNames.JustThe.net/
    "someone once called me a sofa, but i didn't feel compelled to rush out and buy
    slip covers." -adam brower * Hiroshima '45, Chernobyl '86, Windows 98/2000/2003
    Steven J Sobol, May 27, 2004
    #9
  10. Andrew Thompson <> wrote:
    > On Wed, 26 May 2004 19:29:41 GMT, Roedy Green wrote:
    >
    >> Perl's syntax it too disgusting, even worse than bat language.

    >
    > What have you got against bat language?


    Since when are batch files and shell scripts portable?

    Shell scripts often aren't even portable between different shells on the
    same computer!!

    --
    JustThe.net Internet & New Media Services, Apple Valley, CA PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
    Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / 888.480.4NET (4638) /
    Domain Names, $9.95/yr, 24x7 service: http://DomainNames.JustThe.net/
    "someone once called me a sofa, but i didn't feel compelled to rush out and buy
    slip covers." -adam brower * Hiroshima '45, Chernobyl '86, Windows 98/2000/2003
    Steven J Sobol, May 27, 2004
    #10
  11. "Roedy Green" <> wrote in message
    > I can think of several possible approaches:
    >
    > 1. writing a platform independent scripting language in Java.
    >


    And you could name it JavaScript! Oh ... that would be funny :)

    Shane


    --
    "Donuts. Is there anything they can't do?" - Homer Simpson
    Shane Mingins, May 27, 2004
    #11
  12. On Wed, 26 May 2004 18:25:10 -0500, Steven J Sobol wrote:
    > Andrew Thompson <> wrote:
    >> On Wed, 26 May 2004 19:29:41 GMT, Roedy Green wrote:
    >>
    >>> Perl's syntax it too disgusting, even worse than bat language.

    >>
    >> What have you got against bat language?

    >
    > Since when are batch files and shell scripts portable?


    I think you need to take that comment of
    mine in cotext with the one immediately
    beneath it.
    "Is it something about sonar in general?"

    ;-)

    --
    Andrew Thompson
    http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
    http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
    http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology
    Andrew Thompson, May 27, 2004
    #12
  13. Andrew Thompson <> wrote:

    > I think you need to take that comment of
    > mine in cotext with the one immediately
    > beneath it.
    > "Is it something about sonar in general?"


    Duh. :)

    --
    JustThe.net Internet & New Media Services, Apple Valley, CA PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
    Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / 888.480.4NET (4638) /
    Domain Names, $9.95/yr, 24x7 service: http://DomainNames.JustThe.net/
    "someone once called me a sofa, but i didn't feel compelled to rush out and buy
    slip covers." -adam brower * Hiroshima '45, Chernobyl '86, Windows 98/2000/2003
    Steven J Sobol, May 27, 2004
    #13
  14. Roedy Green wrote:
    > Years ago, Burroughs had an Algol-like scripting language called WFL,
    > Work Flow Language. You compiled it. It had proper ifs, loops etc.,
    > none of this mickey mouse goto stuff you put up with in Microsoft BAT

    [...]

    Check out <http://www.judoscript.com/>. A powerful JVM based scripting
    language.

    -BG
    Dr Brendan Gowing, May 28, 2004
    #14
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