Beginning C++

Discussion in 'C++' started by Ari W., Oct 18, 2004.

  1. Ari W.

    Ari W. Guest

    Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
    hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
    tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
    and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
    that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
    familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
    am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
    familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
    jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
    also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
    be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
    I hope I get some answers.

    -- Ari Winokur

    ari_winokur at comcast dot net
    Ari W., Oct 18, 2004
    #1
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  2. "Ari W." <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
    > hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
    > tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
    > and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
    > that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
    > familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
    > am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
    > familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
    > jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
    > also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
    > be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
    > I hope I get some answers.
    >


    I don't think C++ is a suitable language for throwing together small
    programs. Its a difficult language to master and unless you are prepared to
    study hard and use it a lot its not going to repay any investment you make.
    VB, C# and Java all sound more suitable for what you want to do. Perhaps
    even better would be scripting languages such as Python and Ruby, but I
    don't know much about those.

    Everyone learns in a different way, so if course ain't your thing then maybe
    you need a good book and some self study. Tools (e.g. compilers) for many
    languages are free. And of course the internet is a great resource for
    reference and specific problems, just don't expect to learn a language from
    a web site.

    John
    John Harrison, Oct 18, 2004
    #2
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  3. Ari W.

    Mike Wahler Guest

    "Ari W." <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
    > hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
    > tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
    > and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
    > that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
    > familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
    > am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
    > familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
    > jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
    > also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
    > be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
    > I hope I get some answers.


    See my reply to this same question you posted to
    'alt.comp.lang.learn.c-c++.

    Also, if you want to post the same message to more than
    one group, don't post them separately, crosspost them.
    (Look this stuff up if you don't understand what I mean).

    -Mike
    Mike Wahler, Oct 18, 2004
    #3
  4. Ari W. wrote:
    > Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
    > hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
    > tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
    > and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
    > that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
    > familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
    > am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
    > familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
    > jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
    > also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
    > be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
    > I hope I get some answers.
    >
    > -- Ari Winokur
    >
    > ari_winokur at comcast dot net


    Use your favorite newsgroup search engine and search for
    the key word "learning". I am sure that you find that
    this question has been asked, a lot, lately.

    By the way, the preferred method to resolving issues
    is to consult the FAQ first, the welcome.txt and then
    search the newsgroups and web. I've found many answers
    using that protocol.

    --
    Thomas Matthews

    C++ newsgroup welcome message:
    http://www.slack.net/~shiva/welcome.txt
    C++ Faq: http://www.parashift.com/c -faq-lite
    C Faq: http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/c-faq/top.html
    alt.comp.lang.learn.c-c++ faq:
    http://www.comeaucomputing.com/learn/faq/
    Other sites:
    http://www.josuttis.com -- C++ STL Library book
    Thomas Matthews, Oct 19, 2004
    #4
  5. Ari W. wrote:

    > Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
    > hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
    > tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
    > and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
    > that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
    > familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
    > am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
    > familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
    > jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
    > also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
    > be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
    > I hope I get some answers.



    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys/learningcpp.htm



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 20, 2004
    #5
  6. In article <>,
    says...
    > VB, C# and Java all sound more suitable for what you want to do. Perhaps
    > even better would be scripting languages such as Python and Ruby, but I
    > don't know much about those.


    It all depends on the available documentation and environment.
    If compatibility is not an issue, I would doubtless recommend Ruby. But
    then he would possibly need the appropriate book at hand (Programming
    Ruby by Thomas/Hunt avail. from AW). But online docu is also available.
    Ruby is IMHO the most object-oriented scripting language and therefore a
    good preparation for C++.
    Also, it is very easy to read, which should help.

    Michael B.
    Michael Bruschkewitz, Oct 21, 2004
    #6
  7. John Harrison wrote:

    > I don't think C++ is a suitable language for throwing together small
    > programs.



    Here we go again.




    > Its a difficult language to master and unless you are prepared to
    > study hard and use it a lot its not going to repay any investment you make.
    > VB, C# and Java all sound more suitable for what you want to do.



