html/css compliant

[Nik Coughin]

No honey, you misread my post. I said exactly what I meant I'm
also a programmer...

Yeah I misread it badly. And then accused you of the same ::*hangs head in
shame*::.

 

[derek giroulle]

:: site is entirely my own (development) and its hosting is on my
:: private budget.

Someone here guided me to http://www/hostingforabuck.com .It seems to have
all the bells & whistles and it really is $1/mo. Only upgrades are for more
space or more e-mails. You might want to check it out.

Thanks for the tip, however the cost of payments between US and europe
are prohibitive for this exercise.
I have been looking at similar hosting solutions in Europe their basic
offer might be around 5€ (just over 5$) but when you ask for php or the
like price rocket sky high

Derek

 

[Els]

Thanks for the tip, however the cost of payments between US
and europe are prohibitive for this exercise.

I use Paypal, doesn't cost me a cent more than the hosting I'm
paying for. And afaik hostingforabuck does Paypal too.

 

[derek giroulle]

This alone calls for server-side scripting. I'm afraid there are no
alternatives.

I don't agree with this comment

With much fuss, you could make it work half-reliably. And even if it did
work, it would be worse for spiders than frames, so it's definitely a very
bad idea to involve JS.

Thus far I have already made a the basic envelope using a Glish.com
template for a 3 collumn ( and banner) css positioning page
I dropped the footer and included it with the banner

current status of the project can be seen at
http://users.skynet.be/derex/_test/NL_frame.htm

as you can see I filled the right hand collum with the Object tag
This allows me to import html files from elsewhere in the site and
maintain only 1 file as i go along

the main screen is an I-frame that resizes itself to the size of the
imported information file

This is a language specific "main-page"

before this will sit the main menu screen that allows the user to select
his preferred language

what I still need to accomplish is :
how to make a link (I'm thinking in terms of a command button with an
onclick behaviour) in the left-side box that when clicked renders the
middle box and


the spidering problem is solved by a special page that will have a
hidden link to an HTML language specific site map
users can call that page from the menu and find that way th page they
are looking for


any tips or links to useful dhtml scripts examples would be welcome

derek

 

[Mitja]

I don't agree with this comment

Yep, it's an overstatement. But see below.

Thus far I have already made a the basic envelope using a Glish.com
template for a 3 collumn ( and banner) css positioning page
I dropped the footer and included it with the banner

current status of the project can be seen at
http://users.skynet.be/derex/_test/NL_frame.htm

1) Doesn't work in Opera (no content)
2) Doesn't work with Firefox (seems OK at first, but can't scroll past
Article 29)
3) Works in IE
I only tested in newest versions (IE6, FFox 0.9, Opera 7.51). If you drag
out something older, chances are it will be worse.

As I said: it is doable, and you proved it (sort of - we were talking of
including files with content like navigation menus from within content
pages, not the other way round). However, it would have worked more reliably
with frames. By using iframes, you gained nothing.

And if 650+ lines of JS don't represent "much fuss" to you - well, I'm
afraid of/for you

 

[derek giroulle]

1) Doesn't work in Opera (no content)

Ok saw that too - now from a local disk it renders correctly, put up on
the net it fails - that was the longest file in the website, so I was
thinking of splitting it up anyway

2) Doesn't work with Firefox (seems OK at first, but can't scroll past
Article 29)

see previous remark

3) Works in IE
I only tested in newest versions (IE6, FFox 0.9, Opera 7.51). If you drag
out something older, chances are it will be worse.

I use opera 7.11, Netcaptor(= IE), and IE 5.5, 6.x, Netscape 7.1 to test

As I said: it is doable, and you proved it (sort of - we were talking of
including files with content like navigation menus from within content
pages, not the other way round). However, it would have worked more reliably
with frames. By using iframes, you gained nothing.

Yes I know I got the rest already working that was about 2 days work

And if 650+ lines of JS don't represent "much fuss" to you - well, I'm
afraid of/for you

OK 650 lines of JS code most of it was cut and paste from ready made
templates or examples or generated by Coffeecup most of it is teh
language menu over the top
there isn't realy much fuss about that because only little modification
was required.
however I'm going to change the way the central information box works
rather than adapt it to the size of the content I was thinking of
maiking it a scrollable I-frame

 

[derek giroulle]

Mitja wrote

I use opera 7.11, Netcaptor(= IE), and IE 5.5, 6.x, Netscape 7.1 to test

I have firefox and mozzilla available for testing and i saw what you
said too

with my testing battery that I cover more then 95% of my visitors
0ver 68% use 1024*760 screens-resolutions or better, and I ave a old PC
beside me so with 800*640 I cover over 95% of my users

So if I can get it to work for those environments I'm pretty well served
for a project nearly 2 weeks old

derek

 

[Toby A Inkster]

I use opera 7.11, Netcaptor(= IE), and IE 5.5, 6.x, Netscape 7.1 to test
I have firefox and mozzilla available for testing and i saw what you
said too
with my testing battery that I cover more then 95% of my visitors

Think that's impressive? I've got:

