how to: fast & easy updates??

Discussion in 'HTML' started by Leslie, Oct 15, 2003.

  1. Leslie

    Leslie Guest

    After years of treating their web site like a necessary evil a local
    (small town) radio station has decided to join the rest of the 21st
    century and use the web for marketing, etc. The current site has been
    ignored, basically, for a very long time.

    I created the site that's currently online, but I'm not at all proud
    of it. It looks like a real green-horn designed it and that's exactly
    what I was when I first built the site. Anyway....

    I've been asked to be involved in building the redesign that will
    include daily (or more often) updates of local news. Here's my
    problem, the new sales manager has talked to the 'guru' at their ISP
    and has been told that the best way to add frequent updates is to use
    FrontPage and import the info from a database, Excel or Access. The
    sales manager was also told that if the 'news' page will be built with
    FP then the entire site needs to be built with FP. True?????

    When I was told tonight about the 'necessity' of using FP I was
    tempted to back away from the entire project, but decided to give it
    some thought. I really know nothing about FP, other than I DON'T want
    to use it. After mulling it over a bit I've got a few questions:

    1. Would the code produced by importing info from a database
    (Excel/Access to FP) be specific to IE? If yes, what happens if
    viewed in any other browser?

    2. If FP was used to build the 'news' page why in the world would FP
    "have" to be used for the rest of the site?

    I was hit kind of cold with the FP info and my reply that it produces
    invalid code seemed to fall on deaf ears. What's my best argument,
    with people who know nothing about building web pages, about FP not
    producing cross-browser compatible code?

    I honestly can't see how typing info into a database would be any
    easier than typing info into a web page that's basically a template,
    deleting yesterday's text with today's and then uploading it. Maybe
    I'll think of something as I drift off to sleep tonight, but any
    comments and/or suggestions from the readers of this ng would be very
    much appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Leslie
    Leslie, Oct 15, 2003
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Leslie

    brucie Guest

    In post <>
    Leslie said...

    > When I was told tonight about the 'necessity' of using FP I was
    > tempted to back away from the entire project,


    a very good idea! i highly recommend it.

    > but decided to give it some thought.


    theres nothing to think about. you haven't even started and already
    you're having to deal with "but my friend said..." syndrome. if their
    friend is so [rude word] good, let them do it.

    > I honestly can't see how typing info into a database would be any
    > easier than typing info into a web page that's basically a template,
    > deleting yesterday's text with today's and then uploading it.


    i believe a db would be better. what if someone wants to read a story
    from a week ago or just yesterday? if the news person that writes the
    story sticks it into a db you can suck it back out and manipulate it
    however you want.

    --
    brucie.
    15/October/2003 11:22:37 am
    brucie, Oct 15, 2003
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Leslie

    Leslie Guest

    On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 11:52:41 +1000, brucie <>
    wrote:

    >In post <>
    >Leslie said...
    >
    >> When I was told tonight about the 'necessity' of using FP I was
    >> tempted to back away from the entire project,

    >
    >a very good idea! i highly recommend it.
    >
    >> but decided to give it some thought.

    >
    >theres nothing to think about. you haven't even started and already
    >you're having to deal with "but my friend said..." syndrome. if their
    >friend is so [rude word] good, let them do it.


    No, we haven't started yet, but that's the point. The guys at the
    radio station are exploring their options, and this other guy is a
    well respected computer geek who just happens to have his head up his
    butt when it comes to web page creation. (You want a top of the line,
    state of the art network built? He's your guy. You have software
    conflicts you need fixed yesterday? He's your guy. You need a web
    site created? He's NOT your guy.)

    My concern is convincing the radio people that just because Mr. Guru
    can build a wizz-bang computer from a box of tooth picks *doesn't*
    mean he knows how to build a web site that will validate.

    I really don't want to lose the opportunity to be part of their 'new'
    site. Down the road it will mean some extra cash in my pocket, but
    most important, it will be a needed addition to my very slowly growing
    portfolio of web sites. To be part of what looks to be a high profile
    site in this little midwestern USA town is no small feat.

    >> I honestly can't see how typing info into a database would be any
    >> easier than typing info into a web page that's basically a template,
    >> deleting yesterday's text with today's and then uploading it.

    >
    >i believe a db would be better. what if someone wants to read a story
    >from a week ago or just yesterday? if the news person that writes the
    >story sticks it into a db you can suck it back out and manipulate it
    >however you want.