    I think someone must tell you that you are telling crap. I know it
    sounds harsh, but someone had to tell you the truth some day.





    > Perhaps
    > even better would be scripting languages such as Python and Ruby, but I
    > don't know much about those.
    >
    > Everyone learns in a different way, so if course ain't your thing then maybe
    > you need a good book and some self study. Tools (e.g. compilers) for many
    > languages are free. And of course the internet is a great resource for
    > reference and specific problems, just don't expect to learn a language from
    > a web site.



    Stop trolling.



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 21, 2004
    #7
  8. Michael Bruschkewitz wrote:

    > It all depends on the available documentation and environment.
    > If compatibility is not an issue, I would doubtless recommend Ruby.



    Right. He should let C++ to get on... Ruby.



    > But
    > then he would possibly need the appropriate book at hand (Programming
    > Ruby by Thomas/Hunt avail. from AW). But online docu is also available.
    > Ruby is IMHO the most object-oriented scripting language and therefore a
    > good preparation for C++.
    > Also, it is very easy to read, which should help.




    Thank you for sharing your insight with us.



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 21, 2004
    #8
  9. >
    >
    > Stop trolling.
    >


    Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.

    john
    John Harrison, Oct 21, 2004
    #9
  10. John Harrison wrote:

    > Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.



    One person asked how he can start learning C++ in comp.lang.c++, and
    instead of providing some information on this you tell him to move to
    C#, VB and Java (and 2 other idiots to Ruby).

    That is trolling.



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 21, 2004
    #10
  11. "Ioannis Vranos" <> wrote in message
    news:1098355011.539867@athnrd02...
    > John Harrison wrote:
    >
    > > Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.

    >
    >
    > One person asked how he can start learning C++ in comp.lang.c++, and
    > instead of providing some information on this you tell him to move to
    > C#, VB and Java (and 2 other idiots to Ruby).
    >
    > That is trolling.
    >


    From the OP's original post

    > This is why I am
    > also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
    > be useful.


    I just didn't think that C++ was the best for him, I could easily be wrong
    but I was just offering my opinion. Not sure why you took it so personally.

    john
    John Harrison, Oct 21, 2004
    #11
  12. Ari W.

    Phlip Guest

    Ioannis Vranos wrote:

    > > Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.

    >
    > One person asked how he can start learning C++ in comp.lang.c++, and
    > instead of providing some information on this you tell him to move to
    > C#, VB and Java (and 2 other idiots to Ruby).
    >
    > That is trolling.


    Ioannis, please come down off that cross. We need to use the wood.

    Many newbies think C++ is the first language they should learn. Disagreeing
    with you is not trolling, and calling your fellow regulars "idiots" lowers
    your image here.

    --
    Phlip
    http://industrialxp.org/community/bin/view/Main/TestFirstUserInterfaces
    Phlip, Oct 21, 2004
    #12
  13. John Harrison wrote:

    > I just didn't think that C++ was the best for him, I could easily be wrong
    > but I was just offering my opinion. Not sure why you took it so personally.



    I am not sure if you want to understand.



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 21, 2004
    #13
  14. "Ioannis Vranos" <> wrote in message
    news:1098356520.551872@athnrd02...
    > John Harrison wrote:
    >
    > > I just didn't think that C++ was the best for him, I could easily be

    wrong
    > > but I was just offering my opinion. Not sure why you took it so

    personally.
    >
    >
    > I am not sure if you want to understand.
    >


    Hmm, try me. I promise no hard feelings, I'm just interested.

    John
    John Harrison, Oct 21, 2004
    #14
  15. John Harrison wrote:

    >>I am not sure if you want to understand.
    >>

    >
    >
    > Hmm, try me. I promise no hard feelings, I'm just interested.



    Lets see. Tell me why VB and C#/CLI are better than C++ (C++/CLI or even
    "managed extensions")?



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 21, 2004
    #15
  16. Ari W.

