Introducing Kids to Programming: 2 or 3?

Discussion in 'Python' started by Marco Gallotta, Sep 27, 2010.

  1. Hi there

    I'm sure you get a lot of "2 or 3" questions, but here's another.
    Umonya [1] uses Python to introduce school kids to programming. The
    initiative is only 15 months old and up till now we've been using
    existing notes and exercises and thus Python 2. But we're at the stage
    where we can either stick with 2 for the next few years, or go to 3
    now.

    We received a grant from Google to reach 1,000 kids in South Africa
    with our course in 2011. People have also shown interest in running
    the course in Croatia, Poland and Egypt. We're also eyeing developing
    African countries in the long-term. As such, we're taking the time now
    to write our very own specialised course notes and exercises, and we
    this is why we need to decide *now* which path to take: 2 or 3? As we
    will be translating the notes we'll probably stick with out choice for
    the next few years.

    Since these are kids, we feel the nice changes in 3 such as removing
    integer division will help in teaching. It will also remove confusion
    when they go to download Python and grab the latest version. Since
    they're just starting, chances are almost none will be hit by the
    limited library support for at least a year or two. They will,
    however, be hit by the confusion of seeing Python 2 code all over the
    web.

    We're tending towards 3, but I am a little cautious myself.

    Marco

    [1] http://umonya.co.za

    --
    Marco Gallotta
    MSc Student
    Department of Computer Science, University of Cape Town
    people.cs.uct.ac.za/~mgallott | marco-za.blogspot.com
    marco AT gallotta DOT co DOT za | 073 170 4444 | 021 552 2731
     
    Marco Gallotta, Sep 27, 2010
    #1
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  2. On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 17:48:06 +0200 Marco Gallotta
    <> wrote:

    > Since these are kids, we feel the nice changes in 3 such as removing
    > integer division will help in teaching. It will also remove confusion
    > when they go to download Python and grab the latest version. Since
    > they're just starting, chances are almost none will be hit by the
    > limited library support for at least a year or two.


    That's your answer right there.


    > They will, however, be hit by the confusion of seeing Python 2 code
    > all over the web.


    Good point. Here is may suggestion: Make the kids aware of the 2/3
    issue as early as possible, but don't go into detail. Maybe start with
    the obligatory "Hello world" program, and a few other simple things.
    Then, when you get to the "how do help myself on the net" part of the
    course (you're including that, right?), you make strong distinction
    between Py2 and Py3 and tell them to make absolutely certain that it's
    Python 3 code they're looking at. Maybe give the "print()" syntax as a
    hint, but have them rely on more explicit descriptions that come with
    the code. Later on (once they know more programming constructs to
    appreciate the differences), include another lecture, specifically on
    the difference between Python 2 and Python 3.

    Disclaimer: I'm not an educator. Maybe this is horrible advice. Someone
    with a better understanding of kids' and learner's minds please debunk
    any nonsense I may have spouted here. I just like to go by the general
    rule that, unlike adults, most kids aren't idiots.

    /W

    --
    INVALID? DE!
     
    Andreas Waldenburger, Sep 27, 2010
    #2
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  3. Marco Gallotta

    Aahz Guest

    [posted & e-mailed]

    [chiming in late]

    In article <>,
    Marco Gallotta <> wrote:
    >
    >I'm sure you get a lot of "2 or 3" questions, but here's another.
    >Umonya [1] uses Python to introduce school kids to programming. The
    >initiative is only 15 months old and up till now we've been using
    >existing notes and exercises and thus Python 2. But we're at the stage
    >where we can either stick with 2 for the next few years, or go to 3
    >now.
    >
    >We received a grant from Google to reach 1,000 kids in South Africa
    >with our course in 2011. People have also shown interest in running
    >the course in Croatia, Poland and Egypt. We're also eyeing developing
    >African countries in the long-term. As such, we're taking the time now
    >to write our very own specialised course notes and exercises, and we
    >this is why we need to decide *now* which path to take: 2 or 3? As we
    >will be translating the notes we'll probably stick with out choice for
    >the next few years.


    One reason not otherwise mentioned is that overall Unicode support is
    better in Python 3, and given your international audience, that's a
    strong point in favor of Python 3.
    --
    Aahz () <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/

    "If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait
    until you hire an amateur." --Red Adair
     
    Aahz, Oct 26, 2010
    #3
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