    At this point I know nothing about incorporating a db into a web page,
    but I'd like to learn. Can you point me to a tutorial or site that
    will give me help - help that doesn't include using FP? I need enough
    info so that at our next meeting my contribution is more persuasive
    than "FrontPage sucks."

    Thank you!!

    Leslie

    There's nothing to the statement that "It's all FP or nothing." is
    there??
    Leslie, Oct 15, 2003
    #3
  4. Leslie wrote:

    > At this point I know nothing about incorporating a db into a web page,
    > but I'd like to learn. Can you point me to a tutorial or site that
    > will give me help - help that doesn't include using FP?


    Look into Linux-Apache-MySQL/PostgreSQL-Perl/PHP combinations. They are
    much cheaper and more flexible as a server platform. They should also
    handle all your database needs.

    --
    Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
    Contact Me - http://www.goddamn.co.uk/tobyink/?id=132
    Toby A Inkster, Oct 15, 2003
    #4
  5. Leslie

    brucie Guest

    In post <>
    Leslie said...

    > At this point I know nothing about incorporating a db into a web page,


    its very easy

    > but I'd like to learn.


    1. PHP for the World Wide Web Visual Quickstart Guide
    2. PHP Advanced for the World Wide Web: Visual QuickPro Guide
    3. MySQL: Visual QuickStart Guide
    4. PHP and MySQL for Dynamic Web Sites: Visual QuickPro Guide

    all by larry ullman from peachpit press. http://www.peachpit.com/

    Build Your Own Database Driven Website Using PHP & MySQL
    http://www.sitepoint.com/books/phpmysql1/

    > I need enough info so that at our next meeting my contribution is more
    > persuasive than "FrontPage sucks."


    its easier to answer why frontpage doesn't suck. it allows people who
    due to various reasons have no clue to easily throw something together
    so they can add their voice to the internet, to add their little bit
    to its wealth. this is a good thing, everyone regardless of ability
    *must* be able to make a contribution if they wish. if FP allows them
    to do it then any other problems FP may have or cause simply don't
    matter.

    but that doesn't change the fact that FP is simply Bad Evil Shit[tm].

    --
    brucie.
    15/October/2003 04:47:09 pm
    brucie, Oct 15, 2003
    #5
  6. Leslie

    Al Guest

    Hi:

    The only people who seem to like FP are people who can't code in HTML. Maybe
    the "guru" only knows how to use FP. NO you don't need FP to use a database.
    You don't even need a database server (MYSQL, SQL, etc.) to make a database
    driven web site. Databases made with Perl work fine for low traffic sites
    like you are talking about. Before someone says that databases made with
    Perl are flat; there are relational Perl databases as well.
    The reason they want a database driven web site is because they are easy to
    update if made right. You just fill in a form with text click a button and
    your HTML is updated. No HTML (or FP) code is needed to be changed. The same
    goes for adding photos. Also as one person said, a visitor can look up old
    information using dates, keywords etc. when you have a database. If you need
    to hire someone to take you HTML pages and make them database driven drop me
    an e-mail at: put "database driven" in the subject
    line.

    Al

    "Leslie" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > After years of treating their web site like a necessary evil a local
    > (small town) radio station has decided to join the rest of the 21st
    > century and use the web for marketing, etc. The current site has been
    > ignored, basically, for a very long time.
    >
    > I created the site that's currently online, but I'm not at all proud
    > of it. It looks like a real green-horn designed it and that's exactly
    > what I was when I first built the site. Anyway....
    >
    > I've been asked to be involved in building the redesign that will
    > include daily (or more often) updates of local news. Here's my
    > problem, the new sales manager has talked to the 'guru' at their ISP
    > and has been told that the best way to add frequent updates is to use
    > FrontPage and import the info from a database, Excel or Access. The
    > sales manager was also told that if the 'news' page will be built with
    > FP then the entire site needs to be built with FP. True?????
    >
    > When I was told tonight about the 'necessity' of using FP I was
    > tempted to back away from the entire project, but decided to give it
    > some thought. I really know nothing about FP, other than I DON'T want
    > to use it. After mulling it over a bit I've got a few questions:
    >
    > 1. Would the code produced by importing info from a database
    > (Excel/Access to FP) be specific to IE? If yes, what happens if
    > viewed in any other browser?
    >
    > 2. If FP was used to build the 'news' page why in the world would FP
    > "have" to be used for the rest of the site?
    >
    > I was hit kind of cold with the FP info and my reply that it produces
    > invalid code seemed to fall on deaf ears. What's my best argument,
    > with people who know nothing about building web pages, about FP not
    > producing cross-browser compatible code?
    >
    > I honestly can't see how typing info into a database would be any
    > easier than typing info into a web page that's basically a template,
    > deleting yesterday's text with today's and then uploading it. Maybe
    > I'll think of something as I drift off to sleep tonight, but any
    > comments and/or suggestions from the readers of this ng would be very
    > much appreciated.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > Leslie
    Al, Oct 15, 2003
    #6
  7. Leslie wrote:
    > I was hit kind of cold with the FP info and my reply that it produces
    > invalid code seemed to fall on deaf ears. What's my best argument,
    > with people who know nothing about building web pages, about FP not
    > producing cross-browser compatible code?