    Phlip Guest

    Ioannis Vranos wrote:

    > Lets see. Tell me why VB and C#/CLI are better than C++ (C++/CLI or even
    > "managed extensions")?


    "They are _all_ better, because C++ sucks."

    Is that what you want to hear?

    No post should say that this or that is "better". Posts should say, "have
    you considered Brand X."

    We are not here to blindly promote C++. We are not marketeers for C++ Inc.

    We are here to help recover our industry from the horribly sucky state of
    its art. We do this by raising newbies' awareness of options. There is no
    reason not to promote other languages on this newsgroup. If they "win", then
    C++ wins too.

    --
    Phlip
    http://industrialxp.org/community/bin/view/Main/TestFirstUserInterfaces
    Phlip, Oct 21, 2004
    #16
  17. "Ioannis Vranos" <> wrote in message
    news:1098360539.328523@athnrd02...
    > John Harrison wrote:
    >
    > >>I am not sure if you want to understand.
    > >>

    > >
    > >
    > > Hmm, try me. I promise no hard feelings, I'm just interested.

    >
    >
    > Lets see. Tell me why VB and C#/CLI are better than C++ (C++/CLI or even
    > "managed extensions")?
    >


    I never claimed that they were, I don't think that they are. For myself I
    far prefer C++ to any other language mentioned in this thread. But I do
    think that a language that is good for one purpose or one person may not be
    so good for another purpose or another person. And this is for the
    completely banal reason that people and languages have different strengths
    and weaknesses.

    If this is just going to be a 'my language is better than your language'
    argument then I'm not interested. For a moment I thought you were going to
    take the discussion in a much more interesting direction.

    john
    John Harrison, Oct 21, 2004
    #17
  18. Phlip wrote:

    > "They are _all_ better, because C++ sucks."
    >
    > Is that what you want to hear?
    >
    > No post should say that this or that is "better". Posts should say, "have
    > you considered Brand X."
    >
    > We are not here to blindly promote C++. We are not marketeers for C++ Inc.
    >
    > We are here to help recover our industry from the horribly sucky state of
    > its art. We do this by raising newbies' awareness of options. There is no
    > reason not to promote other languages on this newsgroup. If they "win", then
    > C++ wins too.



    In any case, I asked him to support his assertion that VB and C#/CLI are
    better for newcomers. I guess you have no problem with that. :)



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 21, 2004
    #18
  19. Ari W.

    Phlip Guest

    Ioannis Vranos wrote:

    > In any case, I asked him to support his assertion that VB and C#/CLI are
    > better for newcomers. I guess you have no problem with that. :)


    For newbies and veterans alike, my permanent, professional opinion is:

    C# and VB both suck wet farts out of dead seagulls.

    But I'm not trolling!

    --
    Phlip
    http://industrialxp.org/community/bin/view/Main/TestFirstUserInterfaces
    Phlip, Oct 21, 2004
    #19
  20. John Harrison wrote:

    > I never claimed that they were, I don't think that they are. For myself I
    > far prefer C++ to any other language mentioned in this thread. But I do
    > think that a language that is good for one purpose or one person may not be
    > so good for another purpose or another person. And this is for the
    > completely banal reason that people and languages have different strengths
    > and weaknesses.
    >
    > If this is just going to be a 'my language is better than your language'
    > argument then I'm not interested. For a moment I thought you were going to
    > take the discussion in a much more interesting direction.



    I am talking about easiness for newcomers. VB and C#/CLI are CLI
    specific so they don't provide any more features than CLI provides.

    Actually C++/CLI provides more CLI features than these, like more
    generics features.


    What do you think of


    String s="Text";

    or String s("Text");


    that is System::String objects with stack semantics and deterministic
    destruction?



    Isn't it far easier for beginners than the rest CLI languages where the
    only option is using operator new?


    C++ can do both stack semantics and managed heap semantics.



    --
    Ioannis Vranos

    http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
    Ioannis Vranos, Oct 21, 2004
    #20
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