Drop down "menu" in html

[SpaceGirl]

have you read the article?
you can turn off javascript on your FF0.8+/Opera/Netscape browser, and
the menu will work perfectly. JavaScript is only there to help IE to
understand the DOM properly... that's all there is. So according to the
W3C specs this method does not take the use of JS.


bernhard

Yes I read the article, and it does not do what the OP asked.

It doesn't work. Try it. Disable JS and try get the drop down menus in
IE. Yes you get pretty menus, but they are no longer drop-down. They're
just regular menus. The OP asked for drop down menus in HTML. This is
not a solution for 95% of users. It cannot be done without JS

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x theSpaceGirl (miranda)

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[SpaceGirl]

but they form the basement of the solution
I know it's a pretty tough way, as it includes a lot of re-thinking: we
were all used to very complicated solutions: tables for layout, menus
with tables... and even forms as menus... a lot of JS coding. and
suddenly somebody comes and says: use lists as menus, because you can
tweak your lists into whatever you want, and a menu is... right a list!
now add a flavour of CSS2.0 to your list-soup and you will no longer
need your JavaScript...
(and you need 10 lines of javascript to make it work with IE


bernhard

The problem is the list menus DO NOT DO what the OP asked for. The OP
asked for an effect that ONLY works in a full CSS browser (IE isn't) or
via DHTML (which was one of the things the OP said he didn't want).

It might be an elegant solution... but it's an answer to the wrong
question

You CANNOT do drop down menus in IE WITHOUT javascript.

--


x theSpaceGirl (miranda)

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[SpaceGirl]

that's why there is a bunch of JavaScript to help IE to get it correct
and along the W3C specs. although it will work with switched off
JavaScript in terms of having accessibility to the content...

and to get it to



in my view it is. it's the far sophisticated solution I know to overcome
the lack of a drop-down menu.

But I guess the OP didn't say he wanted it to work in all



it works on all browsers, because it makes use of a list. it depends
what you mean with 'work'. If you claim 'pixel accuracy' as 'working',
then it will not work. But then you will have a big problem as a
webdesigner: to claim your site will be pixel accurate on all browser (I
prefer the term UA) is impossible, and you might have to sit back and
reflect a bit about what webdesign actually is.
As far as I understand webdesign accessing the content is 'working',
beause people demand for the content. So the proposed solution will
'work' decently on all modern browsers (even on Netscape 4.x as the
colapsed list will be displayed, and even on a Lynx text browser you can
access the full menu, without noticing anything weird...)

basic philosophical question: are we going to write XHTML according to
the specs or according to the browsers weirdness?
I have decided to write along the specs, because I don't know what sort
of browsers my viewers are going to use in the future.
And with the growing availabilty of FF we will see IE's distribution
drop... so no need to be afraid of the above method


bernhard

I'm not arguing that the ALA solution isn't a good one; it's one I've
used on a couple of sites. It's just that it doesn't do what the OP
asked for: a HTML solution. Your solution is only an HTML solution in
non-IE browsers, which means basically it ISN'T a solution. I was just
pointing out that the effect the OP wanted CANNOT be don without some
sort of JS cludge, or a fallback that doesn't actually produce drop down
menus.

My sites are writen to the XHTML spec and fully validate, and my sites
do use a fair amouunt of client side scripting (and a LOT of server side
scripting). Drop down menus are really easy in CSS, DHTML and Flash, but
none of these are things the OP wanted.

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x theSpaceGirl (miranda)

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[SpaceGirl]

yes.. I propsed the suckerfish method, and I use it on almost any site.
so I know how it works (I have even written some small add-ons to it)
but SpaceGirl was not happy with the solution as it doesn't 'work' on
'any' browser...

nevermind the confusion ;-)

bernhard

Just not happy cuz it wasn't a solution to the orignal question Can I
say it another ten times? I'm not bored yet! ppppp

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x theSpaceGirl (miranda)

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[paul]

I'm not arguing that the ALA solution isn't a good one; it's one I've
used on a couple of sites. It's just that it doesn't do what the OP
asked for: a HTML solution. Your solution is only an HTML solution in
non-IE browsers, which means basically it ISN'T a solution. I was just
pointing out that the effect the OP wanted CANNOT be don without some
sort of JS cludge, or a fallback that doesn't actually produce drop down
menus.

My sites are writen to the XHTML spec and fully validate, and my sites
do use a fair amouunt of client side scripting (and a LOT of server side
scripting). Drop down menus are really easy in CSS, DHTML and Flash, but
none of these are things the OP wanted.