    Hmm. Frontpage is quite horrible from a professional point of view, but
    nevertheless it's very efficient for non-coders that want to build a
    website. However, your client doesn't want to build a site. He simply
    wants to *maintain* one or two pages on the site that *you* built for
    him. That's a big difference. You build the site with your tools, and
    then provide them with a newbie-friendly tool for maintenance.

    In my experience Macromedia Contribute is quite good for small sites.
    But if they really just want to add news to the news page, even
    Contribute is overkill; all they need is one single form and a bit of
    server-side processing to update that News page - a tiny mini CMS
    application.


    > I honestly can't see how typing info into a database would be any
    > easier than typing info into a web page that's basically a template,
    > deleting yesterday's text with today's and then uploading it. Maybe
    > I'll think of something as I drift off to sleep tonight, but any
    > comments and/or suggestions from the readers of this ng would be very
    > much appreciated.


    It depends on the content. If it's simple text content that will always
    have the same structure, as news usually have, then filling out a form
    is both faster and easier for the author, because he doesn't have to
    think about formatting. If you dont' want to write such a mini-CMS
    yourself, you could check out the available blog software, or get one of
    the scripts available at e.g. hotscripts.com.


    Matthias
    Matthias Gutfeldt, Oct 15, 2003
    #7
  8. Leslie

    Adrienne Guest

    Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Leslie <>
    writing in news::

    > At this point I know nothing about incorporating a db into a web page,
    > but I'd like to learn. Can you point me to a tutorial or site that
    > will give me help - help that doesn't include using FP? I need enough
    > info so that at our next meeting my contribution is more persuasive
    > than "FrontPage sucks."
    >
    > Thank you!!
    >


    Since they are advocating FP, it may be running on a Windows box, in which
    case, you would have access to ASP, MS Access and (if you're lucky) MS-
    SQL.

    There are some good beginner tutorials at http://www.w3schools (Learn ASP
    and Learn SQL) and you should also look into http://www.asp-help.com .

    Not that I use it, but if you really want to scare them, tell them you
    require MS Interdev (FrontPage's bigger, badder, expensive, server side
    brother).

    --
    Adrienne Boswell
    Please respond to the group so others can share
    http://www.arbpen.com
    Adrienne, Oct 15, 2003
    #8
  9. Leslie

    Leslie Guest

    On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 01:04:24 GMT, Leslie <>
    wrote:

    >I honestly can't see how typing info into a database would be any
    >easier than typing info into a web page that's basically a template,
    >deleting yesterday's text with today's and then uploading it. Maybe
    >I'll think of something as I drift off to sleep tonight, but any
    >comments and/or suggestions from the readers of this ng would be very
    >much appreciated.
    >
    >Thanks,
    >
    >Leslie



    A big "thank you" to everyone who took the time to offer help and
    suggestions. I've got a lot to learn and right now my head is
    swimming, but I'll get there.

    One bit of really good news today.... had a meeting with my biggest
    client - not the radio station. I was presented with a project that
    will take months to complete - yippee!! income security!! I'm going
    to create a new section of the web site and post hundreds of pages
    I'll convert from Word docs to Adobe .pdf files. The printed Word
    docs currently fill four 3" ring binders. I'm happy!

    Thanks again for the help, no doubt I'll be back in the future with
    more questions.

    Leslie
    Leslie, Oct 16, 2003
    #9
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. Replies:
    0
    Views:
    643
  2. Michele Simionato

    Python is darn fast (was: How fast is Python)

    Michele Simionato, Aug 23, 2003, in forum: Python
    Replies:
    13
    Views:
    546
  3. Ben
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    238
  4. Juha Nieminen
    Replies:
    22
    Views:
    987
    Kai-Uwe Bux
    Oct 12, 2007
  5. Replies:
    10
    Views:
    1,269
    Sebastian \lunar\ Wiesner
    Jun 23, 2008
Loading...

Share This Page