Browser Platform
---------------------------------------------
Amaya (GTK) 7.0 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Cello 1.01a Windows NT 4 SP 6
Dillo 0.8.0pre Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
ELinks 0.9.1 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Epiphany 1.0.7 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Galeon 1.3.12 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
HotJava 3.0 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Internet Explorer 2.0 Windows NT 4 SP 1
Internet Explorer 3.02 Windows NT 4 SP 1
Internet Explorer 4.01 Windows NT 4 SP 3
Internet Explorer 5.01 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Internet Explorer 5.5 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Internet Explorer 6.0 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Konqueror 3.1.4 Linux (Mandrake 9.2)
Links 2.1pre13 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Lynx 2.8.5 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Mosaic 0.6 Beta Windows NT 4 SP 6
Mosaic 1.0 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Mosaic 2.1.1 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Mosaic 3.0 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Mozilla 1.0.2 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Mozilla 1.4 Linux (Mandrake 9.2)
Mozilla 1.6 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Mozilla Firebird 0.6.1 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Mozilla Firefox 0.8 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Nautilus 2.4.2 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Netscape 1.1 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Netscape 2.02 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Netscape 3.04 Gold Windows NT 4 SP 6
Netscape 4.8 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
Netscape 4.8 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Netscape 6.23 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Netscape 7.1 Windows NT 4 SP 6
OffByOne 3.4.a Windows NT 4 SP 6
Opera 2.12 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Opera 3.62 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Opera 5.12 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Opera 6.06 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Opera 7.03 Windows NT 4 SP 6
Opera 7.23 Linux (Mandrake 9.2)
Opera 7.5 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
UdiWWW 1.2.000 Windows NT 4 SP 6
w3m 0.4.2 Linux (Mandrake 10.0)
WebTV Viewer 2.8 Windows NT 4 SP 6

I also have Multiwebs but it crashes all the time. And I have the source
code for Arena (the fore-runner to Amaya), but can't get it to compile.

 

[Whitecrest]

Think that's impressive? I've got:
Browser Platform
---------------------------------------------

<snip>

I would never hire someone that wasted their time testing on all those
browsers. YMMV

 

[Mark Parnell]

I would never hire someone that wasted their time testing on all those
browsers. YMMV

He never said that he does actually test on them, just that he has them.

 

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

Quoth the raven derek giroulle:

0ver 68% use 1024*760 screens-resolutions or better,

But you have no idea how wide (narrow) their browser windows are. Mine
is almost never wider than about 800px on my 1024 resolution. Screen
resolution is totally irrelevant. Why do you want me to scroll
horizontally to see your content?

http://www.allmyfaqs.com/faq.pl?AnySizeDesign

 

[Whitecrest]

He never said that he does actually test on them, just that he has them.

I did not mean to imply that he did. (I thought of that after I sent the
post)

 

[Whitecrest]

But you have no idea how wide (narrow) their browser windows are. Mine
is almost never wider than about 800px on my 1024 resolution. Screen
resolution is totally irrelevant. Why do you want me to scroll
horizontally to see your content?
http://www.allmyfaqs.com/faq.pl?AnySizeDesign

Not disagreeing with you, but I have found that "any size" design really
means fall apart at a smaller width. I have seen very few (if any)
pages that don't fall apart when you shrink them. Typically they fall
apart at around 800px, good ones around 300px. but they all fall apart.

 

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

Quoth the raven Whitecrest:

Not disagreeing with you, but I have found that "any size" design
really means fall apart at a smaller width. I have seen very few
(if any) pages that don't fall apart when you shrink them.
Typically they fall apart at around 800px, good ones around 300px.
but they all fall apart.

You'd rather have scrollbars? ;-)

Personally, I'd prefer to see anysizedesign sites work down to about
at least 500px wide. Below that, it is a crapshoot...

 

[Toby A Inkster]

He never said that he does actually test on them, just that he has them.

My standard tests are IE 5, 5.5 and 6, Mozilla 1.4, Opera 7.5, Netscape
4.8, Konqueror 3.1 and Lynx 2.8.5, though I use the others to test
particular features from time to time if I think they'll cause problems.
For example, if I'm using some Javascript that requires the page to
reflow, I'll check in Opera 6 (that can't reflow) that it doesn't bodge up
too badly.

 

[SpaceGirl]

<snip>

I would never hire someone that wasted their time testing on all those
browsers. YMMV

Me either. Pointlessly over the top! Write valid code, test against the 'big
4' and be done with it. Everything else just hurts your pocket.

 

[SpaceGirl]

You'd rather have scrollbars? ;-)

Personally, I'd prefer to see anysizedesign sites work down to about
at least 500px wide. Below that, it is a crapshoot...

Isn't the entire point to make sure it works on any device? Surely your
sites should work perfectly on a 160x200 display (like one of my web enabled
cellphones!)

 

[Whitecrest]

You'd rather have scrollbars? ;-)
Personally, I'd prefer to see anysizedesign sites work down to about
at least 500px wide. Below that, it is a crapshoot...

500px wide would be a good compromise.

 

[Whitecrest]

Me either. Pointlessly over the top! Write valid code, test against the 'big
4' and be done with it. Everything else just hurts your pocket.

Marry me

 

[derek giroulle]

Quoth the raven derek giroulle:


Why do you want me to scroll horizontally to see your content?

Ididn't say that

I said

"so with 800*640 I cover over 95% of my users
So if I can get it to work for those environments"

I try to cater size independant and I make my designs liquid so that it
will fit any size and I test for designs that fit 800*640 as a minimum
and 1024 *760 as its optimum



derek