But how many IE users have JS disabled? If they do because of company
policy they probably expect things to look a little wierd but they can
still see the links (although my test of this technique didn't even show
the links). If they are geeky enough to disable JS on their own, they
probably don't use IE.

 

[rf]

[HTML dropdown menus]

Just not happy cuz it wasn't a solution to the orignal question Can I
say it another ten times? I'm not bored yet! ppppp

But I am with having to scroll down through all the stuff you habbitually
fail to snip looking for your one or two line reply :-(

 

[mscir]

None of those are drop-down lists...

I should have read the OP, how about:

Collapsible Explorer navigation with pureDOMexplorer (pde)
http://www.onlinetools.org/tools/puredom/index.html#

hover cssmenu
http://www.xs4all.nl/~peterned/examples/cssmenu.html

 

[rf]

SpaceGirl wrote:

I should have read the OP, how about:

<sighs on SpaceGirls behalf/>

So you should have. The OP specified an HTML solution.

Collapsible Explorer navigation with pureDOMexplorer (pde)
http://www.onlinetools.org/tools/puredom/index.html#

Relies totally on javascript. With javascript disabled the menu is fully
open.

hover cssmenu
http://www.xs4all.nl/~peterned/examples/cssmenu.html

Relies on javascript to work in IE. Without javascript the "menu" is
unusable.

 

[Neal]

yes it's possible. even without javascript and server-side coding.
thanks to CSS you can do this.

He said HTML only.

 

[Neal]

Is it possible using only html to construct a drop down "menu" from
which one could choose html links to other web pages?

Correct answer: no.

 

[mscir]

<sighs on SpaceGirls behalf/>

So you should have. The OP specified an HTML solution.



Relies totally on javascript. With javascript disabled the menu is fully
open.

You're right, I missed the .js file when I looked at the source code.

Relies on javascript to work in IE. Without javascript the "menu" is
unusable.

Would you mind posting the javascript, I see CSS only.

 

[Spartanicus]

Is it possible using only html to construct a drop down "menu" from
which one could choose html links to other web pages?

Yes, although it may not be what you are looking for:

<link rel="next" href="about.html">

 

[rf]

Would you mind posting the javascript, I see CSS only.

body {
behavior:url("../htc/csshover.htc");
}

This property (behavior) is an IE specific that invokes DHTML (read
javascript) behaviors.

The actual javascript is in a .hta (Hypertext Application) another Microsoft
invention.

You can look at it here:
view-source:http://www.xs4all.nl/~peterned/htc/csshover.htc

Without javascript enabled .hta's do not run.

 

[mscir]

body {
behavior:url("../htc/csshover.htc");
}

This property (behavior) is an IE specific that invokes DHTML (read
javascript) behaviors.

The actual javascript is in a .hta (Hypertext Application) another Microsoft
invention.

You can look at it here:
view-source:http://www.xs4all.nl/~peterned/htc/csshover.htc

Without javascript enabled .hta's do not run.

Thanks, I never heard of them before, hopefully I won't ever have
occasion to use them.

Mike

 

[Barbara de Zoete]

Yes, although it may not be what you are looking for:

<link rel="next" href="about.html">

I don't understand. I can see the links as a menu in Opera (not drop down
though) and in FF something pops out of the lower righthand corner of the
browser chrome if those links are in the head of a page.

How are those next, previous, up, index et cetera links in the head of a
page going to be a real 'drop down' menu?


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[Spartanicus]

I don't understand. I can see the links as a menu in Opera (not drop down
though) and in FF something pops out of the lower righthand corner of the
browser chrome if those links are in the head of a page.

There were 3 requirements: html only, a menu that drops down, with links
to other web pages, does all that here.

I win.

 

[Bernhard Sturm]

The problem is the list menus DO NOT DO what the OP asked for. The OP
asked for an effect that ONLY works in a full CSS browser (IE isn't) or
via DHTML (which was one of the things the OP said he didn't want).

It might be an elegant solution... but it's an answer to the wrong
question

You CANNOT do drop down menus in IE WITHOUT javascript.

yes you are right, but OP asked for a dropdown menu for browsers.. he
never mentioned IE only
sorry to be so picky. I was only offering a solution for his problem: a
pure HTML dropdown menu for browsers. If IE users have switched off JS
they must have a good reason for this, and will get away with a half
working menu...


bernhard